Audioquest HDMI cables

[Gregadd]

I got free HDMI cables when Verizon installed my cable.

 

[amirm]

In America we have a right to travel. Don't need no stinking ID or papers. Can't even be stopped unless you break the law. I'm never "in the wrong neighborhood." There is always somebody taking a stab at exclustivity. The internet is a wonderful thing. I do not have to find a technical library. Just type a couple of words and you find out just how wrong someone is.
I'm an information omnivore.

However it's amazing how many think their ill informed opinion is a fact.

Greg, this is a thread about AQ HDMI cables. We have a company principal here to discuss the same. Let's please keep the commentary to elsewhere. Create a thread on whatever you want to discuss elsewhere and we can all come and discuss it (please invite us specifically so that there is no cry as to why we came). I will be deleting further off-topic remarks.

 

[Gregadd]

Amir I had my say. With respect to comments, I hope you mean it. There seems to have been a healthy exchange in which you participated. Yet I am singled out for a warning.
I did not think it necessary but allow me to invite any member to participate in any thread I initiate or respond to any post made in the manner they deem fit. I only ask they be civil and adhere to wbf tos.

 

[Ethan Winer]

I come here for education, maybe we can set up a thread on the subject of how the measurements related to our subjective impressions?

There are several articles on my web site that let you audition various things such as how loud artifacts need to be before they're audible. Another example lets you compare the same recording made through three A/D converters ranging in price from $25 through $1,000, and so forth:

Artifact Audibility Report
Converter Comparison
Converter Loop-Back Tests
The Truth About Record Levels
Dither Report

Once you get past the live discussion part at the beginning, my AES Audio Myths Workshop video has other examples including phase shift:

AES Audio Myths

And my AES Damn Lies Workshop video lets you hear clipping versus crossover distortion when it's at 5 percent:

AES Damn Lies

 

[NorthStar]

Hmmm.... Here is the video they are talking about:

Will try to repeat Mark's analysis when I have time later tonight.

Morning Amir, this is post number two of this thread; the video doesn't show.

Also, earlier I was talking about THX certified HDMI cables...Monster has some and Kordz too. But before I post a link and a video I want to make sure it can add value in this HDMI thread, with the name AudioQuest in the title, and the very nice gentleman Mr. Bill (some of my best Blues music recordings are from the AudioQuest Music record label; some of my favorite artist musicians/singers get recorded from that music studio).

- I would like to know how you measure Jitter in a HDMI cable, its effect as well as the slew rate.
- Active HDMI cables; their handicaps with internal electronics, handshaking issues with other components in the system.
- Material: Silver versus Copper.
- THX Level 6.
- Impedance, Inductance, ...

_________

• THX Kordz: http://www.thx.com/press-releases/t...ation-program-to-support-hdmi-2-0-and-beyond/

"I've seen plenty of examples of exotic materials (at least by description) and geometries that actually reduce performance, sometimes quite significantly. Doubling up TMDS cores which causes off the charts skew is one such example. Other practices at all levels of the market can also impact performance and reliability, including twisting the DDC pair, poor soldering techniques which lead to high transition jitter and dry joints over time, over-spec capacitance, poor cable shielding, poor or NO connector shielding (very common), flimsy connectors that don't fit properly and crush/fatigue easily, poor connector pin alignment and tension which can lead to irregular contacts... the list goes on. Commoditization and downwards price pressure causes a general reduction in quality broadly as the only way to make a cable cheaper is to literally make it cheaper. All while material costs and labor costs in China continue to rise. At the other end of the market others try for fancy looks and marketing in order to go the opposite direction and maintain high prices. In all cases many assume that HDMI Licensing keep compliance and performance in their net, but in reality they can't as most brands out there aren't even HDMI Adopters."

___________

___________

If anything I post is against the rules please just let me know and I will delete it. My sincere intention is to learn, nothing else.
In my own theater system @ home I use a variety of HDMI cables from different brands (5 different brands I believe, or 6), and they all work but I don't have long runs (longest is 2 meters and 2.5 meters), and I don't have any 4K components (UHD TV, UHD receiver, UHD BR player). I also have some affordable AudioQuest HDMI cables that I bought several years ago.

Eventually UHD is going to be part of my world, just like fiber optic, so might as well be prepared and learn.
I am already reading some with the new Samsung UHD BR player...and it is exciting, and the cost of admission for their first BR player (street) is less than $300 (awesome!).

I don't care about THX certification, but I care about what they do to get them certified. ...The tests that count, the things that makes a better HDMI cable with best audio and video transmission in this age of UHD picture and 3D audio immersion. ...And the reliability, and the friendly handshakes with the electronics they interconnect. This is the beginning of Ultra High Definition and Resolution...HDMI version 2.0a and beyond with HDCP 2.2 ... and with it comes many things...some more important than others.

Widescreen Review is also a source of information about this very subject; I have several Issues of WR on HDMI articles from various companies...from affordable HDMI cables to some that are more expensive. ...And Active ones (for longer runs).

Version 1.2 is prehistory.
Version 1.4 is becoming part of history.
Version 2.0 is today. ...Then with the letter "a" and later on "b" and ...

Gauges vary from 28AWG to 24AWG...are there more?

 

[amirm]

Morning Amir, this is post number two of this thread; the video doesn't show.

It was taken down when Bill tried to investigate the issue.

Also, earlier I was talking about THX certified HDMI cables...Monster has some and Kordz too. But before I post a link and a video I want to make sure it can add value in this HDMI thread, with the name AudioQuest in the title, and the very nice gentleman Mr. Bill?

That's OK.

 

[amirm]

Eventually UHD is going to be part of my world, just like fiber optic, so might as well be prepared and learn.

I have a 6 foot generic HDMI cable being driven by my computer to my UHD TV. It is running at 30 Hz but full color (4:4:4). No issues.

 

[spazmatron]

There are several articles on my web site that let you audition various things such as how loud artifacts need to be before they're audible. Another example lets you compare the same recording made through three A/D converters ranging in price from $25 through $1,000, and so forth:

Artifact Audibility Report
Converter Comparison
Converter Loop-Back Tests
The Truth About Record Levels
Dither Report

Once you get past the live discussion part at the beginning, my AES Audio Myths Workshop video has other examples including phase shift:

AES Audio Myths

And my AES Damn Lies Workshop video lets you hear clipping versus crossover distortion when it's at 5 percent:

AES Damn Lies

Thanks Ethan, really enjoying your contributions. I looked up a few old threads where you have participated and found you interesting, informative and amusing too boot. I tend to absorb information but never end up making firm assertions, I am happy living in the question.

Would be cool to see you in the music threads..,

 

[Ethan Winer]

Thanks Earl. I'm allowed to view and post only in this section, though that's probably for the best. I have a bunch of music stuff on YouTube, including a complete course in music theory:

Ethan's YouTube Channel
Basic Music Theory

 

[NorthStar]

Ethan, what brand of HDMI cables are you using when watching a high-res/high-def movie in your room?

 

[Ethan Winer]

Ethan, what brand of HDMI cables are you using when watching a high-res/high-def movie in your room?

LOL, I have no idea! I just use the HDMI wires that came free with my Sony Blu-ray player and my Dish Network box. Though I did buy one wire:

My setup is slightly complex because I have both a 65-inch RPTV and a large screen and projector. So I let my receiver switch the component video sources going to the TV set, and I use a separate HDMI switch to select sources going to the projector in the back of the room. When I got my projector I bought a 50-foot HDMI wire for $55 from MonoPrice to go from the HDMI switch in the front of the room to the projector in the rear. I was concerned that 50 feet would be too long, but it's worked perfectly for years now without incident. If you or anyone else cares, I recently made a video tour of my living room home theater:

Ethan's Living Room Home Theater Tour

--Ethan

 

[spazmatron]

LOL, I have no idea! I just use the HDMI wires that came free with my Sony Blu-ray player and my Dish Network box. Though I did buy one wire:

My setup is slightly complex because I have both a 65-inch RPTV and a large screen and projector. So I let my receiver switch the component video sources going to the TV set, and I use a separate HDMI switch to select sources going to the projector in the back of the room. When I got my projector I bought a 50-foot HDMI wire for $55 from MonoPrice to go from the HDMI switch in the front of the room to the projector in the rear. I was concerned that 50 feet would be too long, but it's worked perfectly for years now without incident. If you or anyone else cares, I recently made a video tour of my living room home theater:

Ethan's Living Room Home Theater Tour

--Ethan

i watched that, thanks it was great.

 

[NorthStar]

LOL, I have no idea! I just use the HDMI wires that came free with my Sony Blu-ray player and my Dish Network box. Though I did buy one wire:

My setup is slightly complex because I have both a 65-inch RPTV and a large screen and projector. So I let my receiver switch the component video sources going to the TV set, and I use a separate HDMI switch to select sources going to the projector in the back of the room. When I got my projector I bought a 50-foot HDMI wire for $55 from MonoPrice to go from the HDMI switch in the front of the room to the projector in the rear. I was concerned that 50 feet would be too long, but it's worked perfectly for years now without incident. If you or anyone else cares, I recently made a video tour of my living room home theater:

Ethan's Living Room Home Theater Tour

--Ethan

Cool Ethan. ...I've seen it before.

Are you into 3D, Picture & Sound? ...And what about UHD? ...And, your 50-foot long HDMI cable from MonoPrice...active or passive?

I think the most I paid for a 1-meter long HDMI cable was $80 (High Speed - Rocketfish), and I do have three or four Audioquest HDMI cables (HDMI-A model).
Solid gold plated connectors, nice strong jacket, well designed interior with several round colored small wires, they show graphs on the back of the box, and I can't remember how much I paid for their two-meter ones...perhaps fifty bucks.

 

[Gregadd]

While I remain critical of ABX in genreal for hearing test a visual test solves one of the problems.It eliminates memory. One can vview both choices simtaneously. Yo can even freeze frame.

 

[Ethan Winer]

Are you into 3D, Picture & Sound? ...And what about UHD? ...And, your 50-foot long HDMI cable from MonoPrice...active or passive?

I'm not that much into 3D. I don't know what Picture & Sound is other than stuff on DVD and Blu-ray. What is UHD? Do you mean 4k? I've seen it and it's great, though I'm happy with my huge screen at regular 1080p HD. It's like being at an IMAX! My 50-foot HDMI wire is passive.

--Ethan

 

[esldude]

While I remain critical of ABX in genreal for hearing test a visual test solves one of the problems.It eliminates memory. One can vview both choices simtaneously. Yo can even freeze frame.

Well actually you view things in a series of saccades where your eye moves focus all around different points. Which is why you normally don't see the blind spot almost smack dab in the middle of your retina.

I find the most useful for comparing visuals the ability to instantly flip from one to the other. Any differences jump out more than viewing side by side. Much more in fact.

 

[Ethan Winer]

i watched that, thanks it was great.

Thanks. I realize most folks here live far from me, but I always welcome visitors if someone is close (or passing through). My system is unique with so much attention paid to acoustics, and a video tour like this is not the same as hearing it in person.

--Ethan

 

[Gregadd]

Well actually you view things in a series of saccades where your eye moves focus all around different points. Which is why you normally don't see the blind spot almost smack dab in the middle of your retina.

I find the most useful for comparing visuals the ability to instantly flip from one to the other. Any differences jump out more than viewing side by side. Much more in fact.

Not for me. It's much better to find a falw or attribute on one screen and then look for it on the other. With freeze frame you can study it as long as you desire. Looking at one screen your memeory of what you saw is gone. I 'm talking subtle differences.

 

[NorthStar]

I'm not that much into 3D. I don't know what Picture & Sound is other than stuff on DVD and Blu-ray. What is UHD? Do you mean 4k? I've seen it and it's great, though I'm happy with my huge screen at regular 1080p HD. It's like being at an IMAX! My 50-foot HDMI wire is passive.

--Ethan

:b You should, 3D is the new 3-dimensional rage...James Cameron, Peter Jackson, Ridley Scott, Michael Bay, ...they all shoot in 3D, with 3D cameras.
So that's 3D Picture (IMAX (((real 3D))), Blu-ray 3D, ...).

3D Audio immersion is from Dolby Atmos, DTS:X and Auro-3D...mainly...here in North America; but there are others which some use 128 channels (speakers) all around the room plus several subwoofers, in Europe...they go by different names. ...IOSONO, etc.
So that's 3D Sound (a 7.1.4 setup would be your bag in your own room); you just need a new receiver (about $500) and four speakers you put above your head, on the ceiling. ...Very very easy and affordable for a real 3D sound immersive experience, from your DVDs and Blu-rays...with the included up-mixer.
? Just for info: https://www.barco.com/en/Products/3D-sound

UHD is 4K resolution (Ultra High Definition) with HDR, expanded color gamut, blacker blacks, better contrast, brightness, clarity, details, pixels, ...brief better overall picture quasi 3-Dimensional. It looks like real life through a window you just finished cleaning in your living room, with the best window cleaner available on the North American and Japanese and European market.

4K 3D front projector is in your future, I can tell. :b ? ? https://www.barco.com/en/Products/P...-with-flexible-brightness-and-resolution.aspx

Home is the real deal, IMAX is just too big, and you have to drive to get there.

* Passive HDMI cable is best, because active ones have more issues with HDMI handshakes...the small active electronics inside the cable.
Pain in the butt to pick the right one with our own gear...for best system synergy and synchronicity.

Always a pleasure chatting science and the best with you Ethan. :b

 

[Don Hills]

Not forme. It;s much better to find a falw or attribute on one screen and thenn look for it on the other. With freeze frame you can study it as long as you desire, Looking at one screen your memeory of what you saw is gone. I 'm talking subtle differences.

You mey not have understood esldude's description of his comparison method.
Take the two (freeze) frames. Overlay them and switch rapidly from one to the other. Any differences show up as a flicker. Your eyes are very sensitive to this.
I've previously argued this with someone on another forum. His claim was that there was a visible difference between two images, part of a claim that the mere act of copying a file could degrade it although the copy was bit-identical to the original. The suggested test method was to place the images side-by-side on my monitor, the differences should be visible. All it proved was that my monitor needed recalibrating. Laying the images on top of each other and flicking between them showed no differences. Deliberately making small changes to one image, invisible when compared side by side, showed up as flicker.