USB Cable Length - Does It Matter? (Amir, What Do You Think?)

[Steve Bruzonsky]

I understand from posts past that Amir, also Patrick Harkins of Lumagen, objectively recommend for digital audio and video (including HDMI) cabling minimum length of 1.5M, which avoids problematic reflections.

Does this also apply objectively with USB cabling?

Thanks.

 

[amirm]

Hi Steve. I have only done limited testing of USB cables and found no difference. This assumes you have an asynchronous and isolated USB in your DAC.

 

[Steve Bruzonsky]

Thanks. As always, appreciate your objective & subjective advise!

 

[amirm]

You are took kind as always Steve.

BTW, I remembered that I tested HDMI cable lengths too. I went from a very short one to a very long one. Found no difference in measurements. This was not an exhaustive test again but a sample nevertheless.

While I have you here Steve, where are you on your music server? Last I heard you had built a CAP one.

 

[Steve Bruzonsky]

Initially I got a modded Capsv3 Zuma from Small Green Computer, the mods being a larger Silverstone case to accomodate adding a Sapphire-AMD video card (because the Intel board HDMI out didn't output DSD as 176 or 88-24, which sounded better to me than outputting 192 or 96-24). Now I use the CAPSv3 only for multi-channel via HDMI.

For a year now I've been using a CAPSv4 Pipeline with HDPlex linear power supply for two channel via USB, into the Berkeley Audio USB converter (which I got from Amir!).

Over the past few years I have picked up great deals used and have three Theta Generation VIII Series 3 DACs which I use with my Theta Casablanca IV SSP. The latter I use for bass management and Dirac room correction. Although the CBIV SSP processes "only" at 96-24 (whereas the Gen VIII processes up to 192-24), I find that the sonics and convenience of digital bass management and Dirac room correction make it worthwhile to use the CBIV SSP at 96-24 with bass management and Dirac, which is then output by the CBIV's full bandwith digital out card 96-24 to my three Gen VIII DACs for my 5.1 system!

 

[Steve Bruzonsky]

Amir, another question for you (and others).

I've been using a Straightwire USB-Link cable, recommended by Berkeley Audio several years ago. I see Straightwire has a newer cable with filtering at both ends and a 1M sells for "only" $150.

Recently audio reviews have been raving re the Curious USB cable out of Australia, "only" $340 for .8M cable! I find it interesting that none of the reviews mention objective technical checking of the cable to determine how well the cable performs simply from an objective standpoint. I think I read somewhere that USB cable impedance should be 90 ohms differential.

What's your take on the better sounding not way to much $$ USB cables these days, which brand(s), whats the msrp vs going price? Thanks.

 

[LarsS]

Amir, another question for you (and others).

I've been using a Straightwire USB-Link cable, recommended by Berkeley Audio several years ago. I see Straightwire has a newer cable with filtering at both ends and a 1M sells for "only" $150.

Recently audio reviews have been raving re the Curious USB cable out of Australia, "only" $340 for .8M cable! I find it interesting that none of the reviews mention objective technical checking of the cable to determine how well the cable performs simply from an objective standpoint. I think I read somewhere that USB cable impedance should be 90 ohms differential.

What's your take on the better sounding not way to much $$ USB cables these days, which brand(s), whats the msrp vs going price? Thanks.

Using this Supra USB cable - - > http://www.jenving.com/products/view/usb-2.0-a-b-1001908381

Main reason being that all electrical/mechanical specifications are specified and adhere to USB specs. Second reason being they are affordable, 1m ~ 270 SEK. Not many manufacturers reveal specs'

 

[Steve Bruzonsky]

Using this Supra USB cable - - > http://www.jenving.com/products/view/usb-2.0-a-b-1001908381

Main reason being that all electrical/mechanical specifications are specified and adhere to USB specs. Second reason being they are affordable, 1m ~ 270 SEK. Not many manufacturers reveal specs'

Is this the same as:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-SU...efaultDomain_3&hash=item417b03f103&rmvSB=true

 

[NorthStar]

It looks the exact same to me.

 

[LarsS]

Is this the same as:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-SU...efaultDomain_3&hash=item417b03f103&rmvSB=true

Yes it is.

 

[elcorso]

I implemented this possible solution using a 20 cms (8 ") Curious USB cable, following these two recommendations:

- From Wireworld, shorter is better.

- From Miska (HQ Player developer), protecting the cable from RFI, EMI pollution, where the construction & cable length is important.

I personally think that the reflections (due to cable length) should not be important because what are transmitted are packets in asynchronous operation. Of course very DAC dependent, the most commonly in modern DACs.

I've tried a lot of USB cables throughout the price range and this is the one I liked (subjectively, of course )

I'm on HQ Player running on a Mac with a Windows laptop as NAA, which is the one shown in the picture, feeding a Lampi B7.




Roch

 

[NorthStar]

Curious?

 

[elcorso]

Curious?

C'est la mode

Roch

 

[dallasjustice]

I implemented this possible solution using a 20 cms (8 ") Curious USB cable, following these two recommendations:

- From Wireworld, shorter is better.

- From Miska (HQ Player developer), protecting the cable from RFI, EMI pollution, where the construction & cable length is important.

I personally think that the reflections (due to cable length) should not be important because what are transmitted are packets in asynchronous operation. Of course very DAC dependent, the most commonly in modern DACs.

I've tried a lot of USB cables throughout the price range and this is the one I liked (subjectively, of course )

I'm on HQ Player running on a Mac with a Windows laptop as NAA, which is the one shown in the picture, feeding a Lampi B7.

View attachment 24213


Roch

Roch,

Is that the secret password to your vast bank account holdings on the sticky attached to your laptop?

How are you liking the Kalugas? I've had mine for about 18 months and I love them!

Michael.

 

[elcorso]

Roch,

Is that the secret password to your vast bank account holdings on the sticky attached to your laptop?

How are you liking the Kalugas? I've had mine for about 18 months and I love them!

Michael.

Hi Michael,

Ha, ha, ha... no so vast after this hobby of us

I have two partitions in the Windows laptop, one for the Lampi and his ASIO drivers, the other for the exaSound DAC, so each password and partition number is stored in the sticky (that I forgot to remove for the picture).

I do love the Kalugas even without the warm distortion (or any) of the tube amp. But there are still some tubes in the chain, from the pre. and the Lampi. Also Kalugas drives CLX speakers with easy and I believe could be a better integration to the ML subs. that are Class D amplified too.

Best,

Roch

 

[LarsS]

As iFi Audio states here, and totally agree:

".... 4.2 USB cables
Quite often, the USB cable (or its connectors) is the main cause for USB signal distortions. Some cables (regardless of cost) available in the market do not adhere to the correct 90? impedance and are not suited for USB 2.0 high-speed communication (480 Mbps)."

Quoted from here - - > http://www.audiostream.com/content/...eyond-1s-and-0s-ifi-audio#BmGVlMBQ53kvhIy4.97

Go read Supra Cables specs, would love to be responded with actual figures from competing manufacturers ... my guess is none will return ;-)

/Cheers
Lars

 

[DonH50]

Properly terminated there would be no reflections and the only issue is loss. The USB spec limits loss and/or cable length but I do not know the numbers off-hand (not something I deal with, more SAS and PCIe stuff these days).

Improperly terminated there will be reflections back and forth. How large and where those reflections land with respect to the data is important and is a function of the impedance mismatch and path length (cable plus internal wiring etc.) There are "magic" lengths that minimize the impact of reflections on the data for any given data rate. Depending upon that is very risky, however, because you do not know the internal path length and termination characteristics even if you had the perfect cable.