Frugal Power

[Speedskater]

While Widescreen Review magazine has had it's up's and down's over the years, those power conditioner articles must be on of the lowest.

 

[NorthStar]

While Widescreen Review magazine has had it's up's and down's over the years, those power conditioner articles must be on of the lowest.

---- Agreed.

* It's important to know well your writers.

 

[Gregadd]

I'm sorry for all the confusion guys.

I should have used some "sarcastic" emoticon when I said the placebo effect isn't real.

The Placebo Effect IS VERY REAL and that's why I like blind testing.

You know who is no real either. But I have not really enjoyed Christmas since I forund out.

Now, it is plain to see that we humans aren't all that advanced, we have lots of foibles.

You know who is no real either. But I have not really enjoyed Christmas since I found out.

 

[DACMan]

Placebo - how good is it

If you believe the test results - then you are wrong.

In some people, a sugar pill (or equivalent) CAN imitate the effects of an IV heroine injection.

It works to varying degrees on different people.

I do not know about morphine. There is no way a sugar pill can imitate an intravenous heroine injection.

 

[DACMan]

There is no fallacy FUNCTIONALLY.

The person's immune system acts differently because they are convinced that it will - so their mind is influencing their immune system.
However, depending on the situation, their mind may or may not be sufficiently able to cause enough influence to effect a cure.

As an example, a placebo may work well to help you overcome a bad cold, because that is within the "range" of your immune system to cure. However, it may not work at all for an Anthrax infection, which may be far beyond what your immune system is able to handle (even with some help from your brain). It would be bad if someone, because a placebo had enabled them to overcome a bad cold, believed it was so effective that they tried to treat a carcinoma with the same placebo - because, in that case, their immune system would still fail and they would end up dead.

In a more general sense, by misrepresenting the facts, the placebo prevents you from making a fully informed decision the next time around.

There's a fallacy in your thinking here - the bacteria are being dealt with by the immune system. Its the immune system that responds to placebo, not the bacteria.

 

[Speedskater]

For more on the effectiveness of placebo's see:

http://harvardmagazine.com/2013/01/the-placebo-phenomenon

 

[Orb]

The problem with any studies on biases or placebo is who to use and their own experiences and methodology.
You will find some patients that have chronic long term pain who use methodology for pain management and identifying which medications to assist, will probably have different results to the standard placebo test patients, this is further compounded by how long said placebo effect lasts both in terms of between "doses" and how long placebo treatment can be used to trick the person.

Regarding imitating heroin, it is worth noting that some studies have shown addicts do have a rush-joy before actually injecting, replicating in several ways the behaviour of the actual heroin itself.

Another separate but potentially similar model relationship identified is that of natural mOFC increased activity boosting enjoyment-satisfaction showing correlation with expected quality of wine based upon price.
Again though what would be the long term results, and also if using those who test-taste wine most days as a wine producer.

So two aspects identified for sure I know of (appreciate some may be able to add more but just regarding recent discussions); pleasure-satisfaction-reduced/increased pain and chemical/brain activity region response within the brain.
If you really want to test placebo generally and say it works (and see limitations); see what happens to a long term highly physically dependent drug addict (no longer highs but taken for the body) on Heroin and replace this with a placebo and tell them it is the same drug.....

I need to dig out a few studies I have, one is interesting as it investigated the pain effect of placebo and its limitations-behaviour.
Unfortunately placebo term and how it is associated is too general due to multiple mechanisms actually at work and each with different traits.

Cheers
Orb