Koetsu with FR arms

[mulveling]

Well a few weeks of amazing listening sessions later, I'm in total bliss with this 64S / Coralstone setup. This is without question the best sound I've achieved at home. Sonic satisfaction has increased within this time, and I'm not sure how much of that may be settling in (e.g. how long that old tonearm wire went unused before I got it conducting again) and alignment/setup tweaks, versus psychological factors. Ignoring gear I outright dislike, components fall into 3 categories:

1. Gear that bowls you over on 1st listen, then fades over time. E.g. "new gear syndrome". Sometimes a new component will present a different perspective that initially seems refreshing and exhilarating, yet over time the appeal of this particular perspective fades, and in its absence you start to pick up on flaws and shortcomings that were glossed over in your initial excitement. I've had a couple of these in the past year, and I'll refrain from calling them out, as they're still fine pieces; just not up to the level of competition here.
2. Components that impress from the very first note, and continue to do so for the long run; instant classics. Ah, if only everything worked like that! This happy scenario becomes rare with experience, and usually reflects that you've landed a new component that performs at a substantially higher level/class than your prior references. Examples of this for me would be: Stax 009 headphones, Stax T2 amplifier, Koetsu stone cartridges, Tannoy Canterbury GR speakers, my CMS Maxxum rack for the turntable.
3. Components that don't impress at first (even mildly disappointing), but over time develop into cherished favorites. My "theory": Your perception of "correct" sound can became inexorably intertwined with the sound of your prior reference. When this rug is pulled, sometimes the result sounds "wrong". However, given time, as your prior conditioning breaks, you find yourself forming a deeper more meaningful connection to music with the new reference.

The FR64S looks like it's falling into category #3. In fact, when I first got the 64S mounted (a few months ago), I felt that it had promise, but certainly didn't feel the "rush" that I'd expected given its legend. I even dismounted it for quite a while; went back to the Graham so I could be comforted by the fact that every bolt, screw, and movement was tight and smooth, and mechanically predictable, versus the 40-year old arm. But now - I never felt nearly this much connection to music with the Graham Phantom Supreme coupled to any of the Koetsu bodies (including this Coralstone). This 64S / Coralstone combination, for me, represents a meaningful step further into reproducing the feel of a performance, rather than simply transcribing a recording. I love it!

 

[gian60]

I used my Coralstone Diamond with Koetsu VII but sound no good
I cannot listen
Much
Much better with Bergmann tonearm and also better with Saec 506
I was courious of Koetsu tonearm but is no good

 

[mountainjoe]

1. Components that don't impress at first (even mildly disappointing), but over time develop into cherished favorites. My "theory": Your perception of "correct" sound can became inexorably intertwined with the sound of your prior reference. When this rug is pulled, sometimes the result sounds "wrong". However, given time, as your prior conditioning breaks, you find yourself forming a deeper more meaningful connection to music with the new reference.

The FR64S looks like it's falling into category #3. In fact, when I first got the 64S mounted (a few months ago), I felt that it had promise, but certainly didn't feel the "rush" that I'd expected given its legend. I even dismounted it for quite a while; went back to the Graham so I could be comforted by the fact that every bolt, screw, and movement was tight and smooth, and mechanically predictable, versus the 40-year old arm. But now - I've never felt this much connection to music with the Graham Phantom Supreme coupled to any of the Koetsu bodies (including this Coralstone). This 64S / Coralstone combination, for me, represents a meaningful step further into reproducing the feel of a performance, rather than simply transcribing a recording. I love it!

Regarding #3, I've seen this in action more than once - most recently I had a customer do an in-home evaluation of some new speakers. He had the same set of speakers for 25 years and while they were ok, my immediate sense upon first hearing his system was that they were thin in the lower mids and upper bass region (and generally lacked bass extension).

After adjusting the placement of the demo speakers and firing them up, I felt the tonal balance was quite good and much more accurate. This was very evident on male vocals in particular. I left the speakers with this customer for a couple of weeks and upon return he commented that he felt they were too "full" in the same region where I thought his speakers were thin. He subsequently concluded these new speakers were colored.

I tried to tell him that I thought these were more correct in tonality (and timbre) but he was convinced his reference of 25 years was the more correct sounding speaker. At this point, I didn't even bother trying to convince him otherwise - 25 years is a lot of inertia to overcome if someone doesn't have a proper reference as to what is correct tonality.

In regards to the Coralstone on the the FR64s - in my experience with a Blue Lace Platinum, the performance improvement was immediately obvious and significant - but I was coming from a Kuzma 14" 4 point - not exactly a high mass tonearm.

Congratulations on your setup - I've never heard my Koetsu's perform as well as on my FR tonearms.

Cheers, Joe

 

[mulveling]

I used my Coralstone Diamond with Koetsu VII but sound no good
I cannot listen
Much
Much better with Bergmann tonearm and also better with Saec 506
I was courious of Koetsu tonearm but is no good

Koetsu VII? Is that the Koetsu-branded tonearm? I had a chance to buy a mint one some years age, but saw in person that its build quality was far far short of the FR64fx I was using at the time. It was an easy choice to pass on. It was clearly an old Jelco build; I can assure you the FR arms are much much better. I'm not surprised it was easy to improve upon. The Koetsu headshell was neat, though

I tried to tell him that I thought these were more correct in tonality (and timbre) but he was convinced his reference of 25 years was the more correct sounding speaker. At this point, I didn't even bother trying to convince him otherwise - 25 years is a lot of inertia to overcome if someone doesn't have a proper reference as to what is correct tonality.

In regards to the Coralstone on the the FR64s - in my experience with a Blue Lace Platinum, the performance improvement was immediately obvious and significant - but I was coming from a Kuzma 14" 4 point - not exactly a high mass tonearm.

Congratulations on your setup - I've never heard my Koetsu's perform as well as on my FR tonearms.

Cheers, Joe

Haha, yes unfortunately the inertia of long-formed biases can be very hard to overcome. It requires lots of patience and faith. And thanks, Joe! Now that I fully "hear" it with the 64S/Koetsu combo, I'm scratching my head wondering what was wrong before. Btw I should have a Blue Lace w/ diamond cantilever coming in at some point, too

 

[mountainjoe]

Btw I should have a Blue Lace w/ diamond cantilever coming in at some point, too

Ooh - I'm jealous

I would be interested to know what you think of it compared to your Coralstone body.

Cheers, Joe

 

[Nemal1]

From what I recall of my late fathers, he replaced the fr64s with a sumiko and eventually a triplanar with his Sugan made gold onyx koetsu sand we believe the sound improved with each arm upgrade.
It would be interesting to hear that arm cart combination again.

 

[mountainjoe]

From what I recall of my late fathers, he replaced the fr64s with a sumiko and eventually a triplanar with his Sugan made gold onyx koetsu sand we believe the sound improved with each arm upgrade.
It would be interesting to hear that arm cart combination again.

I tried a couple of Koetsu carts on my Triplanar MKVII tonearm - that is a relatively low mass tonearm (14g) and the stone body Koetsu sounded much better on my FR64s and FR66s. The cart had much improved dynamics on the FR tonearms.

Cheers, Joe

 

[mulveling]

Yep, dynamics and impact is one of the big differences I'm noticing in the migration from Graham Phantom to 64S. Imaging is much better too - way better depth; very 3D/holographic as opposed to slightly flattened.

Crappy (sorry) cellphone pic from this weekend's night listening. Just really ecstatic with how everything has turned out now.