Visit to Clarisys Auditoriums + CH Precision System in Spokane, Washington

[DasguteOhr]

last time any measurements were done for my room (except the phone app FR pic a couple years ago) was now 10 years ago from my speaker designer. not anything i worry about.

i use the term neutral based on my approach, and feedback from visitors. they find my room has good tone, never any 'dry' comments, yet also full range and lively. extended in the highs, and full extended bottom octaves. no overhang in the bass. neutral. lots of headroom in amplification so never stressed.

hard to answer.........but if you have the time...........remember you asked.

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/almost-free-and-4-inches-the-final-1.17389/

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/almost-free-and-4-inches-the-final-1.17389/page-3#post-314941

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/suck-out-fixed-i-think.18116/

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/suck-out-fixed-i-think.18116/page-2#post-329496

Ok thanks i will read that thread. Back then they measured octahedron speaker and microphone my last question like that or your speakers with pink noise sweep?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Ok thanks i will read that thread. Back then they measured octahedron speaker and microphone my last question like that or your speakers with pink noise?

if you are asking whether my speakers were measured with pink noise? the answer is yes, that is what my speaker designer used in 2014.

then last year i did use pink noise from a streaming file to measure the frequency response of my room with a phone app.

 

[DasguteOhr]

if you are asking whether my speakers were measured with pink noise? the answer is yes, that is what my speaker designer used in 2014.

then 2 years ago i did use pink noise from a streaming file to measure the frequency response of my room with a phone app and posted it here on a thread Ron started.

No, there are 3 ways to measure room acoustics(rerverb time).
1. via your own speaker + microphone.
2. octahedron speaker +microphone (most accurate because it stimulates the room in all directions).
3.mobile phone app tone generator +microphone.
If the reverberation time is not within a certain range, it will be difficult to get a good sound. my opinion.
If optimized correctly, a cheap hifi system will always beat the much more expensive one

 

[Mike Lavigne]

No, there are 3 ways to measure room acoustics(rerverb time).
1. via your own speaker + microphone.
2. octahedron speaker +microphone (most accurate because it stimulates the room in all directions).
3.mobile phone app tone generator +microphone.
If the reverberation time is not within a certain range, it will be difficult to get a good sound. my opinion.
If optimized correctly, a cheap hifi system will always beat the much more expensive one

not done it, happy with things as they are. if something was missing maybe I would chase some data. but it's not.

I respect that some lean on data.

 

[Elliot G.]

How can girl with guitar playing in a small club make you think that she is playing for you in your listening room that does not sound anything like a small club?

Back in the day when I would discuss this topic with my mentor we liked to talk about the time machine factor. I don't feel that a system ever brings the performers into your room but I do think its possible for the system to transport you ( in your mind of course) to where the recording is made. The system when performing well can recreate these cues ( if they are there) and make you feel that you are in a different space. I do like live recordings when done well as they have this feeling. It can be a small club or hall or Carnegie or Red Rocks etc. I dont think having the player in my room is ever a goal I look for or even attempt to create, as this could never be correct since they were never there to begin with.
To create something that truly can sound "real" I weould think that one would try to do it with something that was actually real to begin with.
These are my goals maybe they are not the others on this thread or forum and if they aren't then I can see why I would never agree with them or perhaps not like their systems. THis is not a function of quality per se but rather a varied and different setof goals .
Different goals surely bring different results.

 

[DasguteOhr]

not done it, happy with things as they are. if something was missing maybe I would chase some data. but it's not.

I respect that some lean on data.

That the important thing in life ,are you happy with end final result. I just wanted to express that if the room acoustics (reverb time without big valleys and peaks) are right, any speaker with a reasonably straight frequency response will sound extremely good. Have fun and a nice day

 

[Audiohertz2]

No, there are 3 ways to measure room acoustics(rerverb time).
1. via your own speaker + microphone.
2. octahedron speaker +microphone (most accurate because it stimulates the room in all directions).
3.mobile phone app tone generator +microphone.
If the reverberation time is not within a certain range, it will be difficult to get a good sound. my opinion.
If optimized correctly, a cheap hifi system will always beat the much more expensive one

Are you talking RT60 numbers ..?

 

[DasguteOhr]

Are you talking RT60 numbers ..?

Yes. the rt 60 measurement. how long it takes for the test tone to fall to level -60db in your room= reverberation time.

 

[tima]

If the recording is an intimate one then the "They are here" perspective is appropriate. If it is a recording in a large space, like a cathedral, then your room should become somewhat like a cathedral (i.e. You are there). Ideally, it should be the perspective of the recording itself; however, there will always be some overlay of your own acoustic space on the reproduced one off the recording.

A good one for space in a cathedral is Jan Garbarek with the Hilliard Ensemble "Officium" . It was recorded in an Austrian Monastery.
...
Your room should largely disappear and sound like a cathedral with this recording.

I once heard Schubert's string quintet (double cellos) in a home in London...very much "They are here" perspective. The recording of Mozart string quartets by the Alban Berg Quartett on Telefunken are pretty "They are here" recorded, meaning not much ambiance on the recordings and the sound is quite direct.

Yes, listening to music recorded in a cathedral or a large church, the perspective I hear reflects being in the place of the recording. Back when I had a digital player I remember using in a review the English Concert and Choir in London’s ancient Temple Church performing Heinrich Biber’s "Missa Christi Resurgentis" (SACD [Harmonia Mundi HMU 807397]). Sound reflecting off the stone work in space with a 36ft ceiling was quite obvious, but it wasn't happening in my room, it happened in the church.



I can appreciate a performance live in a living room sounding "they are here" -- presumably because the musicians were in front of you. It would be odd if it did not.

Wrt to low ambiance direct recordings, imo the perspective of the listener is his own product. The Sandor Vegh Quartet playing Beethoven's final quartets (Valois – cmb 83) is such a recording. Four string players arrayed in a line. You can hear it either way -- they are in your room in front of you or you are in their room. I don't know if the perspective is intentional. For me it just happens. If I point the speakers at my shoulders and sit near field I have the intimate perspective but that does not mean my mind perceives they are in my room.

 

[Tiltedfault]

I never really saw the difference between the you are there and the they are here perspectives, though I know what most mean by it. To me it’s more of a mental phenomenon related to suspension of disbelief.

If a system captures a good recordings venue information and ambience, then it doesn’t matter to me whether it’s closely miked in or is in a voluminous cathedral with a more distant perspective in that if the music is convincingly portrayed, I am there at the venue, but the musicians are in the room with me (at least my mental room).

I think Sven Boenicke once said something to the effect that the most convincing reproduction would occur when the listeners room matches the acoustic of the recording venue. I don’t know if this is true or not, but it seems very plausible to me.

 

[morricab]

I never really saw the difference between the you are there and the they are here perspectives, though I know what most mean by it. To me it’s more of a mental phenomenon related to suspension of disbelief.

If a system captures a good recordings venue information and ambience, then it doesn’t matter to me whether it’s closely miked in or is in a voluminous cathedral with a more distant perspective in that if the music is convincingly portrayed, I am there at the venue, but the musicians are in the room with me (at least my mental room).

I think Sven Boenicke once said something to the effect that the most convincing reproduction would occur when the listeners room matches the acoustic of the recording venue. I don’t know if this is true or not, but it seems very plausible to me.

It has a lot to do with how the recording projects sound into your room. An up close recording with little recorded ambience will often project into the room both in front and behind the speakers. This gives a distinct 'They are here" perspective...especially if you are familiar with live performance in an intimate space...like a living room or parlor. A recording that is made with a distinct amount of recorded ambience will often have a more distant perspective and if your system/room is capable there will be a strong feeling of being in the space that was recorded...the "you are there" perspective. Not many systems can really do both equally well... as many are predisposed to one perspective or the other.

 

[bonzo75]

I never really saw the difference between the you are there and the they are here perspectives, though I know what most mean by it. To me it’s more of a mental phenomenon related to suspension of disbelief.

It is more of if you are hearing only the system repeatedly or more of the recording. If you are hearing more of the recording changes it will change from you are there vs they are here. For that you need good recordings and a system that gets out of the way. Those who can't relate usually haven't experienced good recordings and good systems, in which case they try to colour to a preference like an intimate cuddly sound. This usually works better with digital and bad recordings.

 

[bonzo75]

As Frank Caliendo imitating Clinton said, Here is just There without a T (at around 28s)

 

[thedudeabides]

I think Sven Boenicke once said something to the effect that the most convincing reproduction would occur when the listeners room matches the acoustic of the recording venue. I don’t know if this is true or not, but it seems very plausible to meme.I think

I think I agree. When I had my previous systems and listened one on one, my goal was to always be to replicate, to the extent possible, the ambience of the recording venu.