Thanks for weighing in Elliot. I have no intent to even inquire about this with Spectral, because the response is entirely predictable. However, if I can get some confirmation from actual users Transparent can be mated with Spectral with good results I would feel comfortable enough to pick up a 260 or pair of 360s if they show up at a good price.
Spectral 260 amp preamp and cable compatibility
- Thread starter Mobiusman
- Start date
Thanks for weighing in Elliot. I have no intent to even inquire about this with Spectral, because the response is entirely predictable. However, if I can get some confirmation from actual users Transparent can be mated with Spectral with good results I would feel comfortable enough to pick up a 260 or pair of 360s if they show up at a good price.
Excellent advice! I would strengthen the following points:
1) MIT and multi-gauge wires: this is one of the patents they hold, which I have covered in the past; they are really part of the overall design, and thus part of the "networks"
2) Spectral amps do not include an input choke or output inductor (they are unfiltered designs, as I said upthread) - they are left, by design, to the cables. I can't begin to describe the number of times the local dealer has told me of dead amps being sent back, only for them to be diagnosed by the factory as destroyed by excessive heat (caused by internal oscillation when not used with the proper cables and/or preamps, among other misuses). For the reasons behind these design decisions - with which you may or may not agree - I will just quote again Spectral on one key point, when I inquired about the missing output inductor (emphasis is mine): The output inductor is design stability area. The majority of audio amplifiers would not be stable without it. The inductor (impedance goes up with Freq) is used to help cancel the effects of a capacitive (impedance goes down with freq) speaker load, a very traditional way of dealing with this problem. We figured out a better way to deal with this problem as the inductor itself causes audible distortion and magnetic fields where they are not wanted
It is just after 8 am on Tuesday 8/13 and once again I am sitting in my living room listening to music, every part of my body totally in synch, feeling like I have smoked some magic medicine weed, but instead I am absolutely sober and thoroughly in love with listening to music again and trying to get a session in before I go to work----again. BTW, unlike many times previously in my life and with those of many of my audiophile friends, I am listening just after waking up instead of after hours of agonizing and adjusting during the night. The best part is it actually sounds either the same or better than it did during a sister session last night and I have 8 hours of sleep sandwiched in.
So here is the irony of this whole project and in particular this thread. My system sounds better than any I have owned since 14 y/o, a mere half a decade ago. I have owned some fairly serious systems and even built a totally dedicated and 100% acoustically designed space from scratch, back in the days before divorce when the room was purely for music and not the best place to hide from the "Queen of NO". In the world of audio I have, like many on this site, been quite the player with regard to allegiance and always looking for the one that I do not want to get away. Now I have a system with no bad parts, largely excellent value parts that seem to work well as a unit and a few absolutely incredible parts like the Meitner ad the Spectral. Yeah I have a lot of annoying pieces in the system identified by a 3 letter name, but I have no choice because they seem to be essential to bring the best out in the Captain Spectral. I say annoying because it is hard to enjoy something fully even when it is incredible, when you have been somewhat raped financially because they can get away with it. Yes I believe that these cables are essential to the amazing sound produced right in my own living room, which by the way is so superior to all but a few of the rooms at CES at many multiples of total cost and frequently with way to much BS from the manufacturers who for the most part have become the image of what pure arrogance would look and sound like if was human.
SO SIT DOWN FOR THIS ONE. I JUST FOUND OUT VIA A CHANNEL THAT WILL REMAIN UNDISCLOSED, THAT DESPITE MY GUSHING ABOUT THE PLEASURES OF AUDIO AND IN PARTICULAR SPECTRAL AMPS-----I AM STILL UNAPPROVED BY SUNNYVALE FOR TWO REASONS: 1) OF COURSE I PRACTICE HERSEY FOR USING A NON SPECTRAL PRODUCT AS A PREAMP AND AM AWAITING MY EXECUTION BECAUSE SAID PREAMP IS TUBED; AND IN MY OPINION MAKES THE SPECTRAL 260 SOUND SUBSTANTIALLY BETTER THAN IT DOES WHEN FORCED TO PLAY INCEST WITH ITS SIBS; AND AMAZINGLY 2) MY $31,000 OF MIT SIGNAL CABLES ARE NOT RECOMMENDED NOR APPROVED BY SPECTRAL BECAUSE THEY DO NOT SAY "SPECTRAL" ON THE NETWORK BOXES.
It has now been a minimum of 100 hours since my last system change (an insertion of another MIT (NON-SPECTRAL) cable to help Captain Spectral do his/her best). The sound is basically now stable except that those darn balanced 8214 cables for the JL subs are still wandering around the bass spectrum, increasingly are starting to show their amazing colors and producing bass that many multi-thousand dollar systems are very fortunate to equal, assuming that they can. Hopefully they will get their wanderlust out of their copper in the next 200 hours with my system on and playing music 24/7 so that this growth phase will be done by my Labor Day party. I do not want to share what they cost to make because I will throw up on my computer because was probably less than $100 for the pair and they are 25 feel long. (They were incredibly difficult to make and fortunately were made 20 years ago when I had the drive and patience).
So what do I make of this 9 month very expensive upgrade to my mid-fi system? I really do not care what others think about my system any more. I love it and realize I bought it for me and to some extent that wonderful woman I keep mentioning. Fortunately, for me she is real and not a sublimated electronic equivalent. Yes I am going to CES 2014 and hope to hear a thing or two that will move me even farther, although I will be content just to listen and leave. The main reason I am going is to see some friends that I do not get to see often enough, catch some more Cirque and check out the people who are not wearing CES badges, especially the sexy women who are much better observed than spoken to.
So in conclusion----I love the sound that comes out of the expensive end of my room. I sit in my special spot smiling and booping wishing that my lady friend was here with me and in heaven when we share the listening experience. Ironically, my favorite listening experience since spending one of the craziest nights of my life, with Marty of course, listening with John Iverson to his Force Field speakers, is not listening to my now incredible mid-fi system that blows away most super systems despite its incorrigibility of not wearing purely Spectral logo'd support equipment, occurred on my boat with my lady friend listening to Diana Krall going 8 knots instead of my typical 50, watching the sun set and feeling her loving arms around me. BTW, the system on my boat is a total JL system with subwoofer and 1200 Class D watts. However the best component is without a doubt Ginny.
If you do not own Spectral, seriously check out Shunyata Zitron products. They sound superb, are reasonably priced for the cable market and the people behind them are the right kind of people. The power products are especially impressive as a number of people on this site have attested to, especially me.
My loss could be your gain if you are looking for a great deal on Shunyata Zitron signal products which I will sadly put on Audiogon tonight. However this is my professional psychiatrically approved audio advice---find the person you love and listen to the music with them and forget about the charlatans who mow dominate the audio industry.
So here is the irony of this whole project and in particular this thread. My system sounds better than any I have owned since 14 y/o, a mere half a decade ago. I have owned some fairly serious systems and even built a totally dedicated and 100% acoustically designed space from scratch, back in the days before divorce when the room was purely for music and not the best place to hide from the "Queen of NO". In the world of audio I have, like many on this site, been quite the player with regard to allegiance and always looking for the one that I do not want to get away. Now I have a system with no bad parts, largely excellent value parts that seem to work well as a unit and a few absolutely incredible parts like the Meitner ad the Spectral. Yeah I have a lot of annoying pieces in the system identified by a 3 letter name, but I have no choice because they seem to be essential to bring the best out in the Captain Spectral. I say annoying because it is hard to enjoy something fully even when it is incredible, when you have been somewhat raped financially because they can get away with it. Yes I believe that these cables are essential to the amazing sound produced right in my own living room, which by the way is so superior to all but a few of the rooms at CES at many multiples of total cost and frequently with way to much BS from the manufacturers who for the most part have become the image of what pure arrogance would look and sound like if was human.
SO SIT DOWN FOR THIS ONE. I JUST FOUND OUT VIA A CHANNEL THAT WILL REMAIN UNDISCLOSED, THAT DESPITE MY GUSHING ABOUT THE PLEASURES OF AUDIO AND IN PARTICULAR SPECTRAL AMPS-----I AM STILL UNAPPROVED BY SUNNYVALE FOR TWO REASONS: 1) OF COURSE I PRACTICE HERSEY FOR USING A NON SPECTRAL PRODUCT AS A PREAMP AND AM AWAITING MY EXECUTION BECAUSE SAID PREAMP IS TUBED; AND IN MY OPINION MAKES THE SPECTRAL 260 SOUND SUBSTANTIALLY BETTER THAN IT DOES WHEN FORCED TO PLAY INCEST WITH ITS SIBS; AND AMAZINGLY 2) MY $31,000 OF MIT SIGNAL CABLES ARE NOT RECOMMENDED NOR APPROVED BY SPECTRAL BECAUSE THEY DO NOT SAY "SPECTRAL" ON THE NETWORK BOXES.
It has now been a minimum of 100 hours since my last system change (an insertion of another MIT (NON-SPECTRAL) cable to help Captain Spectral do his/her best). The sound is basically now stable except that those darn balanced 8214 cables for the JL subs are still wandering around the bass spectrum, increasingly are starting to show their amazing colors and producing bass that many multi-thousand dollar systems are very fortunate to equal, assuming that they can. Hopefully they will get their wanderlust out of their copper in the next 200 hours with my system on and playing music 24/7 so that this growth phase will be done by my Labor Day party. I do not want to share what they cost to make because I will throw up on my computer because was probably less than $100 for the pair and they are 25 feel long. (They were incredibly difficult to make and fortunately were made 20 years ago when I had the drive and patience).
So what do I make of this 9 month very expensive upgrade to my mid-fi system? I really do not care what others think about my system any more. I love it and realize I bought it for me and to some extent that wonderful woman I keep mentioning. Fortunately, for me she is real and not a sublimated electronic equivalent. Yes I am going to CES 2014 and hope to hear a thing or two that will move me even farther, although I will be content just to listen and leave. The main reason I am going is to see some friends that I do not get to see often enough, catch some more Cirque and check out the people who are not wearing CES badges, especially the sexy women who are much better observed than spoken to.
So in conclusion----I love the sound that comes out of the expensive end of my room. I sit in my special spot smiling and booping wishing that my lady friend was here with me and in heaven when we share the listening experience. Ironically, my favorite listening experience since spending one of the craziest nights of my life, with Marty of course, listening with John Iverson to his Force Field speakers, is not listening to my now incredible mid-fi system that blows away most super systems despite its incorrigibility of not wearing purely Spectral logo'd support equipment, occurred on my boat with my lady friend listening to Diana Krall going 8 knots instead of my typical 50, watching the sun set and feeling her loving arms around me. BTW, the system on my boat is a total JL system with subwoofer and 1200 Class D watts. However the best component is without a doubt Ginny.
If you do not own Spectral, seriously check out Shunyata Zitron products. They sound superb, are reasonably priced for the cable market and the people behind them are the right kind of people. The power products are especially impressive as a number of people on this site have attested to, especially me.
My loss could be your gain if you are looking for a great deal on Shunyata Zitron signal products which I will sadly put on Audiogon tonight. However this is my professional psychiatrically approved audio advice---find the person you love and listen to the music with them and forget about the charlatans who mow dominate the audio industry.
I've really enjoyed the thread, thanks so much for sharing your experience and enthusiasm. I've also come to a place in my audio journey where Spectral and MIT take me to the place I want to be....and a place I've not yet heard from any other gear. Actually, I've yet to hear any other gear that gets even close to this place. I'm always amazed when I read/hear the typical knock on Spectral/MIT, for the most part they don't even make sense to me. I can only conclude that something else must be at play because there is no way in hell those folks are hearing what I hear every day in my living room. There is just simply no way.
A few random thoughts in response to some of the comments....
I disagree that the 260 is leaps better than the 360S2 (what I currently own). I heard this many times before so I knew the only way to get the real truth was to experience these amps. I gathered up both and lived with them for a month or so. Lot's of going back and forth and lots of discussion with good folks (shout out to ack for being objective through that process!). What I concluded is I could live with either but the mono's brought much more authority, scale and impact I felt I could not live without. The 260 did some things better, particularly with details and spatial presentation but I could not say one was better than the other as a whole, more different strengths/weaknesses. In the end, I preferred the 360S2 here...at least for now.
I loved the comment in the original post about cable manufacturers. I always find it very ironic that I will spout off about the shaky ground most cable manufactures stand on...damn near all. I truly believe 99% are scams....but yet I own cables that cost more than my car. It's unfortunate that the brilliance of a very few do get lost in the hoards of BS. Spectral aside, MIT cables are essential parts of my kit. What they bring is astounding to my ears/soul.
Dealer setup. I too think this is ridiculous and prohibitive. What I gather is they do this mainly to focus on AC, grounding and related system interaction. Proper function of Spectral gear requires those issues be handled in an appropriate manner and if they are not you won't even get close to what the gear is capable of. I fumbled through addressing them on my own and still question whether I am getting the most out of my gear. AC is critical...and tricky.
There's probably a bunch of stuff I left out. I've been away from the forum for a spell and was excited to see all the Spectral talk going on when I opened the page.
A few random thoughts in response to some of the comments....
I disagree that the 260 is leaps better than the 360S2 (what I currently own). I heard this many times before so I knew the only way to get the real truth was to experience these amps. I gathered up both and lived with them for a month or so. Lot's of going back and forth and lots of discussion with good folks (shout out to ack for being objective through that process!). What I concluded is I could live with either but the mono's brought much more authority, scale and impact I felt I could not live without. The 260 did some things better, particularly with details and spatial presentation but I could not say one was better than the other as a whole, more different strengths/weaknesses. In the end, I preferred the 360S2 here...at least for now.
I loved the comment in the original post about cable manufacturers. I always find it very ironic that I will spout off about the shaky ground most cable manufactures stand on...damn near all. I truly believe 99% are scams....but yet I own cables that cost more than my car. It's unfortunate that the brilliance of a very few do get lost in the hoards of BS. Spectral aside, MIT cables are essential parts of my kit. What they bring is astounding to my ears/soul.
Dealer setup. I too think this is ridiculous and prohibitive. What I gather is they do this mainly to focus on AC, grounding and related system interaction. Proper function of Spectral gear requires those issues be handled in an appropriate manner and if they are not you won't even get close to what the gear is capable of. I fumbled through addressing them on my own and still question whether I am getting the most out of my gear. AC is critical...and tricky.
There's probably a bunch of stuff I left out. I've been away from the forum for a spell and was excited to see all the Spectral talk going on when I opened the page.
I actually think the Meitner may be your weakest link. I had the EMM Labs DAC2X (Meitner on steroids), and it cannot hold a candle to the MSB DAC IV...
I have started a number of threads on this site must say that this one has a special place in my heart partially because it has been part of very in-depth, albeit rapid journey. I have learned a huge amount in this process and also realized that sometimes I should be a bit more patient before speaking or responding. I also want to say that the discussion that has resulted thus far has been one of the kindest and informative that I have experienced. I hope that maybe if others feel the same way, then perhaps it will have some positive influence on other threads yet to be sown.
Franz, one of the huge mistakes I believe I made in this thread is making a statement that I had no right to make since I did not have sufficient experience. That was that I thought that the 260 is better than the 360's series 1 and 2. Now that I am a bit more restrained, I am not sure that I have actually heard the series 2 sufficiently to make that judgement. I am fairly comfortable with that judgement on the series 1. I believe what I should have said is that the 260 is a phenomenal amp that to this day continues to get better and further amaze me. I also should have admitted as Marty did so eloquently that both he and I developed some early biases against MIT when their products were a far cry from those of today. Both Marty and I owned 3 variations of DMC 10 preamps and ran them with various amps, both SS and tube. The results were always good, but nothing like what I am getting now.
In my initial post on building a Shunyata system I admitted that although I previously had a full Valhalla equipped system, my exploration with Shunyata Zitron products was a much more carefully thought out and examined experience. To say that I was astounded if not shocked by some of what I learned would be an understatement, especially about the role on the power side of the equation. I do not envision being able to return peacefully to my previous level of ignorance.
To summarize my experiences with MIT and Spectral, they made a huge huge difference--to the point that I would say that MIT cables are mandatory if reaching the potential of the amp is desired, although I have no idea if I yet have reached their potential. However, I must restate that it is frustrating to have to use the MIT cables which are nothing short of obscene in their pricing to achieve this state. This is why I said it is wrong to think of the amp as a $10k amp when it basically does not work well without the MIT cables (in my case an additional $31k at retail.) Now that I own the cables I guess the any amp updates or preamp substitutions would now only cost what the Spectral products cost (very reasonable if the cables are not included).
What annoyed me and caught me wrong was feedback that what I believed was a major concession for a non-believer to spend $31K on products to bring out the best in a $10k amp and then be informed that I was basically foolish because I did not follow the gospel blindly just reminded me how full of BS much of high end audio has in its genetics. This is why I felt compelled to recommend the Shunyata products, even though the signal products did not work well with my amp.
I want to include a copy of an email I received from Grant (head of marketing) at Shunyata soon after my post this am. It shows just what kind of people the folks at Shunyata are and why they should be singled out in an industry where jerk is more the norm than the exception.
Hi Russ,
You've certainly explained your journey in an entertaining and informative way. I appreciate you sharing all of this with us (at Shunyata).
I've learned something through your shared process. It looks like the Spectral amps, due to their very high bandwidth, are quite sensitive-- more so than I had imagined, when it comes to the speaker cables having the filters in line.
From your description, it looks like your system has reached peak performance. In the end, I am sure the patience and trials you went through will be well worth the trouble.
If there is anything we (Shunyata) can help with in the future, don't hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Grant
Most important in my opinion is the comment I made in my slightly disguised love note to my lady friend where I imply that music is not worth much if you do not have someone to share your excitement with. That for me is why I start threads on this site.
So thank you again for your support on this thread and your important contributions. One last question-any idea how I can overlay the word Spectral on my MIT network boxes so I can be at harmony with the wacky world of audio?
Franz, one of the huge mistakes I believe I made in this thread is making a statement that I had no right to make since I did not have sufficient experience. That was that I thought that the 260 is better than the 360's series 1 and 2. Now that I am a bit more restrained, I am not sure that I have actually heard the series 2 sufficiently to make that judgement. I am fairly comfortable with that judgement on the series 1. I believe what I should have said is that the 260 is a phenomenal amp that to this day continues to get better and further amaze me. I also should have admitted as Marty did so eloquently that both he and I developed some early biases against MIT when their products were a far cry from those of today. Both Marty and I owned 3 variations of DMC 10 preamps and ran them with various amps, both SS and tube. The results were always good, but nothing like what I am getting now.
In my initial post on building a Shunyata system I admitted that although I previously had a full Valhalla equipped system, my exploration with Shunyata Zitron products was a much more carefully thought out and examined experience. To say that I was astounded if not shocked by some of what I learned would be an understatement, especially about the role on the power side of the equation. I do not envision being able to return peacefully to my previous level of ignorance.
To summarize my experiences with MIT and Spectral, they made a huge huge difference--to the point that I would say that MIT cables are mandatory if reaching the potential of the amp is desired, although I have no idea if I yet have reached their potential. However, I must restate that it is frustrating to have to use the MIT cables which are nothing short of obscene in their pricing to achieve this state. This is why I said it is wrong to think of the amp as a $10k amp when it basically does not work well without the MIT cables (in my case an additional $31k at retail.) Now that I own the cables I guess the any amp updates or preamp substitutions would now only cost what the Spectral products cost (very reasonable if the cables are not included).
What annoyed me and caught me wrong was feedback that what I believed was a major concession for a non-believer to spend $31K on products to bring out the best in a $10k amp and then be informed that I was basically foolish because I did not follow the gospel blindly just reminded me how full of BS much of high end audio has in its genetics. This is why I felt compelled to recommend the Shunyata products, even though the signal products did not work well with my amp.
I want to include a copy of an email I received from Grant (head of marketing) at Shunyata soon after my post this am. It shows just what kind of people the folks at Shunyata are and why they should be singled out in an industry where jerk is more the norm than the exception.
Hi Russ,
You've certainly explained your journey in an entertaining and informative way. I appreciate you sharing all of this with us (at Shunyata).
I've learned something through your shared process. It looks like the Spectral amps, due to their very high bandwidth, are quite sensitive-- more so than I had imagined, when it comes to the speaker cables having the filters in line.
From your description, it looks like your system has reached peak performance. In the end, I am sure the patience and trials you went through will be well worth the trouble.
If there is anything we (Shunyata) can help with in the future, don't hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Grant
Most important in my opinion is the comment I made in my slightly disguised love note to my lady friend where I imply that music is not worth much if you do not have someone to share your excitement with. That for me is why I start threads on this site.
So thank you again for your support on this thread and your important contributions. One last question-any idea how I can overlay the word Spectral on my MIT network boxes so I can be at harmony with the wacky world of audio?
Well all of my old cables and electronics are now sold and I have almost recouped the cost of one 1 meter pair of MIT MA-X IC's. Oh yeah the only thing that has not sold on A'Gon is a pair of 12 MIT Spectral Ultralinear 770 Speaker cables. Ironic or do other people have the same quandary about MIT that I do--It is so good, but so insanely priced, and if you own Spectral, you should have thought about this issue before your purchased the Spectral, or if like me, just admit that you were wrong, suck it up and fork out the dollars.
My system sounds better than ever and continues to improve to my pleasure and frustration. Pleasure for obvious reasons. Frustration because I just want to get back to JUST listening and not adjusting.
That said--two things:1) The VARiable control on the MA-X and Oracle S/PDIF is interesting and definitely makes a difference. However for me the best sound in my system is the middle one, or said other another, bypass the control; and 2) The Spectral does not have enough power for my likes with my weird speaker impedances .6 ohms at 20K. I almost have enough, but just sufficiently shy that I am kind of subliminally always waiting for the amp to shut down. The issue is very frequency/energy specific and fortunately I am not a big fan of Big Band, the worst combo I can find for my situation.
So what does this all mean? I just ordered a Spectral Reference 300 with the hope of just enough more power to handle my issues and that much more resolution (400 like). If this does not work, then I suppose there will be a pair of ML's for sale and even less cash in my reserve fund as I await my Alexia's.
How did this happen? My original upgrade budget was around $15k max. If you have been following my threads on this journey you know I have easily spent more than 5 times that (with great deals) since December and awaiting to spend at least another $10K for the upgrade for the Spectral 300 in Nov and I can't even go to where the Alexia's would put me if the ML/300 combo does not work.
All I can say is that I love it and thrilled that Ginny loves it too, scratches her head about the cost, but gets the sound and loves to sit in my lap as we listen. Fortunately at this point she has no input in the budgetary side.
BTW, great pair of MIT/Spectral speaker cables for sale.
My system sounds better than ever and continues to improve to my pleasure and frustration. Pleasure for obvious reasons. Frustration because I just want to get back to JUST listening and not adjusting.
That said--two things:1) The VARiable control on the MA-X and Oracle S/PDIF is interesting and definitely makes a difference. However for me the best sound in my system is the middle one, or said other another, bypass the control; and 2) The Spectral does not have enough power for my likes with my weird speaker impedances .6 ohms at 20K. I almost have enough, but just sufficiently shy that I am kind of subliminally always waiting for the amp to shut down. The issue is very frequency/energy specific and fortunately I am not a big fan of Big Band, the worst combo I can find for my situation.
So what does this all mean? I just ordered a Spectral Reference 300 with the hope of just enough more power to handle my issues and that much more resolution (400 like). If this does not work, then I suppose there will be a pair of ML's for sale and even less cash in my reserve fund as I await my Alexia's.
How did this happen? My original upgrade budget was around $15k max. If you have been following my threads on this journey you know I have easily spent more than 5 times that (with great deals) since December and awaiting to spend at least another $10K for the upgrade for the Spectral 300 in Nov and I can't even go to where the Alexia's would put me if the ML/300 combo does not work.
All I can say is that I love it and thrilled that Ginny loves it too, scratches her head about the cost, but gets the sound and loves to sit in my lap as we listen. Fortunately at this point she has no input in the budgetary side.
BTW, great pair of MIT/Spectral speaker cables for sale.
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Well all of my old cables and electronics are now sold and I have almost recouped the cost of one 1 meter pair of MIT MA-X IC's. Oh yeah the only thing that has not sold on A'Gon is a pair of 12 MIT Spectral Ultralinear 770 Speaker cables. Ironic or do other people have the same quandary about MIT that I do--It is so good, but so insanely priced, and if you own Spectral, you should have thought about this issue before your purchased the Spectral, or if like me, just admit that you were wrong, suck it up and fork out the dollars.
My system sounds better than ever and continues to improve to my pleasure and frustration. Pleasure for obvious reasons. Frustration because I just want to get back to JUST listening and not adjusting.
That said--two things:1) The VARiable control on the MA-X and Oracle S/PDIF is interesting and definitely makes a difference. However for me the best sound in my system is the middle one, or said other another, bypass the control; and 2) The Spectral does not have enough power for my likes with my weird speaker impedances .6 ohms at 20K. I almost have enough, but just sufficiently shy that I am kind of subliminally always waiting for the amp to shut down. The issue is very frequency/energy specific and fortunately I am not a big fan of Big Band, the worst combo I can find for my situation.
So what does this all mean? I just ordered a Spectral Reference 300 with the hope of just enough more power to handle my issues and that much more resolution (400 like). If this does not work, then I suppose there will be a pair of ML's for sale and even less cash in my reserve fund as I await my Alexia's.
How did this happen? My original upgrade budget was around $15k max. If you have been following my threads on this journey you know I have easily spent more than 5 times that (with great deals) since December and awaiting to spend at least another $10K for the upgrade for the Spectral 300 in Nov and I can't even go to where the Alexia's would put me the ML/300 combo does not work.
All I can say is that I love it and thrilled that Ginny loves it too, scratches her head about the cost, but gets the sound and loves to sit in my lap as we listen. Fortunately at this point she has no input in the budgetary side.
BTW, great pair of MIT/Spectral speaker cables for sale.
you're starting to sound like Marty
Hey, nobody is sitting on MY lap when I listen!!
Lapdances are widely available in most metropolitan areas and music in always being played in the establishment. Feel fry to try if you're curious about the experience.
The Spectral Reference 300 is now available?? NOW?? I just got my 260 a couple weeks ago. DAMN!
I too started with the Spectral branded MIT cables but then tried the real MIT cables. What a difference! I now have Oracle v2.2s balanced from my Puccini to my Spectral 30SS II, then Oracle MA-X single ended to the 260 and Oracle 90HD speaker cables to my Magico Q3s. Gorgeous sound! I also have hardly ever heard a system that compares to what I have now. And, I use Shunyata as my power cords of choice. It's always easy to hear the difference they make. I have two new Zitron Anacondas coming tomorrow. Can't wait!
Now the problem. I usually buy my MITs pre-owned, cuz they are way too expensive. Do I now need MA-X2s? Or even worse, SHD? I think for now I'll keep the speaker cables, but wonder if those new interconnects will bring the system to a level I can't live without? These newer cables are so unreasonably expensive. Even used, if even available, they cost more than the electronics in my system (as you are well aware). Will you be upgrading wires?
Yippee for my current MIT's and Shunyata's. Now how many years will I have to save up for the new stuff? Sigh.
I too started with the Spectral branded MIT cables but then tried the real MIT cables. What a difference! I now have Oracle v2.2s balanced from my Puccini to my Spectral 30SS II, then Oracle MA-X single ended to the 260 and Oracle 90HD speaker cables to my Magico Q3s. Gorgeous sound! I also have hardly ever heard a system that compares to what I have now. And, I use Shunyata as my power cords of choice. It's always easy to hear the difference they make. I have two new Zitron Anacondas coming tomorrow. Can't wait!
Now the problem. I usually buy my MITs pre-owned, cuz they are way too expensive. Do I now need MA-X2s? Or even worse, SHD? I think for now I'll keep the speaker cables, but wonder if those new interconnects will bring the system to a level I can't live without? These newer cables are so unreasonably expensive. Even used, if even available, they cost more than the electronics in my system (as you are well aware). Will you be upgrading wires?
Yippee for my current MIT's and Shunyata's. Now how many years will I have to save up for the new stuff? Sigh.
Steve,
My understanding is that the 300 will be available in November for 15K. And I doubt you need to upgrade a damn thing you already have from MIT. Unless of course, you want to unload your current MIT stuff for a great price. I'm sure someone will appreciate the favor!
My understanding is that the 300 will be available in November for 15K. And I doubt you need to upgrade a damn thing you already have from MIT. Unless of course, you want to unload your current MIT stuff for a great price. I'm sure someone will appreciate the favor!
Steve,
I have not heard the MA-X2 so I cannot compare. I have heard the MA and the MA-X in my system and can say without a doubt that there is quite a bit of difference with the MA-X throughout the spectrum after about a month. You are right it is truly stellar, as you know, clearly obscenely priced. In my opinion, as well as Marty's, the MA-X's sound most realistic in the middle setting..
While it is clearly the most expensive per cable of my MIT holdings the MA-X digital cable is truly impressive, although $5k for a single meter cable and one network box, gives new meaning to bend over and hold your ankles.
I was very lucky to be able to buy most of my cables at the old prices from Scott Warren (Matrixdude on A'Gon) (972) 754-8359 and thus was able to get away with only having to hold one ankle instead of both when MIT laid it on me. I would give him a call.
BTW, I have no need to upgrade my MA-X to MA-X2 because I am quite happy with my sound and there has to be a limit somewhere.
I have not heard the MA-X2 so I cannot compare. I have heard the MA and the MA-X in my system and can say without a doubt that there is quite a bit of difference with the MA-X throughout the spectrum after about a month. You are right it is truly stellar, as you know, clearly obscenely priced. In my opinion, as well as Marty's, the MA-X's sound most realistic in the middle setting..
While it is clearly the most expensive per cable of my MIT holdings the MA-X digital cable is truly impressive, although $5k for a single meter cable and one network box, gives new meaning to bend over and hold your ankles.
I was very lucky to be able to buy most of my cables at the old prices from Scott Warren (Matrixdude on A'Gon) (972) 754-8359 and thus was able to get away with only having to hold one ankle instead of both when MIT laid it on me. I would give him a call.
BTW, I have no need to upgrade my MA-X to MA-X2 because I am quite happy with my sound and there has to be a limit somewhere.
I have been getting my cables from matrixdude too. Or I would have stayed with my much cheaper Spectral branded cables. Every time I hear my system getting even better, I start thinking about upgrades. I just added two Anacondra Zitrons yesterday. (Cable Company and Music Direct have buy one get one half off for Labor Day). As soon as I got the 260 I immediately thought I should have gone with the new 400. I've never heard them in my system and I wonder if they increase the characteristics (resolution, transparency, air, "realness" and all the great things I hear from the 260) or are they just more powerful? Should I have gotten them? The 260 seems its got enough power for my Q3s. Anyway, great to hear you like your system as well. GREAT stuff this Spectral and MIT!
Steve,
I am going to start a new thread on Spectral that is an extension of this thread, but enough different that I want it to be new so that hopefully more people will read it. It should be up in about 30 min.
That said, I have not heard the 400's but from what Marty tells me, past experience with Spectral, Goodwin's input and my own contemplation of switching to a Ref 300 when it comes out which is supposedly a slightly more powerful 260 with most of the 400 topology and sound here's my theoretical projections.
The 260 is the "sweet" amp in the line. It is more forgiving but still has lots of Spectral resolution, but less than the 400's. As anyone with some real audio experience knows, what sounds "best" is totally personal. It is never a factor of any one component, but instead a function of a chain of factors, some of them quite subtle. Either you like it and value it, or not. Some of the Spectral mantra and life I love, other aspects I could do totally without.
I am told that the 400's is their most resolving product yet, but that is not all good, because it also means that it is the least forgiving of weak spots elsewhere, especially the crappy quality of many recordings of otherwise good if not great music. I compensate by breaking the mantra and using a tube preamp with Spectral amps. I have done the reverse and it is wonderful, but nothing close to a tube front end and the consistency of a SS amp, which to my taste is the best of both worlds.
Unlike you, the 260 is not enough power for my system with its weird impedances and just might not resolve enough for my needs. So I still search. I do not even want to go the MIT route because I am in a good frame of mind and it upsets me because it is so abusively expensive, but sadly unsurpassed in my mind when mixed with Spectral.
On the Shunyata front, if you do not have a Triton, you should. I have never heard a Typhon, but I hear it is quite an impressive addition. I cannot go there till I sort out my Spectral issues.
I am going to start a new thread on Spectral that is an extension of this thread, but enough different that I want it to be new so that hopefully more people will read it. It should be up in about 30 min.
That said, I have not heard the 400's but from what Marty tells me, past experience with Spectral, Goodwin's input and my own contemplation of switching to a Ref 300 when it comes out which is supposedly a slightly more powerful 260 with most of the 400 topology and sound here's my theoretical projections.
The 260 is the "sweet" amp in the line. It is more forgiving but still has lots of Spectral resolution, but less than the 400's. As anyone with some real audio experience knows, what sounds "best" is totally personal. It is never a factor of any one component, but instead a function of a chain of factors, some of them quite subtle. Either you like it and value it, or not. Some of the Spectral mantra and life I love, other aspects I could do totally without.
I am told that the 400's is their most resolving product yet, but that is not all good, because it also means that it is the least forgiving of weak spots elsewhere, especially the crappy quality of many recordings of otherwise good if not great music. I compensate by breaking the mantra and using a tube preamp with Spectral amps. I have done the reverse and it is wonderful, but nothing close to a tube front end and the consistency of a SS amp, which to my taste is the best of both worlds.
Unlike you, the 260 is not enough power for my system with its weird impedances and just might not resolve enough for my needs. So I still search. I do not even want to go the MIT route because I am in a good frame of mind and it upsets me because it is so abusively expensive, but sadly unsurpassed in my mind when mixed with Spectral.
On the Shunyata front, if you do not have a Triton, you should. I have never heard a Typhon, but I hear it is quite an impressive addition. I cannot go there till I sort out my Spectral issues.
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