Shunyata Research Theta Speaker Cable Cross Section

[jmimac351]

I posted this in the Audio Cable forum with no luck... perhaps it will be more relevant here. Thanks for any feedback.

+++++++++++++++++

Does anyone have info or a picture of the internals of the Shunyata Research Theta speaker cables? I have a pair of those and am digging into Cardas wire with their air core tubes / air core dielectrics. Wondering how Shunyata handles that. The site mentions "VTX™ (hollow core)", but not sure if they are doing anything to actually try to create "air".

I've just completed the gear for my system:

Ayre Acoustics QX-5 Twenty Streaming DAC
Ayre Acoustics KX-R Twenty Preamp
Ayre Acoustics MX-R Twenty monos

I love my Ayre equipment. Turning attention to wire now and was gifted a pair of Cardas Clear Sky XLR. I was using "Good quality copper wire"... Mogami 2549. I inserted that one Clear Sky XLR between the QX-5 Twenty Steaming DAC and KX-R Twenty and it flipped a switch. Juiced.

Right now I am eyeballing Cardas Clear Reflection, and see the focus on air tubes in the Cardas stuff. That's why I'm going down that path with respect to how Shunyata does it, re: Dielectrics.

 

[Ron Resnick]

was gifted a pair of Cardas Clear Sky XLR. I was using "Good quality copper wire"... Mogami 2549. I inserted that one Clear Sky XLR between the QX-5 Twenty Steaming DAC and KX-R Twenty and it flipped a switch. Juiced.

Welcome to WBF!

What differences in sound, exactly, did you hear in your system between these two interconnects?

Right now I am eyeballing Cardas Clear Reflection

I use Clear Reflection single-ended interconnects throughout my system. Compared to Belden 1192A balanced I prefer the Clear Reflection.

and see the focus on air tubes in the Cardas stuff. That's why I'm going down that path with respect to how Shunyata does it, re: Dielectrics.

I personally don't try to correlate internal construction design with subjectively observed sound.

 

[jmimac351]

Welcome to WBF!

What differences in sound, exactly, did you hear in your system between these two interconnects?

I use Clear Reflection single-ended interconnects throughout my system. Compared to Belden 1192A balanced I prefer the Clear Reflection.


I personally don't try to correlate internal construction design with subjectively observed sound.

Hi Ron, thank you. The sound was much more "juiced"... "alive". The texture was more vibrant. It just woke everything up.

I don't expect that everything with air core / tubes will sound the same, but I look for clues and I suspect that things with more focus on "air core dielectrics" are going to "move the needle / make a difference" compared to the basic copper wire. Whether that difference is an improvement that I like is up for just plain listening.

Jake at Ayre likes the Clear Reflection as well and I've noticed something about the wire in the Clear Reflection Speaker and Power cables - 11.5awg wire. I believe those cables use the same wire that is used for the output in my Ayre MX-R Twenty monos. The Ayre monos use 2x11.5 Cardas Twisted Pair. So, same wire going for power into the amps, output of the amps, and from the binding posts to the speakers... put together in different ways according to their role.

Perhaps completely meaningless... but I like that symmetry too.

Thank you,
Jim McGovern
Apopka, FL

 

[Ron Resnick]

Hi Ron, thank you. The sound was much more "juiced"... "alive". The texture was more vibrant. It just woke everything up.

I don't expect that everything with air core / tubes will sound the same, but I look for clues and I suspect that things with more focus on "air core dielectrics" are going to "move the needle / make a difference" compared to the basic copper wire. Whether that difference is an improvement that I like is up for just plain listening.

Jake at Ayre likes the Clear Reflection as well and I've noticed something about the wire in the Clear Reflection Speaker and Power cables - 11.5awg wire. I believe those cables use the same wire that is used for the output in my Ayre MX-R Twenty monos. The Ayre monos use 2x11.5 Cardas Twisted Pair. So, same wire going for power into the amps, output of the amps, and from the binding posts to the speakers... put together in different ways according to their role.

Perhaps completely meaningless... but I like that symmetry too.

Thank you,
Jim McGovern
Apopka, FL

Dear Jim,

Thank you for this detailed and thoughtful reply!

I totally understand the natural desire to try to correlate technical design with observed sound. I do it all the time myself!

Another factor for me personally -- a very unscientific one I fully concede -- is that Angela Cardas herself uses (at least circa 2018) Clear Reflection in her own personal system.

I ordered all of my Clear Reflection rhodium free with Cardas SLVR connectors. I am very happy with them!

PS1: I use Clear Beyond XL and Iconoclast Belden BAV power cords (also rhodium free).

PS2: I also have experience with and like MasterBuilt cables and WestminsterLab cables.

 

[jmimac351]

Dear Jim,

Thank you for this detailed and thoughtful reply!

I totally understand the natural desire to try to correlate technical design with observed sound. I do it all the time myself!

Another factor for me personally -- a very unscientific one I fully concede -- is that Angela Cardas herself uses (at least circa 2018) Clear Reflection in her own personal system.

I ordered all of my Clear Reflection rhodium free with Cardas SLVR connectors. I am very happy with them!

PS1: I use Clear Beyond XL and Iconoclast Belden BAV power cords (also rhodium free).

PS2: I also have experience with and like MasterBuilt cables and WestminsterLab cables.

Thank you, Ron. I saw that the Cardas site has had a lot of improvements, info added. They have a "Deep Dive" section for people to consume info when they want to know more about "Why is this different / better?"

I guess what I'm asking about the Theta is... "Please Show Me".

Also to your point, I did notice that it's mentioned Angela uses Clear Reflection. That was posted on the Cardas site very intentionally. I just like to try to sort thru "words", (which may be correct, but sometimes they aren't), to see what's different... then try it and listen for myself.

That is how I arrived at my Ayre equipment and the Diamond Circuit... "single point"... "Triode"... but that' a whole other conversation.

Thanks again, Ron. Everything sounds great, I'm just digging around and playing.

 

[Ron Resnick]

I'm just digging around and playing.

I truly feel that something like half of the fun of the hobby is the researching and reading and auditioning and talking and plotting and theorizing and planning and strategizing before you even pull the trigger on purchasing a component. (For me, it is this way with every hobby.)

 

[Kingrex]

Look at Inakustik also. They smelt their own wire and use an air dialect in a unique structure to support it. Very flexible. Great performance.

 

[jmimac351]

Look at Inakustik also. They smelt their own wire and use an air dialect in a unique structure to support it. Very flexible. Great performance.

I will check it out. Thank you.

I ordered all of my Clear Reflection rhodium free with Cardas SLVR connectors. I am very happy with them!

PS1: I use Clear Beyond XL and Iconoclast Belden BAV power cords (also rhodium free).

PS2: I also have experience with and like MasterBuilt cables and WestminsterLab cables.

Ron, I saw in passing recently that you did this special order thing for "no Rhodium". So you're dealing with bare copper? If so, how do you keep from developing a rash worrying about the copper oxidizing?

I have thought of whether the Cardas Contact Enhancer stuff, or some other product would take care of that. I don't need more things to chase after, that's for sure!

 

[jmimac351]

Look at Inakustik also. They smelt their own wire and use an air dialect in a unique structure to support it. Very flexible. Great performance.

I just looked at this and that stuff is VERY interesting. Thanks for pointing it out to me.

If anyone from Shunyata would like to show that sort of thing... I like pictures and small words. The Theta cables sound fine, but my "wire situation" isn't button up yet. Anything Shunyata can do to "Show and Tell", that would be very interesting. Thank you.

I'll keep looking around. I'm on the "wire and treating my front wall" hunt. Thanks all for the feedback.

 

[Lee]

This pretty much walks you through with some diagrams:

Audio Cable Tech - Shunyata Research

Audio Cables Technology explained Of all the products within Shunyata Research’s iconic portfolio, none have benefitted from the innovation Shunyata Research is known for more than its award-winning signal cables. Decades of research, customization, measurement and material refinement have...

shunyata.com

 

[jmimac351]

Thanks for sharing that. I'm looking for something more like the picture of Cardas Clear below.

I just put Theta speaker cables back in the system this evening. I had Cardas Clear Cygnus speaker and Cardas Clear XLR interconnects. With the Cygnus, things were sometimes just a little "Dry".

I had a thought that maybe I needed something with a bit more ease, and I put the Theta back in. I also remembered, and this was important in retrospect... I had plain copper interconnects in the system when I listened to the Theta. Mogami 2549. So I wasn't really "hearing" them.

With Theta along with Cardas Clear XLR, things are sounding good, and still needs to settle. In fact, I think they will be at least as good as the Clear Cygnus, and probably more musical. I'm so sure that I'm returning the Clear Cygnus to TMR as I'm within the return window, fortunately.

What will be very interesting is when the pair of Cardas Clear Speaker wires I recently bought arrive this weekend. We'll see if they offer the "Detail and Musicality" promised.

 

[jmimac351]

So, I've since added 2x Cardas Clear XLR between Ayre QX-5 Twenty / KX-R Twenty and on to the MX-R Twenty amps. I also picked up a 1M pair of Cardas Clear Cygnus speaker cables as they were priced well. Tons of clarity... but a little DRY too. The Cardas Clear Cygnus don't taste right with this setup and are going away.

Meanwhile, I had the Shunyata Theta listed for sale as I also had purchased a pair of demo Cardas Clear speaker cables. Those will be here in a few days. I had a thought...that I should put the Theta speaker cables back in as I had not heard them with the Caras Clear XLR. So, I did.

Well... WOW. The Shunyata Research Theta speaker cables paired with the Cardas Clear XLR smoked the same setup when Cardas Clear Cygnus speaker cables were in play. Something very different is going on that is hard to put a finger on. It's musical but not at the expense of detail. It is full, but balanced. The tone and texture... awesome. There is a very nice sense of Ease... but it's not just smoothed over "butter sound".

I've taken the Theta cables off the market. I am going to need to hear these up against the Cardas Clear speaker cables. I've read the other comments here about being blown away by them.

They may be keepers for my setup and tastes - which are beyond reproach, of course.

I am cautiously optimistic. Having Fun.