MSB SELECT DAC Video - Factory tour

[asiufy]

Hi,

MSB has posted a pretty cool and in-depth video of the development and manufacturing process behind the MSB SELECT DAC.

I've visited the factory and I've seen some of those machines at work, but unfortunately it was before the introduction of the SELECT...

But anyone that has compared MSB's old (3-4 years ago) finishing to current product will perceive the benefits of their new, entirely in-house build process. The Analog DAC itself was only possible in its current form factor because of the (then) new machines.


cheers,
alex

 

[amirm]

Hi Alex. I edited your post to make the video inline.

THanks for posting that. I feel like a kid in candy store watching a fully integrated plant from mechanical to PCB assembly!

At shows I find the MSB DACs to sound excellent.

How much is the MSB Select?

 

[Steve Williams]

$89,950 with a 10 year warranty and IIRC free upgrades

 

[Johnny Vinyl]

$89,950????????????????????????????????????????????????? Really now!

 

[Steve Williams]

$89,950????????????????????????????????????????????????? Really now!

But you get free updates

 

[Johnny Vinyl]

But you get free updates

And the 10-year warranty...

I suppose I was a little hasty .

 

[MadFloyd]

And the 10-year warranty...

I suppose I was a little hasty .

No you weren't. No source should ever cost more than $85,000.

 

[KeithR]

from the (killer) video, it seems like the DAC is really designed to be used as a preamp - so its two boxes in one. not that it justifies the price, but its a bit more palatable. this seems to be for digital only folks in asia who don't have 100k vinyl setups.

on the analog side, we now have 50k+ phono stages now (Pass, Vac, Soulution, Boulder, etc) - phono stages! i think that's more mindblowing.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

from the (killer) video, it seems like the DAC is really designed to be used as a preamp - so its two boxes in one. not that it justifies the price, but its a bit more palatable. this seems to be for digital only folks in asia who don't have 100k vinyl setups.

on the analog side, we now have 50k+ phono stages now (Pass, Vac, Soulution, Boulder, etc) - phono stages! i think that's more mindblowing.

At least the depreciation of an uber phono stage is less than digital though.

 

[KeithR]

At least the depreciation of an uber phono stage is less than digital though.

how long until that phono stage is updated- 5 years? not exactly upgradable.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

how long until that phono stage is updated- 5 years? not exactly upgradable.

The point I was alluding to mainly was that it doesn't need to be - it is more a static technology. Digital advances seems to change on a daily basis.

 

[Johnny Vinyl]

The point I was alluding to mainly was that it doesn't need to be - it is more a static technology. Digital advances seems to change on a daily basis.

At these price points everything is static.... Really, how much improvement can there be?

 

[Audiophile Bill]

At these price points everything is static.... Really, how much improvement can there be?

True enough! But if I had a large sum that had to be spent, I rather put that into amps / analogue source / speakers than digital but each to their own!

 

[KeithR]

The point I was alluding to mainly was that it doesn't need to be - it is more a static technology. Digital advances seems to change on a daily basis.

i think its all ridiculous, but don't feel analog is "static" these days. take the cartridge market for one.

 

[Johnny Vinyl]

True enough! But if I had a large sum that had to be spent, I rather put that into amps / analogue source / speakers than digital but each to their own!

Even though I could personally never afford these types of products I'm not against the introduction of them entirely, unless they're just catering to the very well-to-do with no real improvements. And even then I don't mind as surely there is a bit of a market for them as well. I would really like to see some trickle-down implementations.

 

[LarsS]

Not a trickle down product, but using MSB's discrete DAC modules at a slightly more modest price - - > http://www.rockna-audio.com/products/wavedream-dac



Price list (Euro incl VAT) feb. 2015

-Wavedream Platinum DAC – Single Ended 5.880
-Wavedream Platinum DAC – Balanced 8.280

-Wavedream Signature DAC – Single Ended 11.880
-Wavedream Signature DAC – Balanced 14.280

 

[amirm]

Not a trickle down product, but using MSB's discrete DAC modules at a slightly more modest price - - > http://www.rockna-audio.com/products/wavedream-dac

As I was watching that video, I was wondering how much more reasonable it would be cost wise without all the machining for the case. Good to know someone already went there .

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Even though I could personally never afford these types of products I'm not against the introduction of them entirely, unless they're just catering to the very well-to-do with no real improvements. And even then I don't mind as surely there is a bit of a market for them as well. I would really like to see some trickle-down implementations.

Agree - I am definitely not anti these products! I love to ogle and dream.

 

[asiufy]

Amir,

It would be cheaper, but what's expensive (IMHO) in there is the actual DAC modules, of which there are 16 of them. If anything, long term, it should be cheaper to have the machines in-house than outsource production of good quality casework. I've seen the finishing on the SELECT, and it's exquisite. The display, even though it's lo-res, is gorgeous and very functional.

It's a crazy expensive unit, I agree. But these DAC modules are pluggable units, that can be upgraded, on the field. Couple that with the 10 year free upgrade policy, and you have a state-of-the-art DAC for 10 years. Plus, if, say, 5 years from now, USB 3 becomes a "de facto" standard, you can just replace the USB input, instead of selling your DAC to buy a new one with the new port...

Now, when we had the unit, we hooked it directly to D'Agostino monoblocs, as well as going through the D'Agostino preamp. There was very, very little difference between the two, and most tellingly, I felt NONE of the typical effects of going DAC direct: no forwardness, no glare, no lack of bass and/or dynamics... But we're talking $35k preamp territory here.

And all MSB DACs, not only the SELECT, can act as a full function preamp, with analog inputs (XLR or RCA), so analog folks are not excluded, as they can hook up their phono stages directly to the MSB DAC of their choice. So, if you already have a killer preamp that you love, like the D'Ag or the darTZeel 18NS (two of the best, IMHO), there's no need to ditch them. But there's definitely a gain/saving to be had by using the SELECT directly to a power amp.

Of course, as explained in the video, the preamp section in the SELECT is considerably better than on the other MSB DACs...

We're expecting to have another go at it with the SELECT in the store in about 2 weeks... Everybody's welcome to stop by and check it out!

 

[PeterA]

We are discussing the manufacturing, the price, the features. Edit: It is a very well made and informative video of the manufacturing process. Asiufy, could you describe how it sounds compared to some of the other DACs out there?

It's fun to read about super expensive things knowing that we will never own them. But at least we can relate to great photos, g forces and 0-60 times for the latest Ferrari. All things that we can relate to. What does this video tell us about how the thing sounds? Edit: I slowly realize that that is not the intension fo this video.

Amir raises a good point about the machining. I've watched factory videos of SME and Magico but somehow that machining seems to relate to function and performance. The lettering and shape of these two boxes are expensive and I wonder if they actually effect the sonics? Edit: Asiufy, is the machining for aesthetics only, or is there some function?

This is not your simple designer in his basement churning out a few boxes. It surprises me that they have invested in this manufacturing capability for a relatively small digital company. Edit: The investment is impressive.