DCS Vivaldi

[BMCG]

Thanks for the advice. Will progressively improve the cables part of my installation !

Cables..clock and notwithstanding dCSs comments to the contrary...conditioners matter.

Switch the DAC from a Triton V3 to direct wall.....and watch the noise floor shift.

Upsampler - in my experience - is a wash versus a well constructed server (YMMV).

 

[Elberoth]

There are many factors that can affect sound quality in a networked computer audio system and it is also a preference and system matching matter. I have listened several times to Vivaldi DAC + upsampler versus Rossini side by side and it is really a very large difference - I would never tell anyone seriously considering a Vivaldi DAC to listen to a Rossini. But it is me, YMMV ...

After I introduced a fiber link between the Vivaldi upsampler and the router and disabled the WIFI section of the router my computer audio system - TIDAL included - experienced a big jump in performance - and I have the feeling I have just started tuning it!

He did not try the Vivaldi DAC + Vivaldi upsampler vs his Rossini. He tried the Vivaldi DAC + dCS Network Bridge vs his Rossini.

 

[ksalno]

I'm not familiar with Gigabit ethernet single mode SC fiber, and how it helps...please elaborate to help out a novice.

Tripp-Lite makes something they call a media converter that is designed to interface a fiber-optic cable with a standard Ethernet RJ-45 cable (CAT 5/6). The media converter basically removes any noise that may be on the Ethernet circuit as it comes from a switch, computer, or NAS by converting from electrical impulses to light impulses. At the other end of the path is another media converter that takes the laser light impulses and converts them back to electrical impulses and outputs them on a standard Ethernet cable. I use one between the switch in my audio rack and the Upsampler, with a short run of AQ Diamond Ethernet cable from the media converter to the Upsampler. This provides the cleanest possible network signal to the Upsampler. It also obviates the need for using any other high end Ethernet cables, audiophile switches, or other techniques, since you take out any network noise just before it gets to the Upsampler. I haven't done a direct A:B comparison, so I can't say if there is an audible improvement in my system, but the Tripp-Lite media converters are pretty cheap (relative to everything else we're talking about), so I figured they can't hurt.

 

[microstrip]

I'm getting my NB delivered and installed later this week for my Vivaldi DAC. The sound has already improved since I converted from portable HD's and USB to a NAS with solid state drives. I have top line Wireworld Ethernet cat 8 cables for NAS, and. one for NB. I'm not familiar with Gigabit ethernet single mode SC fiber, and how it helps...please elaborate to help out a novice. I have a TA reference digital to use as clock cable, and getting TA digital AES cables to connect NB to DAC. I've also read it may help to ground my 16 port GB ethernet switch, which I've not done.
From all the enthusiastic posts, it seems I may also need to start saving for the clock and upsampler.

Since I'm a newbie on WBF, how can I link my system underneath my log in, like most folks...
Thanks,
Bob

I got two of these units TP-Link-Ethernet-Converter-Single-Mode-MC210CS and a https://www.amazon.com/TP-Link-Ethernet-Converter-Single-Mode-MC210CS/dp/B003CFATKQ and a PATCHCORD FIBRE DUPLEX SC-SC OS1 .

You just connect the fibre patchcord between the two units and a RJ 45 cable to each one. Total cost of less than $100. Still have to try using better power supply's (linear or battery) on the converter on the side of the DAC (do not use the same power supply on both units).

 

[ksalno]

Still have to try using better power supply's (linear or battery) on the converter on the side of the DAC (do not use the same power supply on both units).

I found the most effective approach in my system was to use the stock wall wart PS for the converter on the switch side and to use a feed from my HD-Plex for the Upsampler side.

 

[Pol]

Cables..clock and notwithstanding dCSs comments to the contrary...conditioners matter.


Switch the DAC from a Triton V3 to direct wall.....and watch the noise floor shift.

Could not agree more: Plugging the digital chain (Aurender-Upsampler-DAC) into the triton has been, for my system, a MAJOR upgrade.

Pol

 

[Pol]

Cables..clock and notwithstanding dCSs comments to the contrary...conditioners matter.


Switch the DAC from a Triton V3 to direct wall.....and watch the noise floor shift.

Could not agree more: Plugging the digital chain (Aurender-Upsampler-DAC) into the triton has been, for my system, a MAJOR upgrade.

Pol

 

[jfrech]

Cables..clock and notwithstanding dCSs comments to the contrary...conditioners matter.


Switch the DAC from a Triton V3 to direct wall.....and watch the noise floor shift.

Could not agree more: Plugging the digital chain (Aurender-Upsampler-DAC) into the triton has been, for my system, a MAJOR upgrade.

Pol

Agree. Try the Shunyata DPC-6 for everything else (clock, upsampler, trans, NAS, music server etc) and then the DPC-6 into the Triton...I kept my DAC direct to Triton (and now Opus Isolator)

 

[jfrech]

Cables..clock and notwithstanding dCSs comments to the contrary...conditioners matter.


Switch the DAC from a Triton V3 to direct wall.....and watch the noise floor shift.

Could not agree more: Plugging the digital chain (Aurender-Upsampler-DAC) into the triton has been, for my system, a MAJOR upgrade.

Pol

Agree. Try the Shunyata DPC-6 for everything else (clock, upsampler, trans, NAS, music server etc) and then the DPC-6 into the Triton...I kept my DAC direct to Triton/Typhon when I had them...

 

[Pol]

Agree. Try the Shunyata DPC-6 for everything else (clock, upsampler, trans, NAS, music server etc) and then the DPC-6 into the Triton...I kept my DAC direct to Triton/Typhon when I had them...

That is interesting. Thank you Jfrech. I will ask my pusher\dealer if he has a DPC6 to borrow me

 

[ationg]

+1

I'd add the Master Clock before the Upsampler...without such a timing foundation doubtful you are getting the most out of either the Rossini or Vivaldi Dac. ....moreover having listened to the Vivaldi One....it also requires a clock...microdetail/soundstaging/depth...all suffer without.

Ergo: dCS DACs should be clocked.

Furthermore..and this annoys me no end....the Abendrot Stute (the $40k reference clock)....bolsters the dCS Master Clock...a view echoed by a half dozen or so dCS system owners in this neck of the woods. (am keen to see whether its the Stute alone or whether the Mutec Ref10/Cybershaft can afford similar gains)

Sorry to ask a naïve question...why would a clock be so beneficial? what does it do technically?
regards

 

[Kingsrule]

I found the most effective approach in my system was to use the stock wall wart PS for the converter on the switch side and to use a feed from my HD-Plex for the Upsampler side.

There is an even better way...no converter on the switch side, plug the fiber directly into the SFP ports on the switch.

 

[jfrech]

Sorry to ask a naïve question...why would a clock be so beneficial? what does it do technically?
regards

Most all digital has a clock-frequently internal in a dac. In this case, the clock is better and in a separate chassis and clocks all components off a single master clock...

 

[moby2004]

Hi all

After now a bit more time with my dcs gear I would like to share with everyone that I am still very happy ! Music listening is so enjoyable !
Some further remarks :
- Chord Dave is a very good DAC. Feeded by the upsampler this is not a night and day difference vs the vivaldi.
- I have now the transport on loan.... Ouch. Even better than with files. Driving me nuts,don't want to go back to Cds but the sound difference is not marginal. So three options ahead of me now :
1) forget about being "reasonable" and go full stack but the transport was not initially budgeted even at a discounted price...
2) try harder to improve my network streaming with a better server,network switch...
3) go for another brand (high end esoteric models K01x,K01xs or P02)as I can find them quite easily and cheaper .
4) forget the transport and enjoy what I currently have !

What would you recommend especially for option 3. Did anyone mix dcs gear with non dcs transport ?

thanks !
Alex

 

[jfrech]

Hi all

After now a bit more time with my dcs gear I would like to share with everyone that I am still very happy ! Music listening is so enjoyable !
Some further remarks :
- Chord Dave is a very good DAC. Feeded by the upsampler this is not a night and day difference vs the vivaldi.
- I have now the transport on loan.... Ouch. Even better than with files. Driving me nuts,don't want to go back to Cds but the sound difference is not marginal. So three options ahead of me now :
1) forget about being "reasonable" and go full stack but the transport was not initially budgeted even at a discounted price...
2) try harder to improve my network streaming with a better server,network switch...
3) go for another brand (high end esoteric models K01x,K01xs or P02)as I can find them quite easily and cheaper .
4) forget the transport and enjoy what I currently have !

What would you recommend especially for option 3. Did anyone mix dcs gear with non dcs transport ?

thanks !
Alex

Hi Alex, yes the transport is quite good. And yes ouch on the price. Do you have the clock yet? I might consider that also or first. As far as other transports, I would stick with dCS, the dCS Scarlatti Transport works very will with the Vivaldi. It has a "Vivaldi Mode" software update that allows it to run dual AES on the output to your DAC for SACD and single AES to your upsampler. I used the Scarlatti Transport for quite a while until I was able to scrape together the funds for the Vivaldi Trans. dCS dealers usually have access to "certified used" transports....

If you go with a Esoteric transport, I don't think you'll be able to play SACD's. The copyright protection may not allow it...

Sticking with #4 is always a great choice. Better cables, power cords, a good vibration reducing rack, etc help out the DAC and Upsampler too...

Good luck !!

 

[Barry2013]

Mixing DCS with non DCS means you lose the benefits of the central clocking.
A dcs clock is essential to get the best out of the dac and transport and dual AES operation is a real step up.
I agree with JF. Go for a Scarlatti Transport and clock.

 

[moby2004]

Actually I have the clock already ! For Sacd I have a limited collection ( around 100) compared to CDs. I believe Esoteric products have wordclock inputs as well.
How would you compare Scarlatti transport vs Vivaldi ? and even if not 100% comparable Scarlatti transport vs Vivaldi upsampler network input ?

 

[jfrech]

Actually I have the clock already ! For Sacd I have a limited collection ( around 100) compared to CDs. I believe Esoteric products have wordclock inputs as well.
How would you compare Scarlatti transport vs Vivaldi ? and even if not 100% comparable Scarlatti transport vs Vivaldi upsampler network input ?

The Vivaldi Transport is better. Areas of detail retrieval, ability to unravel the notes and place them in space. I suspect a Scarlatti transport is better than a Esoteric transport solely on the grounds it's make to synch up better. It's more than just having a word clock input, that's only part of the equation. And I'd say SACD playback is very hard to beat on a dCS system. You may find yourself buying more SACDs...(I certainly did)

As far as the comparison, hi rez, like 24/192, DXD and DSDx2 are pretty damn good. I don't find that I compare which is best, they are all great, I tend to pick the music and not the format. One of the best advantages of a dCS Vivaldi...it all sounds good.

As far as your clock, what clock cables are you using? Even upgrading to modestly priced cables like Cardas Clear will have huge benefit...Ditto for the AES cabling.

 

[moby2004]

sure my SACD collection is increasing years after years ! Buying them from Hong Kong and Japan . ( and I have an oppo player as well so I can rip them on .dsf)
So far stock cables but my dealer lend me 2 nordost Odin clock cables and one aes .So I am using them as well but there are so many connections that I don't know where they would be the most efficient...
By the way for SACD playback, upsampler can not be used to upsample to DSD*2 right ?

 

[jfrech]

sure my SACD collection is increasing years after years ! Buying them from Hong Kong and Japan . ( and I have an oppo player as well so I can rip them on .dsf)
So far stock cables but my dealer lend me 2 nordost Odin clock cables and one aes .So I am using them as well but there are so many connections that I don't know where they would be the most efficient...
By the way for SACD playback, upsampler can not be used to upsample to DSD*2 right ?

Correct, for SACD playback DSD only. As for as your Odin two clock cables, I'd put one to the dac and the other the upsampler using group one 44.1. Then the single AES from Trans to UPS. Those are quite good cables and I suspect you'll notice it quickly.

I haven't found ripped files from disc sound as good as discs via transport. But your mileage can definitely vary here...and obviously one path is certainly cheaper.