Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

[Steve Williams]

Yes I know.
what I was commenting on was that i remembered it when the TAS was first installed but not sure it was there at the end. Perhaps I was loving the music too much and if it was there, no big deal

 

[Taiko Audio]

Having a picture of an Extreme under a piano is sure to get audiophile's in trouble with their spouses the world over ("See honey, we can put it over there out of the way" I promise that will move post pandemic, when we have house guests again...

I thought it was a fun addition. Which reminds me I need to find one in my mailbox involving a cat loving the Extreme.

 

[matthias]

Hard to pinpoint the exact cause, RoonAppliance now utilizes ~120 execution threads and ~1.5Gb memory, and yes there is an increase in network activity.

With that said, the question is how relevant it all is as it still only occupies ~3% of the Extreme’s memory capacity with a below 0.2% CPU load during music playback. Couple that to a now virtually identical sound from the ~0.3Gb / 5 threads TAS application appears to make it more a matter of how the environment is configured.

So there seem to be no significant SQ differences between Roon and TAS.

Matt

 

[Taiko Audio]

I am listening to more music daily than I can ever remember (easily 5+ hours a day and up to 15 hours).

I wouldn’t mind spending my own retirement like that one day

 

[Taiko Audio]

So there seem to be no significant SQ differences between Roon and TAS.

Matt

With the last update applied they sound almost identical. TAS does have a very slight edge in transparancy and detail at this stage. But it’s still early days for TAS.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Found it:

 

[matthias]

Found it:

View attachment 66819

Ha, a warm place with low RFI

Matt

 

[Steve Williams]

Found it:

View attachment 66819
t

the lesson to be learned here is that the Extreme is always on and becomes only warm to the touch so much so that pets love to snooze on it

 

[microstrip]

Found it:

View attachment 66819

Doesn't it void the warranty?

 

[wil]

With the last update applied they sound almost identical. TAS does have a very slight edge in transparancy and detail at this stage. But it’s still early days for TAS.

Interesting. So, (please correct me if I have this wrong): Even with TAS caching streamed files and playing them back from RAM and so removing associated network noise, the Taiko/Roon update is still virtually the same as the TAS beta.

I wonder what would explain this? Shouldn't the isolation from the network give the TAS beta additionally better sq?

 

[Taiko Audio]

Doesn't it void the warranty?

Admittedly we did not test this particular application, I would expect more serious issues should the cat decide to start using it as a litter box.

 

[Taiko Audio]

I wonder what would explain this?

A larger degree of immunity for noise induced by processing overhead on the server part of core-endpoint distributed music playback software.

 

[oldmustang]

Found it:

View attachment 66819

That’s where I take my naps too — right on top of my Taiko Extreme. The cat has exceptionally good taste.

Steve Z

 

[ray-dude]

That’s where I take my naps too — right on top of my Taiko Extreme. The cat has exceptionally good taste.

Steve Z

Interesting which side the cat chose. The CPU side is the warmer one, but the transformer side has more vibration. Maybe the cat prefers the purring?

 

[Taiko Audio]

Interesting. So, (please correct me if I have this wrong): Even with TAS caching streamed files and playing them back from RAM and so removing associated network noise, the Taiko/Roon update is still virtually the same as the TAS beta.

I wonder what would explain this? Shouldn't the isolation from the network give the TAS beta additionally better sq?

I'd be inclined to state there's no such thing as network isolation but that would be controversial so let's call that hypothetical. Going from that as an hypothesis your networking setup is just another means of voicing or shaping sound, like changing interconnects or footers. Something interesting to try is pulling the network cable while playing music, while using different switches and/or network setups and gauge the SQ delta between having the cable connected and disconnected. Someone just using a simple Netgear GS108 will likely find the difference to be pretty minor. The best way to go would be for all Extreme users to use the same switch, we can then configure the Extreme's network ports to interact optimally with that switch, leading to better, or at least more consistent performance across various systems. Having come to that realisation we are now designing a switch ourselves. We are not interested in competing in the switch market, but we are interested in getting similar performance for all Extreme owners, so this switch will only be available to our customers. If it weren't for Corona it would have been available already, I estimate it's about 4 months away now.

 

[heebrog]

Hard to pinpoint the exact cause, RoonAppliance now utilizes ~120 execution threads and ~1.5Gb memory, and yes there is an increase in network activity.

With that said, the question is how relevant it all is as it still only occupies ~3% of the Extreme’s memory capacity with a below 0.2% CPU load during music playback. Couple that to a now virtually identical sound from the ~0.3Gb / 5 threads TAS application appears to make it more a matter of how the environment is configured.

Hi Emile,

For reference, how many execution threads and memory was was RoonAppliance using before the "tweak"?

G

 

[matthias]

Regarding the discussions prior to this post between Steve and others, I have personally recommended Steve to not change anything for the following, imho very solid reasons:
Steve has no wired ethernet in his room, he uses a Netgear Orbi with a single high quality copper ethernetcable to his Extreme, so this is a wireless connection, and an area I need to spend some time on to investigate the potential merits off.

Hi Emile,

did you find some time to investigate the potential merits of WiFi?
Thanks

Matt

 

[octaviars]

Interesting. So, (please correct me if I have this wrong): Even with TAS caching streamed files and playing them back from RAM and so removing associated network noise, the Taiko/Roon update is still virtually the same as the TAS beta.

I dont know if this applies to all Roon core machines but mine downloads the song instantly from Qobuz when I hit play. I can see the activity at my routers SFP port being high for a couple of seconds when I hit play then it goes down. So effectively I can disconnect my network and it will finish the song anyway.

 

[Steve Williams]

Regarding the discussions prior to this post between Steve and others, I have personally recommended Steve to not change anything for the following, imho very solid reasons:
Steve has no wired ethernet in his room, he uses a Netgear Orbi with a single high quality copper ethernetcable to his Extreme, so this is a wireless connection, and an area I need to spend some time on to investigate the potential merits off. It would be quite obvious to purchase a LPS for the Netgear Orbi, and undoubtedly have a change in sound, Steve is willing to do just that, but since it's all a work in progress, I have adviced him to keep his money in his pocket for now. Do note Steve is reporting more then satisfying performance from his setup, even in direct comparison to his vinyl and tape.

That is exactly how I bring signal from my Orbi Router to my sound room. I stream wireless from my Orbi Router to to an Orbi Satellite that has a SMPS and several Ethernet inputs. I must admit that the only changes I made to my network was to buy an updated cable modem card which is in the same room as my router

I also purchased an ARRIS SURFboard SB8200 DOCSIS 3.1 Cable Modem and replaced the cheap SMPS with a LPS . Also I replaced the SMPS on the Orbi Satellite in my sound room with a second LPS. Those changes helped my sound quality immensely. As Emile stated when I built my sound room I did not factor in bring coax cable into the sound room. My only option short of bringing cable from downstairs to my sound room through the walls and ceiling was to stream wirelessly which I have done from day1 and have been totally immersed in the sound.

Finally the position of my satellite in my sound room occupies space which by all accounts would be considered incorrect....I have placed my Orbi Satellite directly behind my huge Lamm amps and power supply and there is no audible extraneous noise. Seeing the picture has raised much comment however I can say that I have found zero negative sonic changes with my satellite on the ground behind my amp

https://whatsbestforum.com/media/0-jpeg.378/

 

[Mike Lavigne]

The best way to go would be for all Extreme users to use the same switch, we can then configure the Extreme's network ports to interact optimally with that switch, leading to better, or at least more consistent performance across various systems.

makes sense.

Having come to that realization we are now designing a switch ourselves. We are not interested in competing in the switch market, but we are interested in getting similar performance for all Extreme owners, so this switch will only be available to our customers. If it weren't for Corona it would have been available already, I estimate it's about 4 months away now.

can't wait.

.....keeping Extreme.......as extreme as possible.