More importantly, simplification not only reduces clutter and costs, it would also improve the purity of sound (the pure and unfiltered impact of attack and leading edge of sound, which matter most to me) when the signal path is as simple, direct and short as possible. Regrettable that the leading external DACs are not battery-powered. Understand the difficulty of using battery power when the power consumption of an external DAC is high, but I believe a critical advantage of Taiko's analog DAC is that it is battery-powered as well as its close proximity and direct link in the XDMI circuity (being tech illiterate, I may get the terms wrong, but what I intend to convey should be clear).
Introducing Olympus & Olympus I/O - A new perspective on modern music playback
- Thread starter Taiko Audio
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The next amplifier I'm considering is a two-stage tube amp with a 4V input sensitivity - SE. I'm currently using an EMIA silver AVC, which is fine with my current three-stage tube amps with 1.5V input sensitivity and a DAC with 2.2V output.
The option to have a higher output with XDMI analog would be worthwhile here. Simple is good. Or I may need to spend another $20k on an active preamp for that set-up.
Despite what others say, I really really don't want an active preamp in my current set-up with efficient speakers. I wouldn't say that if I had inefficient speakers 92db and below. I still have too much gain with an AVC. However, if I go two-stage, I have an expensive conundrum.
Simple and good doesn't happen by accident.
The option to have a higher output with XDMI analog would be worthwhile here. Simple is good. Or I may need to spend another $20k on an active preamp for that set-up.
Despite what others say, I really really don't want an active preamp in my current set-up with efficient speakers. I wouldn't say that if I had inefficient speakers 92db and below. I still have too much gain with an AVC. However, if I go two-stage, I have an expensive conundrum.
Simple and good doesn't happen by accident.
It took Taiko 3-4 years of R&D (if I remember correctly) to arrive at the "simple" and "good" XDMI (the utter simplicity and directness mentioned by Lukasz in video comment about XDMI). Much easier to pile on with off-shelf solutions and components. I have not heard XDMI and will confirm for myself when the time comes.
@ray-dude , it was an absolute pleasure meeting you in person, thank you for brightening our Sunday/Monday
A quick question for all those who’ve tried the analog output, what is your opinion on the output level / gain? Would you prefer it to be lower/higher or is it just right?
I prefer a higher gain
Worth pointing out the obvious, which is that the Olympus by itself does not produce sound waves. Your impression of the Olympus is a function of the loudspeakers and the room at one end, and the original recording at the other end. For me, getting the right loudspeakers matters most of all and that of course has to match the room. That said, I agree that paying attention to the highest quality digital source is really important. The Olympus is definitely aimed at those who want the highest quality streaming source. It’s quite a remarkable amount of effort requiring a single-minded zeal. I admire that.
Honestly, I view live performance and recorded music as two very separate things, both to be enjoyed and savored. But personally, I never confuse one for the other.
I've gathered from your posts that you are a classical music aficionado. While it would be wonderful -- mostly -- to have "live" sound in my living room I'm not sure I'm going to be happy trying to shoe-horn a symphony orchestra into my small space. And I don't want the live performance SPL of say, a Who concert blasting me near-field. I've been there, done that, and my ears were ringing for the next day or two.
As far as your implied criticism of audiophiles who tailor the sound of their systems' attributes to tickle their own particular set of pleasure receptors, my flippant answer would be that when you start buying equipment for me, you get a say in what my system sounds like. Up until that time, I respect your decision to chase live performance sound for your listening pleasure and I respect your right to dislike my system's sound as much as you want, but I'll dance to my own drummer (and subwoofers), thank you very much.
Steve Z
Just right and in the same ballpark as my analog sources, give or take a few clicks on the remote control.@ray-dude , it was an absolute pleasure meeting you in person, thank you for brightening our Sunday/Monday
A quick question for all those who’ve tried the analog output, what is your opinion on the output level / gain? Would you prefer it to be lower/higher or is it just right?
Steve Z
Fair point, but I would think that the source is the most important. For "source", I think recording quality is the most important (outstanding recording sounds good via any system; next is the digital server so far as digital reproduction is concerned; leaving out analog reproduction. An excellent speaker is one that reproduces the source as accurately and linearly as possible. It cannot create magic by itself ("garbage in garbage out, sas the saying goes). Recording aims, and is only able, to capture sound at the microphone level (or in big orchestral music with multi-miking, at the conductor's level). A faithful system aims to reproduce that captured sound. In a big concert hall, one gets the hall-reverberated sound if one sits further away (say after row 10 or so on the ground floor or in a balcony, which is good sound too, which blended sound many people prefer but such sound can never be duplicated in one's home system). Therefore, even if I have the luxury of building a "mini-concert hall" or dedicated music room (I intend to pull it off in a couple of years; no parallel side walls, ceiling rising up toward the back, all in wood panels with detractors and no absorbers) it will not be very big as I only listen to my system nearfield (say about 6-7 feet away from the middle point of the speakers, which are separated by the same distance). Finally, even if one has the best equipment, one does not fully realize its benefit until one gets an optimal music room (standard rooms with drywalls and sharp corners and parallel side walls are terrible for sound); in this sense, room acoustics is as important as equipment (some say more important, but I don't have firsthand experience myself). But the experience of people who have experienced Olympus shows what magic a "purified" server alone can create. They may conclude, as I have so done, that the source is more important than speakers in the final analysis.
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As my response to another feedback shows, I have a very limited live music experience in mind as reference point - sitting as close as possible to the musician playing. Otherwise, I only hear the reverberated sound from afar, which is, as you said, a different kind of experience, which is for me equally valid. When you sit close to the musicians, you hear the slightest transients, the bows gliding thru the string instruments, the sizzle, the sss sound, the immediate attack of sticks hitting the tympani, the leading edge of the music notes before they get echoed. Listen to a string quartet right in front of them or sitting in row 3 of a concert hall, that's a different experience from the experience sitting in row 30 or balconies. This is the reference sound I have in mind. Hifi sound is not for me, but there is nothing wrong, as I wrote, for one to enjoy hifi sound as long as it allows you to enjoy music (that's why many people crave the special tubey sound, especially for jazz or solo vocal). My personal experience: while some tube components (but others like Horizon do not do so) make the midrange more lush than usual (nothing wrong), it comes at the expense of bass (which gets lumpy) or high notes (losing the brilliance and sparkle). I remember Emile saying the LP sound is not for him (but that's valid for him only). I really enjoyed an LP system when I heard it (thinking it was better than the digital system in the same room), but ultimately I can only have digital (because it is too inconvenient and limiting to have an analog system for classical music). Given my very happy experience of a purist i2s connection between a modded DVD player and H1 (significantly closer to live music experienced in nearfield than Extreme via USB), I have reasons to believe that Olympus would be for me. But I can see that Olympus may not please someone who uses LP system for ultimate reference (Olympus, I suspect, does not sound as that LP system).
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Emile
Any update of the balanced analog XDMI (without volume control)? Do you think it can be ready by this quarter? Thanks
Any update of the balanced analog XDMI (without volume control)? Do you think it can be ready by this quarter? Thanks
Hi Emile/Taiko,@ray-dude , it was an absolute pleasure meeting you in person, thank you for brightening our Sunday/Monday
A quick question for all those who’ve tried the analog output, what is your opinion on the output level / gain? Would you prefer it to be lower/higher or is it just right?
Ray said that you and your team is preparing V2 and V3 of the XDMI dac/analog output card.
And that there will be two dac chips on the V2 instead of one.
IMHO V2 is ready for a true xlr analog output.
Is this what you have planned？
Many thanks!
In case I inadvertently caused confusion, Emile has talked about a v2.
I was speaking more generally about a future v3 (and v4 and v5 etc) because of the potential of the platform and what hopefully will be very rapid and exciting innovations.
With xdmi and bps, there is brand new ground for digital audio, so very early days right now.
I was speaking more generally about a future v3 (and v4 and v5 etc) because of the potential of the platform and what hopefully will be very rapid and exciting innovations.
With xdmi and bps, there is brand new ground for digital audio, so very early days right now.
For me personally, I would like a higher gain, but I also have a low gain preamp given the Aries Cerat DAC tends to have a higher gain output so chose to have a lower gain preamp. Adjustable gain would be ideal, if possible.@ray-dude , it was an absolute pleasure meeting you in person, thank you for brightening our Sunday/Monday
A quick question for all those who’ve tried the analog output, what is your opinion on the output level / gain? Would you prefer it to be lower/higher or is it just right?
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@Taiko Audio - Emile, I could use lower gain, especially if it has potential for better SQ. Also allows for lower attenuation losses from the amplifier volume control.
Just right@ray-dude , it was an absolute pleasure meeting you in person, thank you for brightening our Sunday/Monday
A quick question for all those who’ve tried the analog output, what is your opinion on the output level / gain? Would you prefer it to be lower/higher or is it just right?
Christiaan Punter
Well-Known Member
We are looking into XLR as well as a "preamplifier" version with volume control. However, we cannot not yet make any promises at this point, nor do we have a due-ready date.
Definitely not lower. It's just about right.
If anything, it could be slightly higher for those of us that don't use a preamp.
Careful, we’re going to start debating autoformers vs attenuators vs digital volume control
It's great for me (I don't want to stop using my preamp) to know that there will be a future balanced version without a preamp.
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