Not to everyone Christian and not in every situation and for the record all amplifiers have Class-a VAS stages and output stages , well most do (A/AB), there is always some class-a bias ....
FM Acoustics amps
- Thread starter wizard
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Not to everyone Christian and not in every situation and for the record all amplifiers have Class-a VAS stages and output stages , well most do (A/AB), there is always some class-a bias ....
you seriously think he could be legit? he was the most picture-happy poster ever; and now he's reluctant to share personal pictures? he has a blog with pictures up the ying yang....many he inferred he took.
and what about a 'loaner' set of $130,000 amps that he trashes? come on. no one seriously thinks that could be legit.
i can see sympathy for a guy who does bring us lots of juicey information. i can understand some being upset with me for outing him. everyone is entiltled to their opinions.
but i cannot see actually buying what he is selling.
and to those who think i should have let him be; what if people here actually made buying decisions based on some of his feedback, and then discovered later he was a fake and some knew about it and did not raise the alarm. i think the truth has value, but maybe nice pictures and inside info on uber gear is more important.
I am not sure how to say this, but I personally don't care to know whether his story was true or not. He made claims like everyone else. I really have better things to do with my time than pin someone to the wall for their views, or sit down and ponder the truthfulness of the claims. I quickly brush aside things I find outrageous and enjoy my day. Frankly, I have a very high opinion of the FMA sound (not their price tag) - I had been "pestering" Steve to start this forum for quite some time - so I took it for what it was: info on FMA, with a take-it-or-leave-it attitude if I didn't like some of it. I infer no criticism on either side - I just like to always stay on topic.
A.wayne:
Doing class a at rated output vs class a for the first watt or two then switching to class a/b for the bulk of the power rating does not make a class a biased amp. In the end, it's all preference as we all know...subjective. Happily for me and my bank account, fm will never be on my radar.
Doing class a at rated output vs class a for the first watt or two then switching to class a/b for the bulk of the power rating does not make a class a biased amp. In the end, it's all preference as we all know...subjective. Happily for me and my bank account, fm will never be on my radar.
What??? It would have taken no raisins to simply show some pictures (if you had them of course) to put Mike in his place and have him apologize which he stated he was quite willing to do. Pulling all the pictures, posts, and running away from the forum is what took no raisins and to me inferred some degree of guilt. None of Wizard’s actions since Mike called him out has made sense to me.
Steve Williams
Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
MikeL
I believe in my heart that no one will be making any buying decision based on his comment and no one should be so naive to think such. Surely you wouldn't.
I'm with Peter on this one as well.
I believe in my heart that no one will be making any buying decision based on his comment and no one should be so naive to think such. Surely you wouldn't.
I'm with Peter on this one as well.
Rockitman,
Just throwing or using the designation class-a can be deemed a misnomer , the correct way is to list the Class-a wattage , as all are technically running in class-a, that was my point.
So if i have an amp that is class-a biased to 50 watts/ch or yours to 200 watts , both are class-a biased, its the wattage designation that differentiates them, also regardless of the bias, It can only be biased for full class-a to clipping to a certain impedance and if that impedance is a 8 ohm load , then it will drop out of class-a earlier into a 4 ohm and so on and so forth . Papa uses FETS by choice in order to get rid of MOSFET MIST, he chooses a high bias, it gets him the sound he wants, that we both like. This is why you rarely see bipolar output stage amplifiers biased to running full class-a to clipping , there sound is different and work best for most with less class-a bias. There are some who do run bipolars full class-a to clipping at 8 ohm , but most don't like the sound.
There are exceptions of course ...
I really don't care the bias amt used, as long as the sound is appropriate, historically i do prefer amps with a bit of warmth(temp) as opposed to amps which run cold ...
i'll be the first to admit to taking criticisms of the NHB-458 somewhat personally since i've spent my hard earned money to buy them. i was not concerned about any other of Wizard's comments, and like you, if he's having fun at no one else's expense then good for him. i really never paid that close of attention. then he made all these outragous claims and that did get my attention as it was not credible. so i respect that you may not care because either you don't have a dog in the fight, or you generally might not care for whatever reason.
me; i cared. and if that's bad then so be it. it just is what it is.
i like FMA gear, how can one not? but i don't love it. i am interested to read about it. hey; the best FMA gear might be better than darTZeel. who knows? that is what Wizard would have us believe. but only if he can show he is credible. bandwidth is cheap, respect is earned.
and i've never said one negative thing about FMA. this has nothing to do with any negativity toward any gear of any kind. it's about the truth.
tolerance. yes; i think it's important to be tolerant of each other and our different approaches to the hobby and personal styles. but there is a factor of signal to noise. if you make lots of noise then your signal needs to be worthy of that much noise or toleration will end.
death by a thousand cuts.
it's typical that some gear gets labeled a certain way and it gets repeated and soon you have a buzz. it's naive to not see that innocent well meaning comments, as well as intentional fabrications, can become more than we think.
these things are hard to predict.
what you or i may do is not the issue; once said a few times there becomes resonance. truth is worthy of defending.
Mike is their a link to your system, i would love to see pics of the setup ....
i am an open book.
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vaslt&1036349020&read&3&zzlMikelavigne&&
the speakers you see in my pictures are now gone, and i have new Evolution Acoustics MM7's due to arrive in the next 3-5 weeks.
the dart amp you see will be replaced by the NHB-458's likely sometime in November. the tube amps in the pictures are gone.
I’m in total agreement with Christian. You are either a pure Class ‘A’ amp or you are not. All Class A/B amps are Class ‘A’ to a watt or two or whatever. But they are not and should not be considered as real Class ‘A’ amps because they aren’t.
OK Mep,
Help me out here, what is a "pure" class-a amp ..... what about the ones class-a biased to 10/20/30 watts before switching to a/b , fakes ..?
In order to make an amp , any amp class-a say to 2 ohms, how is that done ..?
what is its 8 ohm rating ..?
Regards,
Help me out here, what is a "pure" class-a amp ..... what about the ones class-a biased to 10/20/30 watts before switching to a/b , fakes ..?
In order to make an amp , any amp class-a say to 2 ohms, how is that done ..?
what is its 8 ohm rating ..?
Regards,
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The KSA 200 was krell's last full class-a amp, the 250 is not full class-a , the 200 pulled 1400 watts at idle ( I had one, dat basturd ) .. the 250 ..?
Here let me help you out ..:
http://www.stereophile.com/content/krell-ksa-250-power-amplifier-when-class-class
In case you missed it and using your standards, you do not have a real "class-a " amp ..
Rockitman ... ?
Regards,
Here let me help you out ..:
http://www.stereophile.com/content/krell-ksa-250-power-amplifier-when-class-class
In case you missed it and using your standards, you do not have a real "class-a " amp ..
Rockitman ... ?
Regards,
OK,
Help me out here, what is a "pure" class-a amp ..... what about the ones class-a biased to 10/20/30 watts before switching to a/b , fakes ..?
In order to make an amp , any amp class-a say to 2 ohms, how is that done ..?
what is its 8 ohm rating ..?
Regards,
i am no techie, but as i understand a pure class A never switches to Class B under any conditions. i believe in super-layman's terms you design an amp to be A, A/B, D, etc... A switching to B is in part due to the enormous inefficiency of A (in heat) at higher wattage output...hence switching to B for this among other reasons. while design is everything, A supposedly has less inherent distortion than other amps...though again amp design is probably more important than Class.
In order to design a Pure Class A amp...you're gonna need a lot of iron...heavy transformers, etc, etc. They tend to be heavy if you're gonna have them produce watts. Many pure class A amps are 50 watts...and probably for this very reason. The 2 larger pure Class A amps i know...Boulder and Gryphon are beasts...they weight nearly 200 lbs for a single dual-mono amp! In the case of the Gryphon amps, i believe the stated watt rating doubles into every impedance load down to 0.5ohms...and doubles again peak. The Gryphon Colosseum is stated 160/320/640/1280/2560 watts into 8/4/2/1/0.5 ohms and the peak output doubles all the way as well...to over 5400watts into 0.5ohms. (i have not measured, but they have been very clear about this.) I do not know if doubling all the way down has anything to do with A, B, etc...this bit i suspect is how the designer wanted to design and build the unit.
Super layman's super basic understanding...
What's so tough to understand a.wayne ? Either your full class A for rated output or your not. The first few watts in A does not make it a full class A amp for Rated Output. You can buy amps built that way both in tube and SS. Check it out.
The KSA 200 was krell's last full class-a amp, the 250 is not full class-a , the 200 pulled 1400 watts at idle ( I had one, dat basturd ) .. the 250 ..?
Here let me help you out ..:
http://www.stereophile.com/content/krell-ksa-250-power-amplifier-when-class-class
In case you missed it and using your standards, you do not have a real "class-a " amp ..
Rockitman ... ?
Regards,
I'm quite aware of that fact and suffer no delusions that the KSA-250 is a pure Class 'A' amp. I read the reviews long ago and know what JA said. You won't find one post from me saying I have a pure Class 'A' amp.
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agree, but There is no such amp capable of producing full class-a power to 1 ohm , those amplifiers are switching to a/b to produce that amt of power, as I'm about to explain to Christian ...
Again , you can only be full class-a to a rated output at a specific impedance, your amp has what is known as its quiescence bias, this determines its total class-a output, repeating the same wrong statement a zillion times wont change that Christian .
So if your Pass or any amplifier for that matter is 200 watts class-a to clipping at 8 ohm , it will only be 100 @4 , 50 @ 2, 25@1 , means it is switching to ab to produce power above those levels. This will mean you are not full class-a to clipping at 4 ohm or 2 , well by your definition. This is why the class-a nomenclature is used on everything from 10 watt -200, as the marketing department play the lines ..
Eventually they will all switch to a/b .....well unless you're using a transformer ...
Regards,
A.wayne:
Do yourself a favor and read up on my amps
https://passlabs.com/products/amplifiers/xs/xs-150
The wattage at full class A push/pull doubles from 8 to 4 ohms...specs, pass says These amps will drive any load. True, if I had big inefficient speakers and listen real loud my amp could go out of class a to a/b....doesn't happen in my system with large 95 dB efficient speakers. My bias meters don't move, therefore I am enjoying full class a at my desired listening levels. Time to move on.
Do yourself a favor and read up on my amps
https://passlabs.com/products/amplifiers/xs/xs-150
The wattage at full class A push/pull doubles from 8 to 4 ohms...specs, pass says These amps will drive any load. True, if I had big inefficient speakers and listen real loud my amp could go out of class a to a/b....doesn't happen in my system with large 95 dB efficient speakers. My bias meters don't move, therefore I am enjoying full class a at my desired listening levels. Time to move on.
There is another factor at play too when doing low impedance , NFB, this is one of the reasons distortion is always higher into low impedance than it is into an 8 ohm load. Amplifiers that weld as ML calls them, wont sound good at 8 ohm as they do at 2 ohm, the designer has to compromise sonically and vice a versa.
Brings us back to that synergy vs specs thing huh ..... !!!!!
Regards,
Brings us back to that synergy vs specs thing huh ..... !!!!!
Regards,
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