6N6P with REF3?

[Bnn5016]

Hi all, I am new here, I see someone use 6N6P with their REF5SE, REF6 and REF10, how about REF3? Does anyone try? Thanks.

 

[tima]

I have not tried that. Having owned several modern ARC comonents (Ref 2, 2SE, 3, 10 Phono, and 5SE and 10 Linestage) I will speculate that the differences you hear between 6N6P and 6H30 in ARC phonotages will be pretty similar to the differences you hear between those tubes in ARC linestages. The 6N6P is relatively inexpensive so worthwhile to experiment if you want to hear for yourself.

 

[Bnn5016]

I have not tried that. Having owned several modern ARC comonents (Ref 2, 2SE, 3, 10 Phono, and 5SE and 10 Linestage) I will speculate that the differences you hear between 6N6P and 6H30 in ARC phonotages will be pretty similar to the differences you hear between those tubes in ARC linestages. The 6N6P is relatively inexpensive so worthwhile to experiment if you want to hear for yourself.

Thanks your reply Tima. I hope someone who used 6N6P with REF3 and post their review here I appreciate.

 

[Dave Gordon]

Every so often the idea of replacing the 6H30 with a 6N6P pops up, so I asked one of our engineers what he thought. This led to our engineering department testing before performing listening evaluations in 2020. Chris O. wrote the following:
"Greg has done mathematical analysis of the 6N6P vs. the 6H30P, and said the REF6SE circuit would need to be altered by changing component values in order to optimize it for use with the 6N6P, but said even after such optimization, the 6N6P would likely not sound as good as the 6H30P, for a variety of technical reasons. As it stands now, the 6N6P should not be considered a “drop-in “ replacement for the 6H30P –even though it will not damage anything in the REF6SE from an electrical standpoint. Both the bench and sonic tests confirm the 6N6P performs notably poorer than the factory-selected 6H30P in this model."
Greg (Lee) was our chief engineer at the time, before his retirement.

 

[Bnn5016]

Thank you Dave!

 

[DasguteOhr]

Here someone has taken the trouble to compare the two tubes in terms of measurement technology. You can clearly see that the 6n30p is superior in almost all respects. different operating points.

https://www.klausmobile.narod.ru/testerfiles/6n30p.htm

 

[Paul1960]

It is interesting to have somebody from Audio Research comment on this thread. But I have owned an ARC 5SE Reference preamp for a little over a year. It came with 6H30 tubes. When I switched to 6N6P tubes (except for the 6H30 used with the 6550) I found I liked the sound quite a bit better. I thought the music had more dynamics and tonal color. I started having a problem with the 5SE triggering the overload protection on my PS Audio BHK 300 monoblocks so I replaced all of the tubes this time sticking with the 6H30 in all the positions. After 7-10 days of hoping the tubes simply needed to burn in and the 5SE would start sounding good again, I switched back to using 4 6N6P tubes. Immediately, I got the improvement I was looking for. Maybe I just like a tube that "performs notably poorer than the factory-selected 6H30P" LOL.

Good to know that the 6N6P won't damage anything from an electrical standpoint. I did worry about that. And I think it is likely that the 6N6P has a shorter life than the 6H30. Since they are still relatively cheap that isn't a concern.

 

[Dave Gordon]

It is interesting to have somebody from Audio Research comment on this thread. But I have owned an ARC 5SE Reference preamp for a little over a year. It came with 6H30 tubes. When I switched to 6N6P tubes (except for the 6H30 used with the 6550) I found I liked the sound quite a bit better. I thought the music had more dynamics and tonal color. I started having a problem with the 5SE triggering the overload protection on my PS Audio BHK 300 monoblocks so I replaced all of the tubes this time sticking with the 6H30 in all the positions. After 7-10 days of hoping the tubes simply needed to burn in and the 5SE would start sounding good again, I switched back to using 4 6N6P tubes. Immediately, I got the improvement I was looking for. Maybe I just like a tube that "performs notably poorer than the factory-selected 6H30P" LOL.

Good to know that the 6N6P won't damage anything from an electrical standpoint. I did worry about that. And I think it is likely that the 6N6P has a shorter life than the 6H30. Since they are still relatively cheap that isn't a concern.

It is good to know what the community is saying about our company, so I drop in to check the forums on WBF and provide information that may be useful.
The issue of 6N6P tubes has come up a couple of times on FaceBook, so it made sense to respond with our take on it. As most users know, there is no equivalent or drop-in replacement for the 6H30, so tube rolling per se is out. The 6N6P is the only gray area tube I've come across because it can be substituted for the 6H30 without causing an electrical problem. Not an electrical match, but it should not cause problems.
The last time this came up, a 6SE owner wrote
"Update on the 6N6P vs 6H30. After further listening I must admit my original thoughts were wrong. The 6H30’s are the clear winner. As both tubes started to really settle in it became pretty obvious. The smearing of vocals and dynamics being the biggest issue with the NOS 6N6P tubes."
I'm not saying that the 6N6P doesn't sound better in your 5SE, and in your system; I am happy that you are getting the sound you prefer–that is a big part of what this whole thing is about, at least to me. Most of us hear components or systems we like and others that don't quite do it for us, for whatever reason, and that's what the art of tuning or creating a system is about. Happy listening.

 

[Bnn5016]

Thank you DasguteOhr & Paul1960.