Taiko Audio Extreme Router

[audio42]

Thank you Ulrich.
Like you, I noticed a huge improvement with the addition of a high quality switch - in my case the Reiki superswitch and LPS. I had an Auralic G2 streaming transport from my previous system but it was clearly inferior to the built in streaming client in the T+A unit. I will note that it took 100 hours or so for the DAC to come to life. Indeed, at first, I thought i made a mistake in purchasing it. It just needed some time as it is now very, very good. And yes - ECM is a go to label for me.
In any case, sounds like I’ll need to figure out a way to audition a Taiko extreme in one of my systems. Sigh. I’d like to find the end of this road. Some day.
Thanks again for the feedback.
Kind regards,
Mark

Hi Mark,

The good thing is that the Extreme is still a top notch source and from the various hints and tidbits of information, it will continue to receive updates and improve. This makes it worth the investment, IMHO.

I came from an Innuos Statement and I was pretty shocked how much better the Extreme plays music with XDMS.

This could be your end game

Arun

 

[MusicFellow]

I have a question regarding the Ethernet connection to the Taiko Router. If I remember correctly a standard Cat6 Ethernet cable (nothing audiophile) was recommended. This is what I use. Using the standard cat6 for me implies that the audio network starts at the Taiko Router so everything downstream (plus the power supply to the Router) matters sonically.

Still, I'm wondering if a high quality Ethernet cable 1.) from home Router to Taiko Router and 2.) also from Ethernet wall outlet to home router yields an improvement in sound quality. Side note: I power my home router via the DCD and this improves the sound quality. So my question is: Do the Ethernet cables in position 1.) and 2.) matter? Has somebody experience with high quality Ethernet cables?
Somewhere I think it was mentioned that Ethernet cables work as "tone-control" cables and secondly that maybe it's due to the effect of shielding, but these are just some vague thoughts in the back of my mind.

Bottom line: I'm happy to hear any experiences in this area. Maybe these are some easy to fix bottlenecks that doesn't cost a future and can lift the system's sound quality.

 

[nonesup]

My personal experience is that the Ethernet cable between the ISP router and the Taiko router matters, as does the Ethernet cable between the NAS and the router (Taiko or ISP), as well as the power supply of the ISP router and the NAS.

 

[jaxdr]

I have a question regarding the Ethernet connection to the Taiko Router. If I remember correctly a standard Cat6 Ethernet cable (nothing audiophile) was recommended. This is what I use. Using the standard cat6 for me implies that the audio network starts at the Taiko Router so everything downstream (plus the power supply to the Router) matters sonically.

Still, I'm wondering if a high quality Ethernet cable 1.) from home Router to Taiko Router and 2.) also from Ethernet wall outlet to home router yields an improvement in sound quality. Side note: I power my home router via the DCD and this improves the sound quality. So my question is: Do the Ethernet cables in position 1.) and 2.) matter? Has somebody experience with high quality Ethernet cables?
Somewhere I think it was mentioned that Ethernet cables work as "tone-control" cables and secondly that maybe it's due to the effect of shielding, but these are just some vague thoughts in the back of my mind
Bottom line: I'm happy to hear any experiences in this area. Maybe these are some easy to fix bottlenecks that doesn't cost a future and can lift the system's sound quality.

Yes, you will notice an uptick in sound quality if you insert a better LAN cable from your home router to the Taiko router. Likewise I also heard a difference when I placed a better LAN cable from my modem to my home router.

 

[MusicFellow]

Thank you nonesup and jaxdr! That was my gut feeling as well. Now comes the costly part, haha...

I use the Melco C1-D20 (2x) downstream of the Taiko Router, as nonesup recommended and which I really like.
For the Ethernet cables I'd lean to Shunyata, just because I use Shunyata for all my power, Signal and also USB cable (and really like their (lack of) sound signature) and the digital cables are recommended and highly thought of by many.

Sooo, the questions in my mind are:
1.) Is the home router to Taiko router Ethernet cable more important and the one to tackle first?
2.) @ jaxdr: I see you are using an Omega-X Ethernet cable... is it for this / these purposes? ... and did you compare it to the original Omega Ethernet? The X version are nearly 5k in Euroland so nearly 10k for two... ouch... The former Omega can be had for around 2k though...
My thought was maybe a "old" Omega to start with between the home router and the Taiko router and maybe something less costly like a Furutech LAN-8 NCF Plus upstream of the home router.
Any experiences / recommendations are welcome!

​

 

[jaxdr]

Thank you nonesup and jaxdr! That was my gut feeling as well. Now comes the costly part, haha...

I use the Melco C1-D20 (2x) downstream of the Taiko Router, as nonesup recommended and which I really like.
For the Ethernet cables I'd lean to Shunyata, just because I use Shunyata for all my power, Signal and also USB cable (and really like their (lack of) sound signature) and the digital cables are recommended and highly thought of by many.

Sooo, the questions in my mind are:
1.) Is the home router to Taiko router Ethernet cable more important and the one to tackle first?
2.) @ jaxdr: I see you are using an Omega-X Ethernet cable... is it for this / these purposes? ... and did you compare it to the original Omega Ethernet? The X version are nearly 5k in Euroland so nearly 10k for two... ouch... The former Omega can be had for around 2k though...
My thought was maybe a "old" Omega to start with between the home router and the Taiko router and maybe something less costly like a Furutech LAN-8 NCF Plus upstream of the home router.
Any experiences / recommendations are welcome!

​

MusicFellow, first I also like the Melco C1 and I'm currently using it from my Taiko switch to the I/O. Previously I had the Network Acoustics Muon Pro(NAMP) and the Omega-X at that location but found that my system performs better with the Melco C1 between the Taiko switch and I/O and the NAMP/Omega-X between the Taiko router and Taiko switch.

To address your specific questions above:
#1) I do not have a definitive answer for this specific question as every system is different. I would recommend that after you have sourced your preferred ethernet cable(s) that you trial them at different locations to determine the best performance in your system. The answer will likely be dependent upon which location provides the best opportunity to reduce digital noise in your system. Sorry I cannot be more specific.

#2) I selected the Omega-X due to it's ability to manage the noise in our digital network. I did trial a few other ethernet cables but did not trial the original Omega. After installing the NAMP I wanted to maintain as much noise reduction as possible and the Omega-X does this very well. However given that you may have the need for a couple ethernet cables I would believe 2 of the original Omega's would perhaps provide more noise management than a single Omega-X.

I am currently trialing the QSA Discovery Veridion ethernet cables between my home router and my audio system which is a distance of 15 feet. I have trialed several fiber solutions here but prefer my current ethernet cable. I am very impressed with what I am hearing with the QSA Discovery ethernet cable and at $250 appear to be 'value' champs. Still early days however other reports on these seem to be quite positive.

Finally, I have been surprised at how much better my system sounds now with the reduction of digital noise that has been polluting the signal before my I/O. The addition of switches, better cables, the NAMP have created a much better listening experience. Of course much of this is owed to the Olympus and I/O!

Don't take my word or anyone else's as to what will work best for you in your system. Trial various solutions at various locations...you might be surprised at how much better your sound can become!

 

[MusicFellow]

Alright, alriiight... thank you so much for the time to write this detailed report! This is indeed very helpful - especially since the combinations one can try can easily multiply. With your experience it is much easier to start.

To be precise I just received and opened my second Melco so I can't return it.... and go straight away to the Muon Pro / Omega-X option. So here are some follow-up questions:

- In your location between the Taiko Router and Switch: Are you using two Omega-X or just one (after the Muon Pro)?
- Since I now have a second Melco: Is it possible to e.g. go from Taiko Router to Muon Pro via Omega-X and then out via the Melco cable with the SFP module to the Switch; in other words can the Muon Pro be used with SFP / DAC?
- What cable are you currently using from home router to Taiko Router? Another Omega-X?
- Asking a bit more generally: Did you try the Omega-X before the Taiko router and if so would you say that it's best to let the Taiko Router first do it's "Network isolation thing" and then use Muon Pro / Omega-X to fine tune ... or the other way around.
Of course one could get 3-4 Omega-Xs, but how many kidneys does a person have, haha...

 

[jaxdr]

Alright, alriiight... thank you so much for the time to write this detailed report! This is indeed very helpful - especially since the combinations one can try can easily multiply. With your experience it is much easier to start.

To be precise I just received and opened my second Melco so I can't return it.... and go straight away to the Muon Pro / Omega-X option. So here are some follow-up questions:

- In your location between the Taiko Router and Switch: Are you using two Omega-X or just one (after the Muon Pro)?
- Since I now have a second Melco: Is it possible to e.g. go from Taiko Router to Muon Pro via Omega-X and then out via the Melco cable with the SFP module to the Switch; in other words can the Muon Pro be used with SFP / DAC?
- What cable are you currently using from home router to Taiko Router? Another Omega-X?
- Asking a bit more generally: Did you try the Omega-X before the Taiko router and if so would you say that it's best to let the Taiko Router first do it's "Network isolation thing" and then use Muon Pro / Omega-X to fine tune ... or the other way around.
Of course one could get 3-4 Omega-Xs, but how many kidneys does a person have, haha...

First, I am using just one Omega-X with the Muon Pro(NAMP). Network Acoustics provides a short (.75 meter) ethernet cable when you purchase the Muon-Pro so I am using that on the input side of the Muon Pro. You could use a 2nd Omega for both input and output with the Muon Pro if desired. But like you say "how many kidneys does a person have?".
Second, unfortunately the Muon Pro (as it is currently configured) would not be able to take advantage of the Melco DAC cable. Ethernet cable in and out only. However I have been told there will be a new product from Network Acoustics that may replace the current Muon Pro. You may want to wait and see what this new product entails.
Third, I have been using a Sablon ethernet cable that Mark custom built for me (15 ft length) between my home router and my audio system/Taiko router.
Fourth, because of the length of cable needed I have not trialed an Omega at this location. I have tested the Muon Pro before and after the Taiko router and it sounded best when I inserted the Muon Pro after the Taiko router and then connected the Omega-X on the output of the Muon Pro. However I was splitting hairs. I recommend that you trial this yourself and listen for your best results. Here is a rough schematic of my currently configured set-up:

Home router>>>15 ft LAN Cable>>>Taiko router>>>NA Lan cable>>>NAMP>>>Omega-X>>>Taiko switch>>>Melco C1 DAC cable>>>I/O

 

[dminches]

What is the best way to clean the switch (and router) case surface?

 

[John T]

Alcohol on a clean soft rag...EDIT!!!! ASSUMING IT IS CHROME!!

 

[John T]

ASSUMING IT IS CHROME...

 

[joet]

There are two mini rack options I would like to try.

The first one is from Audiobyte but I think they are still working on it:
View attachment 136635

The second one is the mini rack from Artesania (I believe originally designed for Nagra equipment)
View attachment 136638
(dimensions are in metric units)

It's good that Artesania offers 3 and 4 shelves. The 4-shelf version will allow accommodating a LPS as well.

I am planning to try both of these side by side and do an A/B testing to see how much difference they make and which one I prefer. But it will take me some time to get there.

In the meantime, I am planning to try an Artesania amp stand on the Olympus. That will happen soo

ner than the above mini

There are two mini rack options I would like to try.

The first one is from Audiobyte but I think they are still working on it:
View attachment 136635

The second one is the mini rack from Artesania (I believe originally designed for Nagra equipment)
View attachment 136638
(dimensions are in metric units)

It's good that Artesania offers 3 and 4 shelves. The 4-shelf version will allow accommodating a LPS as well.

I am planning to try both of these side by side and do an A/B testing to see how much difference they make and which one I prefer. But it will take me some time to get there.

In the meantime, I am planning to try an Artesania amp stand on the Olympus. That will happen sooner than the above mini racks.

Hi Nenon, did you ever discover whether these mini racks were helpful? (Sorry if you already posted a follow up.)

 

[ctydwn]

Hi everyone,
Wanted to share a quick experience in case useful for anyone re: footers under the Taiko Switch and Router.
I have maintained HRS nimbus couplers under both the router and switch since receipt, sitting on M3X2 HRS shelves upon a HRS SXR rack. I do use a mix of CMS footers as well in the system. I am just loving the sound which as we all know is a delicate balancing act (not to mention tubes etc omg). I did have 4 Stillpoint Ultra 5 footers (previously used under speakers) and gave them a go under the switch and router....

Out of the gate the presentation was cleaner, tauter, a bit more in the face and at loud volumes not as smooth. i can see how they would work well if someone's system was too warm or slightly muddy. Their impact was immediately noticeable and sent the system into hyperdrive. This overall sound change remained a few days into their trial. I do think stillpoints deliver on their rep for added clarity under components (used to use the U5s under my yg speakers and even though they are not meant for components as say U6s, gave them a go). It wasn't the best fit here and so am back to HRS for now, but glad to have the U5s in the arsenal for potential future uses.

What struck me most is, with the Olympus, network changes/tweaks/components have produced less of a delta (versus with the Extreme), in my system, but changes to those footers really made an immediate difference. As always, worth exploring options/footers. For me, still, I prefer the full Taiko network stack (router, switch, power distributor) compared to a few other network offerings out there. And I especially like that who knows maybe Taiko will improve upon their network stack? Also, happy with the synergy of the HRS ecosystem, but will continue to explore others recommendations.
Take care everyone....

 

[John T]

I have been playing with isolation for weeks now. Some that I made along with feet that were manufactured. TBH if you don't take a break it all becomes blurred! At least for me, differentiating becomes more difficult. Vassil @nenon sent me some HIFISTAY ABSOLUTE POINTS. Just to make my life more interesting! Beautifully engineered. I have them under the Olympus and I don't see them coming out. He had the top plate modified so they mount to the bottom of the O with the included screws after removing the Olympus discs/feet. I'm going to try another quad under the 360.

Isolation can vary so much system to system. Because I live in a log home it affords me the liberty to suspend my shelving from the 6" thick log walls. If you keep at it, take your time, be patient (not my strong suit) you can achieve some remarkable results. Readily available materials like, cork, rubber, sorbothane, wood, can be combined and easy to try especially under the network components which are easier to move...

 

[dminches]

Hi everyone,
Wanted to share a quick experience in case useful for anyone re: footers under the Taiko Switch and Router.
I have maintained HRS nimbus couplers under both the router and switch since receipt, sitting on M3X2 HRS shelves upon a HRS SXR rack. I do use a mix of CMS footers as well in the system. I am just loving the sound which as we all know is a delicate balancing act (not to mention tubes etc omg). I did have 4 Stillpoint Ultra 5 footers (previously used under speakers) and gave them a go under the switch and router....

Out of the gate the presentation was cleaner, tauter, a bit more in the face and at loud volumes not as smooth. i can see how they would work well if someone's system was too warm or slightly muddy. Their impact was immediately noticeable and sent the system into hyperdrive. This overall sound change remained a few days into their trial. I do think stillpoints deliver on their rep for added clarity under components (used to use the U5s under my yg speakers and even though they are not meant for components as say U6s, gave them a go). It wasn't the best fit here and so am back to HRS for now, but glad to have the U5s in the arsenal for potential future uses.

What struck me most is, with the Olympus, network changes/tweaks/components have produced less of a delta (versus with the Extreme), in my system, but changes to those footers really made an immediate difference. As always, worth exploring options/footers. For me, still, I prefer the full Taiko network stack (router, switch, power distributor) compared to a few other network offerings out there. And I especially like that who knows maybe Taiko will improve upon their network stack? Also, happy with the synergy of the HRS ecosystem, but will continue to explore others recommendations.
Take care everyone....

Thanks for the report. How did you settle on the Nimbus vs the Vortex for the router and switch? I think both are potential options.

 

[oldmustang]

Isolation can vary so much system to system. Because I live in a log home it affords me the liberty to suspend my shelving from the 6" thick log walls. If you keep at it, take your time, be patient (not my strong suit) you can achieve some remarkable results. Readily available materials like, cork, rubber, sorbothane, wood, can be combined and easy to try especially under the network components which are easier to move...

Amen to that, John. I'm a big believer in trying DIY solutions in addition to the high-priced stuff. I've got all that stuff (cork, sorbothane, dynamat, etc) for those kinds of experiments and for shelves and platforms there is bamboo, maple, teak, GRP phenolic (very hard and stiff) and panzerholz.

Since everyone's equipment, masses, materials, intrinsic resonances and supporting structures are different it pays to experiment.

Steve Z

 

[John T]

Amen to that, John. I'm a big believer in trying DIY solutions in addition to the high-priced stuff. I've got all that stuff (cork, sorbothane, dynamat, etc) for those kinds of experiments and for shelves and platforms there is bamboo, maple, teak, GRP phenolic (very hard and stiff) and panzerholz.

Since everyone's equipment, masses, materials, intrinsic resonances and supporting structures are different it pays to experiment.

Steve Z

Absolutely Steve. I'm using Aluminum Discs with springs and 3/8" walnut squares with sorbothane for all my network gear, sounds great. Check out my "High Chair" this is some real Hillbilly Shit here...If I fall I'll break my neck, my legs "DANGLE"

 

[engadin]

Hi everyone,
Wanted to share a quick experience in case useful for anyone re: footers under the Taiko Switch and Router.
I have maintained HRS nimbus couplers under both the router and switch since receipt, sitting on M3X2 HRS shelves upon a HRS SXR rack. I do use a mix of CMS footers as well in the system. I am just loving the sound which as we all know is a delicate balancing act (not to mention tubes etc omg). I did have 4 Stillpoint Ultra 5 footers (previously used under speakers) and gave them a go under the switch and router....

Out of the gate the presentation was cleaner, tauter, a bit more in the face and at loud volumes not as smooth. i can see how they would work well if someone's system was too warm or slightly muddy. Their impact was immediately noticeable and sent the system into hyperdrive. This overall sound change remained a few days into their trial. I do think stillpoints deliver on their rep for added clarity under components (used to use the U5s under my yg speakers and even though they are not meant for components as say U6s, gave them a go). It wasn't the best fit here and so am back to HRS for now, but glad to have the U5s in the arsenal for potential future uses.

What struck me most is, with the Olympus, network changes/tweaks/components have produced less of a delta (versus with the Extreme), in my system, but changes to those footers really made an immediate difference. As always, worth exploring options/footers. For me, still, I prefer the full Taiko network stack (router, switch, power distributor) compared to a few other network offerings out there. And I especially like that who knows maybe Taiko will improve upon their network stack? Also, happy with the synergy of the HRS ecosystem, but will continue to explore others recommendations.
Take care everyone....View attachment 160052

Are these the Ultra 5 in your pic?

In my experience under electronics they are best beveled side up, towards component.
I think you should try that in case you have not up to now.
Otoh, maybe they aren’t happy on the HRS rack.
I had tried an U5 under my DCD, which worked out nicely. On a Stillpoints rack.
T router and switch: I didn’t try them with the U5, as router and switch have big stickers on their under side.
Either you peel off the stickers or the sticker would come invariably between router/switch and U5, not good.
So I tried footers with smaller diameter, first Stillpoints Ultra and now CMS 2M 1.5 footers and Ansuz footers.

 

[ctydwn]

Thanks for the report. How did you settle on the Nimbus vs the Vortex for the router and switch? I think both are potential options.

Hi, Unfortunately, I have yet to try the Vortex. I do still have that on the list, but convincing myself that the Nimbus for now provide a nice balance (Nimbus under switch, router, power distributor, Olympus, I/O and Stromtank. CM under Horizon 360, Soulution 727, and VS Ultra 7s. blend of Nordost Sortkones under Nordost power, grounding pieces)

Are these the Ultra 5 in your pic?

In my experience under electronics they are best beveled side up, towards component.
I think you should try that in case you have not up to now.
Otoh, maybe they aren’t happy on the HRS rack.
I had tried an U5 under my DCD, which worked out nicely. On a Stillpoints rack.
T router and switch: I didn’t try them with the U5, as router and switch have big stickers on their under side.
Either you peel off the stickers or the sticker would come invariably between router/switch and U5, not good.
So I tried footers with smaller diameter, first Stillpoints Ultra and now CMS 2M 1.5 footers and Ansuz footers.

Yes, those are the Ultra 5s version 1. Both sides are bare and ideally I would have tried both ways. On the list to test as you say in the future, but I don't think that will tame the sound quite enough given their material and technology. Away from home but will provide an update once I can confirm.