Vinyl rips
- Thread starter bonzo75
- Start date
Surprisingly close to the point of undetectability once knowledge s removed and even with knowledge of the rips... Many have been fooled by vinyl rips. Michael Fremer himself commented how close they were and so did our own Bruce B. I started such a project a couple of years ago even purchased a Korg MR2000 and started learning Audacity
.. This is a lot of work, not for the faint of heart.... I have put it on the backburner for now ... Some people here have done it amongst them Astrotoy who embarked in a fabulous project to rip his LP collection... It is documented somewhere in WBF and I hope he (A'toy) chimes in.
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
The only way I'd undertake a task today is with the finest equipment available.... mainly TT/ARM/CART. I've found out over the years that the higher end TT combos are much quieter in the area of surface noise, ticks/pops and such. You can get away with using a less expensive A/D converter like the Korg or Tascam. Seems these things get exacerbated when going through an A/D conversion. On a less expensive TT, you can easily discern that it is a vinyl rip, but on a higher end rig, if there are not any noticeable noise, you'd swear you were listening to tape!
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This may come off as heresy but I have a setup where my rips are better then listening directly.
I use a Channel D seta l phono amp (which can output "flat"/no RIAA) and I find the software RIAA filter simply kills the hardware. (which IMO is still very good!)
Also, if there are significant "issues" baked into the press or recording you can usually address them in the digital domain in a nearly transparent manner.
I use a Channel D seta l phono amp (which can output "flat"/no RIAA) and I find the software RIAA filter simply kills the hardware. (which IMO is still very good!)
Also, if there are significant "issues" baked into the press or recording you can usually address them in the digital domain in a nearly transparent manner.
Analog chain is VPI Classic 1 (XLR/balanced junction box, Periphery Ring, HRX weight) w/Lyra Kleos -> Channel D Seta L Phono -> Schiit Ragnarok amp/preamp -> Event Opal Studio Monitors
The flat/no RIAA output on the Seta is hooked up to a TASCAM DA-3000 ADC. (both "flat" and RIAA output are always active on the phono)
Digital is Macbook Pro (USB) -> Schiit Yggdrasil DAC -> Schiit Ragnarok amp/preamp -> Event Opal Studio Monitors
All cables except the USB are Mogami 2549 XLR with Neutrik ends. This is a nearfield/studio setup so I have a pair of Audeze LCD-3 headphones hooked up to the Ragnarok. (as balanced)
My ripping project is at its 5 year mark and I am approaching the end (hopefully within a few months) of my goal of ripping 10,000 vinyl and tape albums. You can see all my equipment in my signature. The actual ripping equipment and software has stayed the same, though I did change the TT/cartridge a few months ago (it was a VPI HRX Rim Dirve with Lyra Skala). Remember everything is real time and more - editing tracks, labeling, and any other processing. So I have spent a good deal more than 10,000 hours doing this (though not having to listen to all 10,000 hours of albums).
Comparing vinyl to digital all 192/24 PCM, because I declick and when necessary decrackle (with Izotope RX3Advanced), the digital files sound better than the vinyl.
Comparing rips with originals of 15ips 2 track tapes of master dub level (Tape Project, MPS, UltraAnalgoue, Yarlung, IRI, Opus 3, etc), the original tapes are very, very, slightly better in my system - very, very, slightly better back wall ambience.
Since I started, other software has come out, which I have not tested, but Pyramix with the Merging Mykerinos card feeding a Pacific Microsonics Model Two has worked very well for me. My understanding is that other software is much more consumer oriented and easier to use.
PS. This is all pro equipment and software and I had a few top notch engineers tutoring me how to use all this stuff - won't have been able to do it without them. A shout out to Paul Stubblebine, Mike Romanowski and Mark Willsher.
Larry
Comparing vinyl to digital all 192/24 PCM, because I declick and when necessary decrackle (with Izotope RX3Advanced), the digital files sound better than the vinyl.
Comparing rips with originals of 15ips 2 track tapes of master dub level (Tape Project, MPS, UltraAnalgoue, Yarlung, IRI, Opus 3, etc), the original tapes are very, very, slightly better in my system - very, very, slightly better back wall ambience.
Since I started, other software has come out, which I have not tested, but Pyramix with the Merging Mykerinos card feeding a Pacific Microsonics Model Two has worked very well for me. My understanding is that other software is much more consumer oriented and easier to use.
PS. This is all pro equipment and software and I had a few top notch engineers tutoring me how to use all this stuff - won't have been able to do it without them. A shout out to Paul Stubblebine, Mike Romanowski and Mark Willsher.
Larry
I would be really interested in making some dsd vinyl rips with that Tascam AD converter (don't own one yet). Anyone been down that route?
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
!!!
Emphasis is mine .
You will also have to consider what I'm using as well...
I've done this a few times with my DA-3000 as well as the Korg MR2000s. These are very good rips. Unfortunately if you want to do any editing/processing, then you need software to do that. The hardware boxes have very rudimentary editing.
And to all the folks that want to do the RIAA curve in digital? Just think how a digital EQ sounds when you adjust a freq. more than a few dB!
You will also have to consider what I'm using as well...
I've done this a few times with my DA-3000 as well as the Korg MR2000s. These are very good rips. Unfortunately if you want to do any editing/processing, then you need software to do that. The hardware boxes have very rudimentary editing.
And to all the folks that want to do the RIAA curve in digital? Just think how a digital EQ sounds when you adjust a freq. more than a few dB!
I get it that you use top-shelf equipment, the conclusion is that digital preserves what some find attractive about analog, you even mentioned it could be taken for tapes! Thi is an honest, frank and refreshing conclusion. It says a lot about what digital truly is and has to offer.
This should be required reading for folks over in that other thread, wringing their hands over digitizing an analog signal to remove room nodes.
Choice -- somewhere between a "very, very slight difference in back wall ambience" and "indistinguishable," vs bloated bass? Sounds like an easy choice to me, but attitudes change very slowly in this hobby.
Tim
Choice -- somewhere between a "very, very slight difference in back wall ambience" and "indistinguishable," vs bloated bass? Sounds like an easy choice to me, but attitudes change very slowly in this hobby.
Tim
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
Of course the Tascam, and here's why.
The Tascam records to SD cards and you can connect an external USB drive to dump your files. But the main reason I like it is because it has digital in/out so in the future when funds become available, you can use better converters. The Korg does not have this option. Plus, it's under $1k !
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
garylkoh
WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
This was done 4 years ago - .and most audiophiles couldn't tell the difference. Technology has improved since, and so has technique.
http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?2632-The-Digital-Analog-Dialectic
http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showthread.php?2632-The-Digital-Analog-Dialectic
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