Catering to the rich not the audiophile

John72953 said:
Are you inferring they are making false claims?
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Nope, just noting that they haven't totally stripped away all preconceived notions for how high end audio was designed. You say that isn't a claim, just an aim right coz this is marketing speak? They do explicitly say its their plan to 'completely redefine high end audio' - I don't see them achieving that now, nor any time soon.
 
opus111 said:
Nope, just noting that they haven't totally stripped away all preconceived notions for how high end audio was designed. You say that isn't a claim, just an aim right coz this is marketing speak? They do explicitly say its their plan to 'completely redefine high end audio' - I don't see them achieving that now, nor any time soon.
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I would agree with that!

Let's put aside the marketing-speak, both from them and the audio product establishment, and it clear IMO that Emotiva has created a business model and a product of significant quality to be noticed and taken seriously. Not serious in terms of competing with the likes of MBL, VAC, Lamm, etc., but serious enough for those of less means to acquire gear that can be enjoyed on an equal footing.
 
I could be totally happy with a pair of used avalon ascendants , with proper but not extremely expensive amps and a off the shelf blue ray player :D
John72953 said:
I would agree with that!

Let's put aside the marketing-speak, both from them and the audio product establishment, and it clear IMO that Emotiva has created a business model and a product of significant quality to be noticed and taken seriously. Not serious in terms of competing with the likes of MBL, VAC, Lamm, etc., but serious enough for those of less means to acquire gear that can be enjoyed on an equal footing.
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andromedaaudio said:
I could be totally happy with a pair of used avalon ascendants , with proper but not extremely expensive amps and a off the shelf blue ray player :D
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flez007 said:
I concur...
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Interesting ... Speakers first ;)

back to Emotiva. I don't care what's the game they're playing: Do they sound good enough to challenge the biggies? I don't know but without an honest evaluation, no one can tell so far Stereophile or the other magazines have not reviewed their big amps.

I will edit this post if the discussion goes down to a DBT thing, that is not my intention here. here is an argument toward some tests protocols that withhold the components identity. I would say that most audiophiles, expect a 40 K amp to be superior to a $3,000. We will cry to the contrary , yet deep inside no one expects any Emotiva to challenge the biggies. it is almost inconceivable to our audiophile minds that such an outcome is possible. Thus the somewhat rethorical question I asked earlier: Is there any technical reason why an Emotiva can't sound at least as good as a "biggie" model? I knew the answer, yet I am certain that in a sighted comparison the Emotiva would be seriously handicapped. Speculation ? Of course but not baseless.
 
I know a guy that just bought their new XPR-1 monos in favour of his Pass Labs X-250.5. Speakers are Dynaudio Confidence C2. Surely something good has to be going on here.
 
asiufy said:
Emotiva used to advertise on Stereophile, right around the same time they got their reviews. Apparently you need to pay 6 months to a year of ads to get the reviews...
Don't know if they still do it, though, don't remember seeing their ads anymore.
Anyway, I've heard the Emotiva setup at RMAF, and it was, by far, the worst sound of the show. Sure it's cheap, but so is a Marantz, and I'd rather buy that.


alexandre
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Emotiva still advertises in Stereophile Dec 2012 page 14
 
Their is somebody here from Emotiva.
 
asiufy said:
Emotiva used to advertise on Stereophile, right around the same time they got their reviews. Apparently you need to pay 6 months to a year of ads to get the reviews...
Don't know if they still do it, though, don't remember seeing their ads anymore.
Anyway, I've heard the Emotiva setup at RMAF, and it was, by far, the worst sound of the show. Sure it's cheap, but so is a Marantz, and I'd rather buy that.


alexandre
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---- Yes Alex; Emotiva is still very present in their advertising with Stereophile, and also with HomeTheater mag. They still have their adds in those latest 2013 mags (I know, I got them both). ...And I'm sure they will continue.

But not only there, Emotiva is advertising at several audio/video websites; like AVS Forum, Audioholics (big time), HomeTheaterShack, HomeTheaterReview, and few others.
Their presence is gaining momentum in some of those audio communities dats fo sur.

_____________________

Their advertising presence at Stereophile and HomeTheater mag is well over a year now.
...Actually two years (I got those too; start of 2011), and very consistently. ...In those two mags.


* Marantz makes some good 'sounding' stuff. :b
 
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andromedaaudio said:
I could be totally happy with a pair of used avalon ascendants , with proper but not extremely expensive amps and a off the shelf blue ray player :D
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On a personal note, I drive a pair of Dunlavy SCIVs with an Audiolab 8200A integrated purchased (new) on A'gon for the princely sum of $600. Six hundred dollars. It wasn't supposed to be used with the DALs, but as life worked out, there it is. It's running my entire system. I've owned Ayre, Krell, ML, ARC, blah, blah, blah. I have no idea how the Audiolab compares to any of them; can't really trust my memory, but I can say with the utmost honesty that I don't sit around wishing for another amplifier. I'd like to upgrade the electronics - no question - but the sound quality of this piece is such that I'm not in a big hurry.

Then, there's the build quality. The thing feels like the proverbial slab of stone. Case panels rigid enough to demand a ballistic rating coupled to a massive faceplate. Remember, I paid $600 brand spankin' new (it retails for $1000, IIRC). If this can be done for a MSRP of $1000, the possibilities are endless. All that being said, I was able to buy the piece for $600, because there we no other takers. Clearly, folks are/were buying other integrated amplifiers for a whole lot more money, but this product just sat around. No High-End reviews, no real (US) street cred, and a price that smacks of mid-fi. Kinda goes along with some of what's been asserted in the discussion.
 
-- Emotiva is catering to the 'budget consciencious' crowd; and not the rich, and not the 'perfect' audiophile. ...And with all that comes with it; good, and bad.
 
tomelex said:
I say this because I do agree with your previous assertion that given the same circuit topology, electronics takes lateral moves to change sound, and is not advancing anywhere, really. Speakers need more scrutiny, more measurments which corelate to the type of drive (solid state feedback, non feedback, tube OTL, tube transformer, etc). But still, in this world, in a lot of areas, price is equated with performance....or if not performance (as in most electronics) then bling.
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In my experience, speakers are relatively blameless in regards SQ - the problems are definitely in SS (the only type I have experience of) electronics. So yes, circuit topologies are one thing that requires attention to get higher end sound, together with better power supply filtering as another area for improvement. I note that Emotiva doesn't convey either story incidentally in its pitches for amps.
 
IME speakers contribute by far the largest amount of distortion in the audio chain.

As for amplifiers specifically, output impedance and charge storage seem to be among the contributors to sound...
 
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