Trinity DAC

[Mike Lavigne]

I have only just seen this thread and so investigated the Martin Colloms review - link below;

http://www.audionote.co.uk/articles/audionote_cdt6-dac_5_complete.pdf

He concludes;
"Here is a CD player which really can give high end analogue a run for its money."
Presumably this is not based solely on his Linn experience.

I quote another paragraph below
"Nevertheless with this DAC my own varied digital sources have never sounded better, especially the network music server, rendering S/PDIF via a Naim UnitiServe. The original disc loaded in the CDT-Six disc drive was clearly better, with superior control of residual grain, better clarity, bass depth and rhythm. "

This has been my experience with digital, the original disc sounds better than the ripped file played through my laptops. PC and Mac both with SSD and J river. It seems posters on this thread get as good or better SQ, than disc playback, when using a server.

I use a Playback MPS 5 into a Dartzeel pre, they work very well together via their dedicated 50 ohm link. The trinity and AN DACs are beyond my means! however any suggestions on improving on my laptop as a source? I see the CAPS v4 mentioned.

it's hard to make any general comments on 'all transports' and 'all servers' and 'all dacs' as far as what sounds best ......particularly right now as far as servers and stand alone bit delivery products have come.

it's important to pay attention to this comment from Mr. Colloms;

the original disc sounds better than the ripped file played through my laptops.

laptops don't cut it as a music source compared to SOTA servers. when Mr. Colloms goes down the ultimate server road then we will pay attention to his opinions about it.

we do know one thing for sure......88/24, 96/24, 176/24, 192/24, 2xdsd, and Quad dsd cannot be played on discs. so where things are going, discs are not following.

with that said, as a 9 year owner of the same dart pre/MPS-5 combo......it gets smoked on CD discs by redbook files played through the Trinity dac and my CAPS v4 hot-rodded server. not even close. to be fair; the Trinity surpasses everything out there for PCM. now.....I've not heard the Trinity with it's own $20k transport......which is what I'd need to do to complete the point.

the MPS-5 does not get much help from my SOTA server for whatever reason and so your laptop might be close to as good as it gets through the MPS-5. whereas the Trinity gets better with each small step. not sure why.

and btw; last night I finally received the brand new dart pre. OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[microstrip]

it's hard to make any general comments on 'all transports' and 'all servers' and 'all dacs' as far as what sounds best ......particularly right now as far as servers and stand alone bit delivery products have come.

it's important to pay attention to this comment from Mr. Colloms;



laptops don't cut it as a music source compared to SOTA servers. when Mr. Colloms goes down the ultimate server road then we will pay attention to his opinions about it.

we do know one thing for sure......88/24, 96/24, 176/24, 192/24, 2xdsd, and Quad dsd cannot be played on discs. so where things are going, discs are not following.

with that said, as a 9 year owner of the same dart pre/MPS-5 combo......it gets smoked by the Trinity dac and my CAPS v4 hot-rodded server for 44/16 redbook. not even close. to be fair; the Trinity surpasses everything out there for PCM. now.....I've not heard the Trinity with it's own $20k transport......which is what I'd need to do to complete the point.

the MPS-5 does not get much help from my SOTA server for whatever reason and so your laptop might be close to as good as it gets through the MPS-5. whereas the Trinity gets better with each small step. not sure why.

and btw; last night I finally received the brand new dart pre. OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mike,

First, my congratulations on the DartZeel.

Second, very good points on digital - my main feelings against virtual music were founded in my perception that Redbook music sounded better played from a matched top CD spinner top DAC every time I had the opportunity to listen to both in similar conditions. Surely I accepted that it was a question of time until the quality of the music sever and the interface between the music server are optimized and match the sniping combo. As you say, more than 30 years past the introduction of CD it seems we are now able to approach its full potential in terms of sound quality.

I am waiting for opinions on the Trinity digital combo - if you have the DAC, how can you resist listening to the full digital system (transport and DAC) ? Just for the good of audiophile science!

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Mike,

First, my congratulations on the DartZeel.

thanks. I listened for 6 hours last night, and about 4 hours this morning. it is as much better than the prototype, that the prototype was better than the old dart pre. it's a revelation. I'm so happy I cannot hardly stand it.

Second, very good points on digital - my main feelings against virtual music were founded in my perception that Redbook music sounded better played from a matched top CD spinner top DAC every time I had the opportunity to listen to both in similar conditions. Surely I accepted that it was a question of time until the quality of the music sever and the interface between the music server are optimized and match the sniping combo. As you say, more than 30 years past the introduction of CD it seems we are now able to approach its full potential in terms of sound quality.

as I've mentioned before; last month I ripped 1500 of the 3000 CD's I had not previously ripped. if some transport with the Trinity can possibly equal or better what I hear now to those files thru the Trinity I will be very surprised. and access to the music is so seamless. there is no going back.

I am waiting for opinions on the Trinity combo - if you have the DAC, how can you resist listening to the full system? Just for the good of audiophile science!

never going to happen. I'm all in with the new dart pre and 458's. I'm sure Deitmar's full Trinity 'stack' is also wonderful.....but I love Herve's world view of music. it's the right one to my ears. honestly; I don't think anything at any price can touch this.

of course; that's just one guys opinion.....YMMV....and all that stuff.

I hope you get a chance to hear the new dart pre. but I understand they will be scarce for awhile to find. big backorder to fill.

 

[dctom]

Thanks for your reply Mike.
Envy your receipt of the new Dart!!!!

My guess is part of the reason for the lack of effect of a server on the MPS-5 might be the Playback propriety usbX connector. I probably will carry on with the laptop for now, and dream of a trinity dac, don't even know if there is one in the UK.

 

[microstrip]

(...)
never going to happen. I'm all in with the new dart pre and 458's. I'm sure Deitmar's full Trinity 'stack' is also wonderful.....but I love Herve's world view of music. it's the right one to my ears. honestly; I don't think anything at any price can touch this.

of course; that's just one guys opinion.....YMMV....and all that stuff.

I hope you get a chance to hear the new dart pre. but I understand they will be scarce for awhile to find. big backorder to fill.

Mike,

My apologies - I should have written "full digital system" - DAC and transport - to avoid confusions! I would never think about asking you to part with the DartZeel's! Even me, I can not part with my NH108B, perhaps expecting to get the new preamp some day ...

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Mike,

My apologies - I should have written "full digital system" - DAC and transport - to avoid confusions! I would never think about asking you to part with the DartZeel's! Even me, I can not part with my NH108B, perhaps expecting to get the new preamp some day ...

ok.....you are forgiven.

maybe at some point Audiocrack will try his Lampizator Komputer (very similar if not exactly the same as my server....I may have an extra LPS) with his Trinity to compare. his Trinity dac and Trinity transport is with his Genesis, his GG and Komputer is with his Tidal LA. they are in 2 separate systems.

moving gear around in involved systems like his is a PITA just to satisfy other's questions.....but you never know.

 

[Elberoth]

Thanks for your reply Mike.
Envy your receipt of the new Dart!!!!

My guess is part of the reason for the lack of effect of a server on the MPS-5 might be the Playback propriety usbX connector. I probably will carry on with the laptop for now, and dream of a trinity dac, don't even know if there is one in the UK.

I belive the Absolute Sounds will have the Trinity (buy you have to ask Dietmar when exactly; Dietmar is heavily backordered, with everything basicly made to order, and even the biggest names have to get in line - a friend of mine had waited for over 4 months for his Trinity DAC; it is well worth the wait though).

 

[dctom]

I love Herve's world view of music. it's the right one to my ears. honestly; I don't think anything at any price can touch this.

I know Herve has developed a new phono module, which I am sure is excellent, are the other line inputs (eg; digital) improved as well?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I know Herve has developed a new phono module, which I am sure is excellent, are the other line inputs (eg; digital) improved as well?

I will post some details in the next few days. as you mention, the phono is gone to a whole new level. my new dart pre has 2 of those.

all the inputs are improved; particularly the XLR input now is on the same level as the single ended ones. the Trinity (which only has XLR/balanced output) is plugged into it.

briefly; the new dart pre has a lower noise floor......beyond anything I have heard. more texture and degrees of realism, as well as much more dynamic life.

propulsive, expressive, and vivid are the words that come to mind. the most emotional piece of audio gear I've experienced. very human and commutative. a reach out and touch it kind of sound.

 

[dctom]

Thanks for the info Adam

 

[Audiocrack]

Mike,

First, my congratulations on the DartZeel.

Second, very good points on digital - my main feelings against virtual music were founded in my perception that Redbook music sounded better played from a matched top CD spinner top DAC every time I had the opportunity to listen to both in similar conditions. Surely I accepted that it was a question of time until the quality of the music sever and the interface between the music server are optimized and match the sniping combo. As you say, more than 30 years past the introduction of CD it seems we are now able to approach its full potential in terms of sound quality.

I am waiting for opinions on the Trinity digital combo - if you have the DAC, how can you resist listening to the full digital system (transport and DAC) ? Just for the good of audiophile science!

The trinity dac is, as I have stated many times before (also way before Mike took the wise decision to buy one) a phenomenal pcm dac. I have commented on the performance of the Trinity dac/Trinity transport/server combo several times on WBF. Actually I believe I was one of first members here to point out how much better the dedicated (Trinity) server sounds compared to a regular pc.

 

[dctom]

propulsive, expressive, and vivid are the words that come to mind.

Thank you for the first impressions Mike.

 

[dctom]

Mike, would you be able to comment on how the phono stage on the new Dart compares to the Trinity Dac.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Mike, would you be able to comment on how the phono stage on the new Dart compares to the Trinity Dac.

last night I did 2 hours of each.....

the Trinity dac is fabulous sounding. last night I listened to it for 2 hours and was fully satisfied. I have an amazing Tara Labs Grandmaster Evolution 1.5m XLR interconnect on it and it is sitting on a Herzan active isolation table. PCM like you have never heard. the Trinity is so delicate and completely free of any PCM-ness or edge or hardness of any kind, yet very vivid and dynamic. you know that 'live-ness' that PCM has which comes thru even when it's also harsh. the Trinity allows that attribute of PCM to stay, yet gets rid of all the negative artifacts. other PCM dacs lose the energy trying to tame the nasties.

but the big rig vinyl thru the new dart pre and new dart phono simply presents the music on another level. image density, realism, the event coming fully to life in the room, and musical cohesiveness is on a whole different level. you are immersed into the musical flow. the new dart pre and the new phono take the levels of noise and dynamic life farther than the old dart pre and phono. and what I love is the additional inner texture, sparkle and nuance to the music. you are sucked into the event....it is more compelling and demanding of attention.

with the Trinity the window is clean and clear, and the light on the setting is perfect. it's all there. over there.

with the new dart pre and dart phono; no window or wall at all. just music.

I had to make myself stop listening last night and go to bed.

 

[Frank750]

last night I did 2 hours of each.....

the Trinity dac is fabulous sounding. last night I listened to it for 2 hours and was fully satisfied. I have an amazing Tara Labs Grandmaster Evolution 1.5m XLR interconnect on it and it is sitting on a Herzan active isolation table. PCM like you have never heard. the Trinity is so delicate and completely free of any PCM-ness or edge or hardness of any kind, yet very vivid and dynamic. you know that 'live-ness' that PCM has which comes thru even when it's also harsh. the Trinity allows that attribute of PCM to stay, yet gets rid of all the negative artifacts. other PCM dacs lose the energy trying to tame the nasties.

but the big rig vinyl thru the new dart pre and new dart phono simply presents the music on another level. image density, realism, the event coming fully to life in the room, and musical cohesiveness is on a whole different level. you are immersed into the musical flow. the new dart pre and the new phono take the levels of noise and dynamic life farther than the old dart pre and phono. and what I love is the additional inner texture, sparkle and nuance to the music. you are sucked into the event....it is more compelling and demanding of attention.

I had to make myself stop listening last night and go to bed.

But what about the measurements

 

[dctom]

Thanks Mike, hope to get the new Dart in a couple of months, just deciding whether to get it with two phono inputs.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Thanks Mike, hope to get the new Dart in a couple of months, just deciding whether to get it with two phono inputs.

in the same weekend my new dart pre with 2 phono's finally arrived, some upgrades to my 2 Durand tone arms also occurred. so my wood arm wand on my stock Durand Telos got upgraded to a new composite tone arm and upgraded phono cable. also I was able to use the special weights from the Sapphire version of the other arm as I upgraded that weight too.

I mention that because my mono performance from my second tone arm is now quite a bit better than it was before; and I'm still using a $1300 Miyajima Premium Be cartridge. the new phono combined with those other improvements has taken things much farther. the music now jumps out of the grooves whereas before with the wood arm wand, and other weights and old phono it was a bit laid back. my soundstage is more lively.....and more frequently it seems like stereo enough I forget it's mono. the lower noise floor and increased dynamics has great value for mono.

so as far as a case for 2 phono's; I'm very happy I did it. it keeps my system logistically simple and easy; and yet is completely uncompromised in performance. and if I choose to do a second stereo cartridge I know it will be top of the heap performance.

I cannot imagine a better way to go for the serious vinyl lover.

basically you are adding a cost no object phono for a few thousand dollars. I've not heard any phono at any price I would prefer.

congrats on the new dart pre; it is an all time great product.

 

[Audiocrack]

last night I did 2 hours of each.....

the Trinity dac is fabulous sounding. last night I listened to it for 2 hours and was fully satisfied. I have an amazing Tara Labs Grandmaster Evolution 1.5m XLR interconnect on it and it is sitting on a Herzan active isolation table. PCM like you have never heard. the Trinity is so delicate and completely free of any PCM-ness or edge or hardness of any kind, yet very vivid and dynamic. you know that 'live-ness' that PCM has which comes thru even when it's also harsh. the Trinity allows that attribute of PCM to stay, yet gets rid of all the negative artifacts. other PCM dacs lose the energy trying to tame the nasties.

but the big rig vinyl thru the new dart pre and new dart phono simply presents the music on another level. image density, realism, the event coming fully to life in the room, and musical cohesiveness is on a whole different level. you are immersed into the musical flow. the new dart pre and the new phono take the levels of noise and dynamic life farther than the old dart pre and phono. and what I love is the additional inner texture, sparkle and nuance to the music. you are sucked into the event....it is more compelling and demanding of attention.

with the Trinity the window is clean and clear, and the light on the setting is perfect. it's all there. over there.

with the new dart pre and dart phono; no window or wall at all. just music.

I had to make myself stop listening last night and go to bed.

Hello Mike,

Could you share some of your listening experiences with the Taralabs Grandmaster evolution cable with us on the thread I started with regard to this cable on WBF? Although I have a very good picture of what this amazing cable is actually doing in your system, it might be interesting for other members to hear those experiences from you.

 

[dctom]

so as far as a case for 2 phono's; I'm very happy I did it. it keeps my system logistically simple and easy; and yet is completely uncompromised in performance. and if I choose to do a second stereo cartridge I know it will be top of the heap performance.

I cannot imagine a better way to go for the serious vinyl lover.

basically you are adding a cost no object phono for a few thousand dollars. I've not heard any phono at any price I would prefer.

Thanks Mike. I agree about the phono input - even the original one sounds better than most. I am slightly hesitant as the extra input is €8500 over here.

 

[CKKeung]

The newest Trinity DAC upgrade : addition of an external USB-to-Optical Conversion Box :