New MSB Cascade DAC

[matthias]

We may get an idea of how big a deal it might be at Munich. I think that I heard that the Taiko Olympus will be paired with the Lanpizator Horizon via the XDMI interface in at least one room. Perhaps Emile and Co. will have the opportunity to do a little XDMI schmoozing with some of the high line DAC manufacturers in Munchen.

Agree,
it will be paired with Lampi Poseidon in this room:

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/lampizator-introduces-native-xdmi-functionality-the-next-horizon.38709/#post-965941

 

[Doc76]

Maybe this is only the “reference” version of the Cascade DAC. Could a Cascade [Select] DAC with two power bases be in the future?

 

[Al M.]

So, the Cascade, which clearly seems to be an evolution of the Select platform, will beat the performance of the Select- at a lower price point. The Sentinel will become the new flagship at a higher price than the Select and beat the performance of the Sentinel. Makes sense, except that the MSB sales pitch about modular upgrade ability for the Select is, for all intents and purposes, false.

Prior to the Discrete/Premier/Reference/Select series, which did allow for an upgrade path, there were other MSB models (Platinum etc.) where an upgrade path was promised but not delivered, to the frustration of owners. Apparently MSB has reverted to their old ways.

Schiit also promises a modular upgrade path with their Yggdrasil models, and they have always delivered on their promise so far, going on a decade by now.

 

[Al M.]

The video explaining the design approach of the Cascade is quite impressive.

 

[sbnx]

Since we audiophiles like to speculate about things we really don't know I would like to make an observation.

With the digital director and now the new architecuture MSB has completely stripped all of the DSP (digital) funcitons such as filtering, upsampling, etc. out of the DAC part and placed them in the middle box. With that it would not take much to add "features" to the digital box. For example frequency correction filters to help with room response similar to the old tact stuff. Or cross talk elimination aka Bacch. I could easily see MSB licensing this technology. That would offer a lot of differentiation in a crowded market.

I think this idea is intreguing. Give the user full flexibility in what features they want to use or not use. I do wish MSB would bring back the choice of filters. With the older Diamond V I could choose whether I wanted minimum phase or linear phase filters and I could choose a few of each type.

The only thing I don't like about the middle box is yet another digital cable. For example USB from the streamer into the digital box. and then going optical from the digital box to the dac box.

 

[bryans]

Prior to the Discrete/Premier/Reference/Select series, which did allow for an upgrade path, there were other MSB models (Platinum etc.) where an upgrade path was promised but not delivered, to the frustration of owners. Apparently MSB has reverted to their old ways.

Schiit also promises a modular upgrade path with their Yggdrasil models, and they have always delivered on their promise so far, going on a decade by now.

As much as I want to agree with you, I'm an MSB owner, I don't believe being upgradable means the product I own today will always be able to be upgraded to the latest and greatest forever. Oh how I wish that was the case but it is not.

 

[luca.pelliccioli]

I'm afraid we'll only be able to upgrade the digital input modules from the current units for a while, unless we get a winning lottery ticket! Let me say as an MSB owner (purchased a few weeks ago) that I will have to settle for a long time, in the meantime "dreaming costs nothing".

I can't imagine what the price of Cascade and Sentinel will be here on the other side of the ocean, if the current Select is already around 150K and the Reference around 70K. Just as I cannot imagine what sound quality MSB has managed to achieve with the new components, pushing beyond the current boundaries!

What a wonderful and cruel hobby!

 

[worldtime]

Msb approach seems clear now, my wild guess of the new line

discrete
Premier
Reference (update needed)
Cascade (replacing select 2), price similar or bit lower
New flagship, price matching wadax 250-300k dac, 4 boxes design, newer 16-dac design, newer clock, maybe even newer chassis material and finish, better pre amp. I think MSB knew how many sale loss just because they didn’t have wadax price competitor, because some rich dudes just choose the most expensive things in the market. Personally I listened to wadax, next to it it’s the half price vinyl system, honestly I just don’t get what crazy ball they got to label that product as quarter mil price, the vinyl sounds way better.

I’m a msb reference owner, I don’t like digital director sound (and I know some people have the same opinion), but when you put control unit to the digital director, that means you have to have it. Let’s have a taste on Munich show, if cascade sound makes any sense.

 

[Wavetouch]

I hope a new MSB Cascade DAC sounds cleaner without MSB Select II's glare/veil.

 

[Al M.]

I hope a new MSB Cascade DAC sounds cleaner without MSB Select II's glare/veil.

Seriously? Why are you SPAMMING this thread with stupid videos that reveal nothing but a cheap silly recording system that has its own glare/veil?

Cut it out.

You know *nothing* about MSB DACs, other than what you think to know, which is *nothing*, from stupid videos.

System videos are destroying the high end.

 

[Wavetouch]

Seriously? Why are you SPAMMING this thread with stupid videos that reveal nothing but a cheap silly recording system that has its own glare/veil?

I am speaking the truth. I heard MSB DACs in audio shows. Above video sounds exactly what I heard. The live recording videos are the truth. Can you find un-silly live hi-fi audio recording that don't have glare/veil?

 

[itay123]

I hope a new MSB Cascade DAC sounds cleaner without MSB Select II's glare/veil.

Friend !

As has been said
You know nothing about MSB DACS.
Your reference is the very inferior results of OPPO dacs.

And I don't really understand your comments and posts beyond taking the discussion to crazy places that are based on stupid videos that have nothing to do with any (concrete) reality

Hope you're not like that in real life.
And it's just a way to grab attention.

 

[Jeffy]

Are you kidding the director makes the select 2 sound way better. There is no glare or vail in my system. Something in your setup is not right

 

[Mike Lavigne]

The live recording videos are the truth.

please define 'live recording videos'. i do not understand your meaning.

unless i clearly understand the distinctions you are claiming, hard to comment.

 

[itay123]

Are you kidding the director makes the select 2 sound way better. There is no glare or vail in my system. Something in your setup is not right

Exactly !

The Digital Director
This is one of the most revolutionary things about MSB
In fact, anyone who does not integrate Digital Director with its MSB dacs
Not really getting the MSB's high capabilities.
And I must also add that those who do not work with an ISLpro integration, have not really heard MSB.

 

[Al M.]

I am speaking the truth. I heard MSB DACs in audio shows. Above video sounds exactly what I heard. The live recording videos are the truth. Can you find un-silly live hi-fi audio recording that don't have glare/veil?

Who cares about audio shows? You cannot conclude anything from bad sound at shows (there is so much that can go wrong), you can only conclude something from good sound. If you consider yourself an audio expert you should know this.

I have heard MSB DACs in several home settings. Zero glare and veil.

 

[Al M.]

Your reference is the very inferior results of OPPO dacs.

Well, his Oppo DAC videos have glare as well. But then, it would be foolish to conclude things like glare of a component from the typical inferior video. What holds for Oppo in a video also holds for MSB or any other component.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I hope a new MSB Cascade DAC sounds cleaner without MSB Select II's glare/veil.

I have heard MSB DACs in several home settings. Zero glare and veil.

agree with Al. owned the MSB Select II for 4 years. heard it a dozen times at shows, paid close attention when i was auditioning it. never glare or veiling unless the recording had it. it did not obscure recording truth. added no tonal coloration.

 

[Wavetouch]

Friend !

As has been said
You know nothing about MSB DACS.
Your reference is the very inferior results of OPPO dacs.

And I don't really understand your comments and posts beyond taking the discussion to crazy places that are based on stupid videos that have nothing to do with any (concrete) reality

Hope you're not like that in real life.
And it's just a way to grab attention.

I am not an engineer and don't want to know about tech of MSB dacs. I just want to talk about it's sound in here.

Jeffy Are you kidding the director makes the select 2 sound way better. There is no glare or vail in my system. Something in your setup is not right

Could you make a short video of sound of your MSB? I just want the sound. You can tape the camera lens.

Mike Lavigne please define 'live recording videos'. i do not understand your meaning.​

Record the sound of your audio system with a cell phone (or camcorder). That is live-recording for me.

itay 123
The Digital Director.
This is one of the most revolutionary things about MSB
In fact, anyone who does not integrate Digital Director with its MSB dacs
Not really getting the MSB's high capabilities.

If it is that good, somebody should made the recording. That is the way of this world. Right? Where is it?

Al M I have heard MSB DACs in several home settings. Zero glare and veil.

I would make a short video with my cell if I were you. Do you have any way to show it.

** I hope we will have a nice discussion here today.

 

[MarkusBarkus]

** I hope we will have a nice discussion here today.

...seems unlikely given your initial post in a new thread about a new product which none of us have heard. Perhaps find another place to slag on MSB, if that's your objective.