Lampizator announcement: launch of our all new TOTL HORIZON DAC

[Golum]

I don't think Horizon owners are moving the needle on tube prices. Yes, there are some limited supply tubes and people have gobbled up the known supply but some of the tubes being used in the Horizon, like the TS 6SN7, have seen prices increases for 2 decades. They are on a never-ending climb upwards. Horizon use has not affected it.

I will say that TRP owners did buy up a big portion of the EL51 stock. I am still trying to find another pair!

I think this will come with increased number of owners. I believe TRP guys killed supply of EL51, Siemens f2a,…

 

[rau]

I think this will come with increased number of owners. I believe TRP guys killed supply of EL51, Siemens f2a,…

Damn F2a hoarders

 

[Steve Williams]

I don't think Horizon owners are moving the needle on tube prices. Yes, there are some limited supply tubes and people have gobbled up the known supply but some of the tubes being used in the Horizon, like the TS 6SN7, have seen prices increases for 2 decades. They are on a never-ending climb upwards. Horizon use has not affected it.

I will say that TRP owners did buy up a big portion of the EL51 stock. I am still trying to find another pair!

Exact reason i stopped sharing ideas publicly here but rather with a cyrcle of trust before common data points are aligned as otherwise i would have much smaller stash of tubes at home…much more people read vs how many people post their findings (unfortunately)

The two of you have been great inspiration for me and many others here but I do believe Lampi owners contribute to other Lampi owners tube woes

 

[Steve Williams]

I think this will come with increased number of owners. I believe TRP guys killed supply of EL51, Siemens f2a,…

Like I said………

 

[Al M.]

JJ pentodes IN THIS DAC and with blue balls 6SN7's sound fabulous ! There is magic there.

While I cannot speak for those JJ tubes, I have found that the JJ ECC82/12AU7 driver tubes in my Octave power amp are excellent. I have compared them with "highly sought after" (quote from Tube Depot) 1950's RCA Black Plate 12AU7 tubes and found them equally good. Differences, if there were any, were very minor.

No reason to look beyond those JJ tubes.

The comparison KT150 and KT120 power tubes is an entirely different matter...

 

[Steve Williams]

Damn F2a hoarders

Like I said ……….

 

[Lukasz "Lampizator" Fikus]

Again this is my personal opinion, To get the best or " better " sound from horizon one has to spend 2000.00 avg on tubes . With a DAC at this price point a person should not have to spend another 2000.00 to make the DAC sound its best . Again personal opinion, but I feel a good option would be customer choice example 2000.00 discount no tubes included option . Or if you have a tube package available you could also offer at a fee " Starter Tubes " leave the choice to the customer. I don't know of one person that's is using the tubes that are included .
I know a few people that received the Horizon and was not impressed with the sound till they were talked into swapping the tubes . As for as cheap tubes , when you first started shipping Horizon the tube sets had a avg value of say 1500.00 now this new tube package 600.00 max . Just curious where this savings is going ? Is it being passed on to the customer?

I will buy these mentioned best tubes if you can find me minimum 100 identical sets, measured and matched., Thats 700 tubes for the 100 units.
and even if we find NOS sets, there will always be a better set somewhere.
VAC has 150 k amps with stock russian tubes and nobody is complaining.

 

[Lukasz "Lampizator" Fikus]

Okay I'll make it simple .
Offer H with no tube option !
I don't expect Lukasz to hunt tubes in small quantities

I immediately agree.
But if you havent heard my tubes, how would you know if your choice is not inferior and in fact compromises my product?

 

[wisnon]

I don't think Horizon owners are moving the needle on tube prices. Yes, there are some limited supply tubes and people have gobbled up the known supply but some of the tubes being used in the Horizon, like the TS 6SN7, have seen prices increases for 2 decades. They are on a never-ending climb upwards. Horizon use has not affected it.

I will say that TRP owners did buy up a big portion of the EL51 stock. I am still trying to find another pair!

H -Dac owners owners already did for the French Thomsons and the Yellow tip tube. In addition there are overlaps with Baltic tubes and TRP pentodes, so the pressure is multi-faceted.

 

[wisnon]

Just to be clear I'm not down talking Lampizator products , I'm very happy with Horizon , TRP , GM70 . I have been through a lot of gear and DAC's and get the most enjoyment I get is out of my Lampizator products .

I think most of us get that Rod, just offering another point of view. As I also said, i am sure Luk would have a no-tube option or would acquiese upon request.

He makes a good point about his tube selections which are based on extensive rolling with his circle of golden ear listeners. LoL

 

[wisnon]

Damn F2a hoarders

OH, yes and U know the main offenders. LoL

 

[rau]

I will buy these mentioned best tubes if you can find me minimum 100 identical sets, measured and matched., Thats 700 tubes for the 100 units.
and even if we find NOS sets, there will always be a better set somewhere.
VAC has 150 k amps with stock russian tubes and nobody is complaining.

Lukasz just continue making great products, your point is valid . I was just trying to point something out , but you are taking it as I'm making you out to be a crook . This was not my intention. I just thought for the cost diffrence between the first batch of tube sets and the current cost that a tube credit should be in order . I also felt there should be a no tube option . Again it's your choice and I apologize if this got out of hand .

 

[wisnon]

I don't think Horizon owners are moving the needle on tube prices. Yes, there are some limited supply tubes and people have gobbled up the known supply but some of the tubes being used in the Horizon, like the TS 6SN7, have seen prices increases for 2 decades. They are on a never-ending climb upwards. Horizon use has not affected it.

I will say that TRP owners did buy up a big portion of the EL51 stock. I am still trying to find another pair!

David, lets talk offline about your EL51 problem. LoL. PM me.

 

[dminches]

H -Dac owners owners already did for the French Thomsons and the Yellow tip tube. In addition there are overlaps with Baltic tubes and TRP pentodes, so the pressure is multi-faceted.

Personally, I think the French 5687s were overhyped (for the Horizon). They are a nice tube but I have found the 6SN7s to sound much better. One of these days I will put in a Tung Sol 5687 and see what I hear. Likewise, favorite tube of mine, the 6H30DR did not sound better than 6SN7s.

No doubt that the TRP owners hoarded the pentodes!

 

[wisnon]

While I cannot speak for those JJ tubes, I have found that the JJ ECC82/12AU7 driver tubes in my Octave power amp are excellent. I have compared them with "highly sought after" (quote from Tube Depot) 1950's RCA Black Plate 12AU7 tubes and found them equally good. Differences, if there were any, were very minor.

No reason to look beyond those JJ tubes.

The comparison KT150 and KT120 power tubes is an entirely different matter...

For those I love the vintage Pope, Tungsram and amperex/bugle boy and a few others. The Japanese are likely the best of all there.

 

[wisnon]

Personally, I think the French 5687s were overhyped (for the Horizon). They are a nice tube but I have found the 6SN7s to sound much better. One of these days I will put in a Tung Sol 5687 and see what I hear. Likewise, favorite tube of mine, the 6H30DR did not sound better than 6SN7s.

No doubt that the TRP owners hoarded the pentodes!

As I said, PM me.

I dont doubt your observations, but its besides the point. Hype drives prices. I see the blue balls being dissed now and I recall a time people would wait weeks and months longer for their Dacs to have with blue balls. LoL

 

[dminches]

As I said, PM me.

I dont doubt your observations, but its besides the point. Hype drives prices. I see the blue balls being dissed now and I recall a time people would wait weeks and months longer for their Dacs to have with blue balls. LoL

Hype is a real factor, for sure.

I sent you an email.

 

[rau]

6SN7 Round Plate excellent as it is in any product but hard to find . Last pr I bought 500.00 and today is a good price

 

[ctydwn]

I love the crisp dialogue here. I knew I was entering uncharted waters for me, tube wise, by moving to the Pacific and then to the Horizon.

I have learned so much from this thread and the rolling thread. I hesitantly accepted, now embrace the tube variability and its allure. I take full responsibility for buying different initial flavor of the month tubes that were recommended the past fe months. Excited to try them regardless.

Given my deposit for a product 6 months ago set to arrive in a few weeks, I am not upset that the initial tubes are not the same. It is because I fully trust Lukasz and his team’s ears (and ethos) and I want to start with a baseline of highly synergistic set of tubes that have magic as I would struggle, myself, at the outset. That baseline is invaluable to me.

Thank you to everyone’s input here so far.

 

[John T]

Knowledge is the greatest gift. I have received a great deal from many of you. Good reasonable discussion here. However your damn knowledge costs!! LOL! John