Equal parts frustration/elation - mirroring life in general?

[spiritofmusic]

This thread is a bit of an amalgam of the topics covered in the hyperbole thread, oversensitivity of audiophiles thread, and the concept that small changes can produce potentially distinctly negative and positive outcomes, often seemingly out of proportion, interchangeable, and hard to predict.
Since 1997, I've changed major components multiple times, and apart from a couple of major mistakes (2001, Marantz SA1, just WHAT was I thinking?!), have always been able to gauge what I like and what I don't, and upgrades have been generally worthwhile and often inspiring.
Alongside component swaps, I've been maxxing power/isolation/signal integrity via balanced power/grounding/cables, and this is actually changing the sound radically for the better.
Interestingly, in the last 6-9 months, changes I've made have been even more transformative, but the initial effects were TOTALLY schizophrenic, and it's amazing I have any hair left!

Firstly on this dizzy trip was my upgrade to Nat SET amps - demo totally fantastic, then the next day, OMG I was pleading w/the dealer to take them back, the SQ had so unwound overnt. But a suggestion to alter the VTF on my cart just flipped the sound 180, I was back in love, and now I will never vary from Nat. Just by the change of 0.05g!
Next Sablon cables, I was great w/the initial loom, tried a higher model in the line i/c, even better, but added more of the latter to my system, and SQ bottomed out again. Just what is going on, again?! But completed the loom w/spkr cbls to go 100% on the new line, and voila, ease and joy back in my life.
Next Lundahl transformers to my Zu sub amps. Amazing boost in bass extension, but after a few days, a seeming blunting of dynamics. Had to work really hard in getting the bass x/over setting dead right resulting in locking the sound right in, and bass has never been so precise.
Then GIKs. Great impvt in coherence to start, and then a seeming loss of focus that was totally frustrating. But a resiting of the 242s behind the rack to behind the spkrs reintroduced the magic.
Finally, today, moving Zus 1' into room, my seating position from 14' to 12' distant, and toeing them out a few inches is really focussing the sound and immersing me in the s'stage, whereas a year ago, positioning was pretty indecisive.

So, the days of, yep this component sounds better and continues to do so, has been replaced by, wow this change is amazing but be ready to have to ABSOLUTELY finetune to maintainn the joy.

What's great is that the mood swings mid process, when I succeed, are totally worth it, my sound has been taken to heights I really couldn't have been prepared for.

I'm obviously in the territory where reviewers say a well-tuned system can be so easily unbalanced by a simple change, the chain only as good as the weakest link.
And also, not good for your health to do too many radical changes all in the same time period.

I'm also surmising that getting power/grounding/isolation/signalling impvd is allowing components to really shine, but the balance is a lot more of a tightrope, less tolerance but greater potential.

Isn't this just like real life, as you get older, decisions need not to be taken lightly, but get it right and family/work can all come together.

 

[Argonaut]

For my part I am Hostage to a somewhat familiar sounding game of Snakes and Ladders myself at this time Marc, with my New ARC REF10 Pre doing my NUT IN !!! A mere several hundreds of hours burn in time stretch before me like the Road to Purgatory.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Harlequin, it could be worse. Martin Colloms I believe is getting twds 500 hrs on his Naim Statements, and apparently the sound is continuing to get worse !
Oh, to have £100k to splash !

 

[bonzo75]

Isn't this just like real life, as you get older, decisions need not to be taken lightly, but get it right and family/work can all come together.

Yes, if one gets a kid with the PA in his office. Integrated like Devialet?

 

[Diapason]

A lot of this rings true. I'm just not sure whether it's a good or bad thing to have these dizzying heights and crushing defeats. My wife is starting to tally my mood swings with the sound of my system, but I'm not sure which is cause and which is effect.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Diapason, I thought you might contribute.
There's no doubt another solution is to hit the bottle.
What's Best Booze, indeed.

 

[Diapason]

Way ahead of you there. I've been on a bit of a gin kick recently, that definitely counts as a spirit of music.

 

[spiritofmusic]

We've had flights of fancy on other threads re ice cream, coffee recently. This'll take the biscuit if a thread of my creating, within the first half dozen posts, goes SERIOUSLY OT!!!

 

[Diapason]

*cough* I'll get back in my box. As you were!

 

[spiritofmusic]

Haha.
Btw, I know we did discuss you visiting me when in London. I know new family additions mean time is tight, but are there any plans?
Would be delighted to host you, show you the Nats and Zus, and try and brainstorm your enduring issues.

 

[Diapason]

Thank you, spirit, you're really most kind. It's unlikely I'll make it over by the end of this year, but I'm mentally planning a little hifi-research-related trip to London in early 2016. If that happens, I'll definitely be in touch!!

 

[spiritofmusic]

You're welcome, contact me whenever.
My system is def an acquired taste, but it's all about spectrum of experiences (or is that the tagline for the much-missed Ashley Madison? )

 

[spiritofmusic]

This is just the strangest feeling, in a wholly positive way.
Today, I'm just having a total epiphany in the sound that my rig w/all the changes I mentioned in my heading statement coming thru, w/this final change of me moving in relation to my Zus, and the Zus w/the room.
I can honestly say I've taken a giant leap twds the end of upgrading, all those facets I aspired to heard in SOTA set ups from a few years ago I'm staring to fully achieve after 20 years of experimenting/refining, and yes, spending.
A big test of this will be whether the Nat Audio Magnetostat top of the range linestage that I have a home demo planned in Oct bursts my bubble of contentness and becomes another "must have" component, or the rock solid synergy of my Nats as is, deflects the temptation.
And whether on continuous comparison to my good friend's (Blue58's) Avantgarde Duos over the next year, I still feel the siren call of having to have horns (I'm a sucker for the Duos) and thence travelling to the US to demo/poss buy the Sadurni Staccato horns, or I stay solid in my serenity and resist horns purchase, happy my Zus are really me.
Saving a stack of cash will be pretty handy, and I'd love to just feed my remaing upgraditis disease w/Spiers And Robertson air table for tt, expenditure on dedicated lines, Shun Mook Diamond Resonators under gear, and expenditure on a dedicated room after my house move next year.

 

[Blue58]

This is just the strangest feeling, in a wholly positive way.
Today, I'm just having a total epiphany in the sound that my rig w/all the changes I mentioned in my heading statement coming thru, w/this final change of me moving in relation to my Zus, and the Zus w/the room.
I can honestly say I've taken a giant leap twds the end of upgrading, all those facets I aspired to heard in SOTA set ups from a few years ago I'm staring to fully achieve after 20 years of experimenting/refining, and yes, spending.
A big test of this will be whether the Nat Audio Magnetostat top of the range linestage that I have a home demo planned in Oct bursts my bubble of contentness and becomes another "must have" component, or the rock solid synergy of my Nats as is, deflects the temptation.
And whether on continuous comparison to my good friend's (Blue58's) Avantgarde Duos over the next year, I still feel the siren call of having to have horns (I'm a sucker for the Duos) and thence travelling to the US to demo/poss buy the Sadurni Staccato horns, or I stay solid in my serenity and resist horns purchase, happy my Zus are really me.
Saving a stack of cash will be pretty handy, and I'd love to just feed my remaing upgraditis disease w/Spiers And Robertson air table for tt, expenditure on dedicated lines, Shun Mook Diamond Resonators under gear, and expenditure on a dedicated room after my house move next year.

Epiphanies are very rare in my view but if I had to name an audiophile awakening it was hearing Carver Silver Sevens and Carver ALS speakers many years ago. Sometime later, Avantgarde Trios pulled the same trick of producing what I heard as LIVE music.

Since then, like you, I've been striving to reproduce this LIVE sound at home and feel I'm much closer than ever before. However, do we not get sidetracked into playing Producer/engineer by thinking we KNOW how the master tape or rather the original performance sounded and try to manipulate our systems to reproduce how WE would like the performance to sound. Our engineering tools being cables, interconnects, vibration control etc in lieu of a mixing desk. Should we all have DSP to flavour the sound to OUR liking?

I'm a big believer in keeping equipment for long periods of time rather than box swapping or accessory changes. Many of these components and accessories take months to 'break in'. I honestly believe transformers can take a year to mature, caps a little less. So. assessing changes to your system in the short term often leads to epiphanies for some but often a week later a realisation that it was perhaps just a heightened euphoric state produced by a small change whilst in reality it was just another level of break in before the next plunge into hell. Be prepared!

There is always something better out there though maybe not the right component for your system/room interaction, my Duos a positive case in point being in a small room. Enjoy your own system, max it out by whatever means but LIVE with it to understand its complexities, nuances and contribution to your musical enjoyment. Stop fretting about what may be, what others have, or what if I moved them 1cm more apart. Until you know your system you'll not understand how adjustments will impact on the sound and not understand the difference between different or better.

OOI, I've owned Duos for 13 years, SE45 amp 12 years (variation of), previous cables 12 years and Cd player brand 14 years. That's getting to know your systems sound intimately.
Be interesting to hear others members system longevity too.

Blue58

 

[spiritofmusic]

Thanx Blue. I know your system very well, and it has the rare and enviable quality of being totally at one w/the room and listener. Regularly reported shortcomings of the Duos (bass incongruities) are non existent.
You have struck the perfect balance of getting that sound dialled in early, making few changes, just gilding the lily at intervals.
In my case, I reached a tenuous balance a year ago which in retrospect wasn't as good as I thought it was, but the last 6 months has seen a transformation, pulling off the neat trick of cementing what was great about my sound over time ie tonal density and involvment, but now w/much more powerful but even bass, flatter response in the room, more detail but zero stridency, and a sort of euphoric quality here I can't just get enough of it. Like being in love all over again. Or an adrenalising fling via Ashley Madison.
Two cd's I've always loved for their totally analog vibe (Buckethead "Colma" and Jonas Hellborg "Octave Of The Holy Innocents") are completely reborn w/where I am now, and if the quality gap to your system is seriously bridged when I listen to them this weekend at yours, I will be truly stoked.
Point taken re settling on changes - certainly a danger if I trial a very potent new linestage. I will bear this in mind when Peter of Alternative Audio comes over in Oct w/the Nat Magnetostat.

 

[Argonaut]

Spirit, at risk of introducing a little chaos into your present calm, have you explored the feasibility of an home demo of the Duos?

 

[spiritofmusic]

Harlequin, home demo on any set of horns presents a few issues. The sheer size/transport difficulties, and they're resistance to simple plug and play. No dealers in the UK are forthcoming on this.
I have to say any impvts I might get re snap and focus, and more immediate s'stage going from Blue58's 3W/ch 45s tube amps to my 75W/ch Nat 211s SETs, is going to be counterbalanced by vastly increased audibility of my current, rel loud tube rush.
Blue has already turned down the possibliity of going Golden gate w/his duos because the hum is unacceptable.
But I wouldn't say no to the opportunity.
My hunch is that going the whole distance w/Trios and Basshorns G2s may be the better option.
Atm however, I remain truly happy where I am. W/these changes listed earlier crystallising in my system, I'm not chomping at the bit for the "next" component upgrade.

 

[Blue58]

Harlequin, home demo on any set of horns presents a few issues. The sheer size/transport difficulties, and they're resistance to simple plug and play. No dealers in the UK are forthcoming on this.
I have to say any impvts I might get re snap and focus, and more immediate s'stage going from Blue58's 3W/ch 45s tube amps to my 75W/ch Nat 211s SETs, is going to be counterbalanced by vastly increased audibility of my current, rel loud tube rush.

You could take your NATs to a dealer so at least you would know whether they hummed or not.

Blue has already turned down the possibliity of going Golden gate w/his duos because the hum is unacceptable.

I never tried to eliminate the noise whilst the unit was in for demo. Possibly due to the rectifier, possibly due to the way the tubes are heated. I expect it could be eliminated completely with a little 'tinkering' and may not be noticeable on less sensitive speakers.

But I wouldn't say no to the opportunity.

May as well give it a go.

My hunch is that going the whole distance w/Trios and Basshorns G2s may be the better option.

And don't forget the NEW range of XD Avantgardes are available now. You may not even 'need' Trios when a Mezzo could work very well.

Atm however, I remain truly happy where I am. W/these changes listed earlier crystallising in my system, I'm not chomping at the bit for the "next" component upgrade.

Magnetostat aside

 

[spiritofmusic]

Blue, apologies if I quoted you out of context.
Must be the availability of good ale at your place!

No doubt, hum/rush is a truly serious considerations going 101dB/m eff Zus to 107-109+ horns.
My moderately audible Nat 211s rush will effectively double in volume.
That sounds like a step too far.

Nat Magnetostat pre, well this is just to satisfy my curiosity, it will REALLY need to outperform my incumbent Nat Utopia linestage, or provide unique things, to swap for.

Vivid Giya G1s or G2s are homing into view, the buzz on these is so interesting, the inverse horn principle appeals, and alongside the AG Trios/Basshorns G2 these are probably the only two uber spkrs on a final (final final?) shortlist.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Marc, It sounds (no pun intended) like you finally are on the path toward contentment! I am happy for you!