I think I need help..

Dre_J

Industry Expert
Mar 5, 2012
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I think I can safely rule out the phono stage. I tried the MM inputs and changing all six tubes and experienced the same problem.

Next up is changing the cartridge - which will take me the better part of Saturday.

I checked both LPs (Barber and Cassidy) during system warm-up last night and they sailed through without a hitch. Sounds like the cartridge or setup is the probable issue. Since you have a new cartridge on the way it should help to identify the cause. there are already some good suggestions listed earlier in the thread. If you run into any issues, I'm sure the members here (including myself) will be wiling to offer more advice.

BTW: What cartridge did you order?

Dre
 

MadFloyd

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I checked both LPs (Barber and Cassidy) during system warm-up last night and they sailed through without a hitch. Sounds like the cartridge or setup is the probable issue. Since you have a new cartridge on the way it should help to identify the cause. there are already some good suggestions listed earlier in the thread. If you run into any issues, I'm sure the members here (including myself) will be wiling to offer more advice.

BTW: What cartridge did you order?

Dre

Another XV1-s...
 

hvbias

Well-Known Member
Jun 22, 2012
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MadFloyd do you have the Hifi News+ test LP? In my experience it is essential and its bias/tracking tests do correlate with real world performance. You can do a search on Vinyl Engine, there are some threads discussing tracking performance.

I was getting a "crackling" sort of distortion with the Miles Davis Great Prestige Recordings 45 rpm box set on the really loud trumpet parts (particularly when Miles first starts a solo). This showed up as buzzing even on the first bias test track of the Hifi News+ test record. After setting azimuth electronically (not just visually) this went away.

Some modern cutter heads really push the limits of the format with dynamic passages.

I think I have heard some of these hard to track modern LPs with my friend's XV-1s and I've never heard an issue with that cartridge.
 

MadFloyd

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MadFloyd do you have the Hifi News+ test LP? In my experience it is essential and its bias/tracking tests do correlate with real world performance. You can do a search on Vinyl Engine, there are some threads discussing tracking performance.

I was getting a "crackling" sort of distortion with the Miles Davis Great Prestige Recordings 45 rpm box set on the really loud trumpet parts (particularly when Miles first starts a solo). This showed up as buzzing even on the first bias test track of the Hifi News+ test record. After setting azimuth electronically (not just visually) this went away.

Some modern cutter heads really push the limits of the format with dynamic passages.

I think I have heard some of these hard to track modern LPs with my friend's XV-1s and I've never heard an issue with that cartridge.

No, I don't have this LP unfortunately (I have the Analog Productions and and George Cardas ones though).
 

hvbias

Well-Known Member
Jun 22, 2012
578
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New England area
No, I don't have this LP unfortunately (I have the Analog Productions and and George Cardas ones though).

I can't recommend it highly enough. If you hear buzzing on the bias tracks, something is not right (in my experience). Let me see if I can find some of my Vinyl Engine bookmarks that explain it more articulately than I can.

At least for me it eliminated many variables with cartridge setup. It helps me get tracking dialed in with every cartridge I've swapped in and out. From there I adjust for the best possible sound. Like some others have said line-contact styli are particularly sensitive to setup.

It's been a while since I've looked into test records (I don't know anything about the Cardas). But I think one of the reasons I went with the Hifi News+ over the AP is that it had tracking tests. The AP has a sine wave test that the Hifi News+ doesn't have.
 

microstrip

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May 30, 2010
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No, I don't have this LP unfortunately (I have the Analog Productions and and George Cardas ones though).

I second Hvbias advice on this LP (or a similar one having crosstalk tests). Although I do not care very much for the higher level tracking bias tests, the azimuth tests are mandatory with some stylus profiles, such as the van den Hul I am using.
 

MadFloyd

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OK, I just ordered the LP.

Thanks for the tip.
 

theguesswho

New Member
Feb 25, 2012
103
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Connecticut
Hi Floyd, You did not need to buy the test record. You already have the best test record there is.
The records with the sibilance! Change one or all of the adjustable parameters that are available on the arm till the sibilance is tamed and you are happy with the sound of the music from the LP. If you can't hear a change doing this then the problem lies elsewhere.

You don't need a "test record" to hear if the change in azimuth helps with reducing the sibilance, you need the offending records!

Wendell
 

jadis

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2010
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Manila, Philippines
In my experience Eva Cassidy's Songbird LP has a lot more sibilance than say, Carol Kidd's All My Tomorrow (original Aloi Linn records). Amanda McBroom's Growing Up in Hollywood also has very little sibilance. I always use the last 2 to see if my sibilance is getting over the roof or not. Sibilance is one thing that can drive me to drive out a component.
 

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,238
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New York City
In my experience Eva Cassidy's Songbird LP has a lot more sibilance than say, Carol Kidd's All My Tomorrow (original Aloi Linn records). Amanda McBroom's Growing Up in Hollywood also has very little sibilance. I always use the last 2 to see if my sibilance is getting over the roof or not. Sibilance is one thing that can drive me to drive out a component.

My pressing of Songbird was also defective.
 

MadFloyd

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I'm about to setup the new XV-1s. I have a question.

My Triplanar VII armrest doesn't allow me to get the stylus anywhere near the outer area of the arc of my Mint Tractor (when doing the first step to adjust overhang). It *seems* to me like the armrest's tiny arm could be bent outwards (it has a tiny curve in it already) so that I could have access to a wider arc. Anyone try this?

I also tried taking off the finger lift but failed. That one screw will just not budge.
 

jfrech

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Sep 3, 2012
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Austin
I'm about to setup the new XV-1s. I have a question.

My Triplanar VII armrest doesn't allow me to get the stylus anywhere near the outer area of the arc of my Mint Tractor (when doing the first step to adjust overhang). It *seems* to me like the armrest's tiny arm could be bent outwards (it has a tiny curve in it already) so that I could have access to a wider arc. Anyone try this?

I also tried taking off the finger lift but failed. That one screw will just not budge.

Hmm...I don't have a mint...but it must really need to go to the right...I just looked at my tri planar...what about taking off the black plastic arm holder? The one with the "hook" that moves to hold the arm down? It seems to have a screw on top that can be removed...

I am sure you can bend the arm rest wand...but I wonder if you can ever bend it back just right...and you don't want to put to much pressure on the housing it's seated in...that's where you're arm bearings are...

Sorry wish I could be of more help...
 

audioarcher

Well-Known Member
May 6, 2012
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Seattle area
I'm about to setup the new XV-1s. I have a question.

My Triplanar VII armrest doesn't allow me to get the stylus anywhere near the outer area of the arc of my Mint Tractor (when doing the first step to adjust overhang). It *seems* to me like the armrest's tiny arm could be bent outwards (it has a tiny curve in it already) so that I could have access to a wider arc. Anyone try this?

I also tried taking off the finger lift but failed. That one screw will just not budge.

It is not necessary to go all the way to the outer area of the arc. Just go out as far as the arm will allow. You just need the stylus to follow the arc when you're done.
 

Bill Hart

Well-Known Member
May 11, 2012
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Floyd- somebody earlier in this thread had posted Fremer's recent alert about how the set-up jig for mounting the Triplanar is wrong. And Fremer follows up in that piece about how he played with various alignment tools to try and get it right.
Did you read that?
I had a Triplanar years ago but I can't help you here.
 

audioarcher

Well-Known Member
May 6, 2012
1,396
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970
Seattle area
Floyd- somebody earlier in this thread had posted Fremer's recent alert about how the set-up jig for mounting the Triplanar is wrong. And Fremer follows up in that piece about how he played with various alignment tools to try and get it right.
Did you read that?
I had a Triplanar years ago but I can't help you here.

Good point Bill. If the pivot to spindle distance is not correct an arc protractor will not be accurate. If you're unsure about your P2S distance then it is worth it to pick up a Feickert alignment tool. It is simple to measure P2S distance with this tool. If your P2S distance is off and you can not adjust it the Feickert tool will still allow you to get proper alignment as long as you have enough room in the slots of the headshell to adjust your cart.
 

MadFloyd

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Hi all,

Thanks for the replies. I ended up not futzing with the armrest.

I performed the setup. I had a heck of a time just trying to 'see' the stylus with my 10x loop. Old eyes & progressive lenses make it tough for me. I ended up moving the turntable outside on the deck (was a gorgeous day) and it helped. Once I got the first phase (overhang) I was ready to call it a day. I dread the next (alignment) step because it's hard to adjust the cartridge without messing up overhang. Anyway, just before I moved the turntable back inside I checked the alignment and I swear it was bang on. I walked away, came back a few minutes later to recheck (the Mint Tractor makes this very easy) and same thing, so I considered myself very fortunate and moved the table back into the playing position.

I was then surprised to find that the VTF was very different (1.7xx vs 2.00). I adjusted it up to 1.88 and started playing a few records.

After about 10 LP sides, I finally played the Patricia Barber LP (the one that really alerted me to the issue) and it sailed through beautifully.

Dang this thing is sounding good. Much more high frequency extension with a lot of clarity. It's clean but a tad forward sounding but I'm not complaining and I'm guessing it might settle down a bit with break-in.

This is my 3rd XV-1s. The first was purchased used from Mike Lavigne and I snapped off the cantilever and replaced it with the one I had been using up to yesterday (also purchased used). This third cart is new.

Thanks again for all the help!
 

jazdoc

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Aug 7, 2010
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Congrats on solving the issues...now just relax and enjoy the music.

Dang this thing is sounding good. Much more high frequency extension with a lot of clarity. It's clean but a tad forward sounding but I'm not complaining and I'm guessing it might settle down a bit with break-in.

After 50-100 hours, remember to recheck all of your set up parameters. They will likely change as the cantilever settles.
 

audioarcher

Well-Known Member
May 6, 2012
1,396
51
970
Seattle area
Hi all,

Thanks for the replies. I ended up not futzing with the armrest.

I performed the setup. I had a heck of a time just trying to 'see' the stylus with my 10x loop. Old eyes & progressive lenses make it tough for me. I ended up moving the turntable outside on the deck (was a gorgeous day) and it helped. Once I got the first phase (overhang) I was ready to call it a day. I dread the next (alignment) step because it's hard to adjust the cartridge without messing up overhang. Anyway, just before I moved the turntable back inside I checked the alignment and I swear it was bang on. I walked away, came back a few minutes later to recheck (the Mint Tractor makes this very easy) and same thing, so I considered myself very fortunate and moved the table back into the playing position.

I was then surprised to find that the VTF was very different (1.7xx vs 2.00). I adjusted it up to 1.88 and started playing a few records.

After about 10 LP sides, I finally played the Patricia Barber LP (the one that really alerted me to the issue) and it sailed through beautifully.

Dang this thing is sounding good. Much more high frequency extension with a lot of clarity. It's clean but a tad forward sounding but I'm not complaining and I'm guessing it might settle down a bit with break-in.

This is my 3rd XV-1s. The first was purchased used from Mike Lavigne and I snapped off the cantilever and replaced it with the one I had been using up to yesterday (also purchased used). This third cart is new.

Thanks again for all the help!

Glad to hear it's working for you. If you did not revisit overhang after you settled on VTF you may want to. Changing VTF by .1 of a gram will change the overhang. Also you need to revisit setup again after the suspension has broken in because both the SRA and the overhang will have changed due to the suspension giving more after break in.
 

MadFloyd

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May 30, 2010
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Glad to hear it's working for you. If you did not revisit overhang after you settled on VTF you may want to. Changing VTF by .1 of a gram will change the overhang. Also you need to revisit setup again after the suspension has broken in because both the SRA and the overhang will have changed due to the suspension giving more after break in.

Ooooh... well I guess that's good to know so thanks. Not that I'm looking forward to it, but will start mentally preparing... :)
 

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