Alsyvox planars...prepare to sell your Magico's, YG's, Wilson's, Cessaro's. Maggie's, and all others!!
- Thread starter DaveyF
- Start date
I have yet to hear a set of stereo speakers which does not benefit from a well placed four box passive subsystem with a proper analog controller and separate amps or two stereo amps all on its own separate line.
Problem is, a coned sub will never, ever match the speed and character of planars.
For me they work as bass enhancement for films, but never quite mesh for music and haven't on any system I've ever heard.
I remember when Apogee tried mating their planars with subs in the "Grand" series, you could always instantly tell when a frequency crossed over to the coned sub; the same is true with Martin-Logans where their electrostatic driver crosses over to the woofer cone.
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With all due respect I do not believe that you have experienced a proper sub array with the right equipment and properly set up. Equipment and how to set up the four sub array have progressed and improved markedly since the days when the Apogee speakers were in vogue. Even now most sub systems do not use the right equipment and are not set up properly. But when done properly with the right equipment any stereo system will improve.
There can be "plenty of bass," and at the same time more bass could be even more engaging.
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Even if this is stipulated as correct, it doesn't dispose of the real question. The question is -- even assuming you are correct -- whether the cone subwoofers afford benefits which more than offset on a net basis a slight incompatibility in speed with the planars.
I submit that this is because the cones are in the bottom of the column. When I use the Gryphon woofer towers (8 x 8" cones in a 6 1/2 foot tall tower) I hear no localization near the floor as you hear in the designs you mention.
My Carravaggios are mated with 2 Wilson Benesch subs. The combination sounds excellent and the sub “speed” seems to easily keep pace with the planars.
I have experienced the Wilson Benesch subs in three AG Trio G3 systems. It is a fantastic subwoofer!
That must be an amazing combination you have there!
A big fan of this statement...and have read all of the subsequent posts in between. for me personally, I accept that there is no perfect in any system. It is a combination of strengths and weaknesses, making the most of the former and shoring up the latter. And even then, the blend between the two is also important so that one does not end up with a 'glaring' standout characteristic. And then there is personal taste.
On that basis for me, I absolutely agree with the above statement in the systems I have heard...including 4-tower systems where it was clear to get that all-out sensation the woofer towers made a [literally] massive difference. But even in systems where the subs were not part of the original design.
BUT, and here is the BUT...even where the alignment of speed is not exact, I admit I would still take the added bass because of what it does for sense of space and venue, for the sense of rooted-to-the-living-room-floor realism and foundation.
And then finally...we are still waiting for Todd to tell us about how his experience has been with the PureLow panel subwoofers for both power, bass and panel speed!
I have been playing with SUB placement this year and i really like the SUB placed in the center .
With stereo Ls you basically have an Energy gap in between the Ls .
With stereo Ls you basically have an Energy gap in between the Ls .
Interesting...its unfortunate we cannot accommodate that in our room which opens into another room so the middle in between our speakers is how you move from one room to the other...big space 13m long and 5m wide, but nevertheless, nothing in between the speakers. For us, its more about dual subs or sub towers in an ideal if we can get it to work someday. But in the meantime, its sub in the opposite corner professionally installed.
I guess its also a matter of how high in frequency the SUB plays /contributes .
The lower the freq the more omnidirectional the sound .
The SUB i design also plays into the midrange , acting more like a center channel
Wise decision, but no energy gap.
In the middlle you have fewer room modes in the bass range( spherical radiation) . In the middle, you have +6dB more sound pressure from both main speaker; otherwise, you would not be able to locate voices exactly in the middle.
I think the music industry should move to 3 channel audio for optimum performance
Recording / Reproduction .
Recording / Reproduction .
The devices have been around for a long time, but the music industry has forgotten them, just like quadraphonic sound.
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