VAC 452 iQ review in Stereophile

[microstrip]

The Halcro amps I heard years ago were terrible. Very sterile and they used lots of negative feedback. The new ones with even lower distortion probably uses even more negative feedback.

Considering the evolution of audio design during the last decades I would say that the important aspect is not having negative feedback, it is the way negative feedback is applied.

 

[bonzo75]

I fully disagree on this aspect. This hobby is broad, diverse and vague enough to support contradictory views without any of the parts showing any ignorance. I have met Fremer and talked with him, and we although we share some views and preferences, many times I disagree a lot with what he writes and his methods.

IMHO it is reader responsibility to understand reviewer preferences and from there interpolate what we can learn from his writings. No reviewer or high-end guru can guess what we hear when we try an equipment in our particular system and room.

BTW, IMHO reading a review implies listening to the recordings that are referred in the review. Otherwise it is mostly a literature contest - that I sometimes appreciate.

I didn't say you have to always agree with what he writes. I certainly don't with each component. But appreciating his process and writing style is a different thing. I know you will disagree with his process hesitate because you appreciate the process of that guy in TAS who always writes without compares. Also knowing your gear preferences it is quite apparent to me you will disagree with him

 

[Derekw14]

For what's it worth, I heard a SIT3 driving the equally insensitive and wonderful Boenicke W5 to beguiling results. The preamp was a vintage Cayin, probably quite high gain. That sound was intoxicating on acoustic jazz, we didn't try orchestra or heavy rock though, so perhaps was it more limited than I realized. But splendid it was.

 

[cjfrbw]

Of the handful of components I have heard or had in my own system, Fremer's reviews have been spot on. He does indulge in gourmandizing purple prose on occasion. However, flavors of audio are really difficult to describe, so there's that.

If you can psychologically neutralize the cost issue of the components to reduce the wealth antagonisms, he has a developed ear. I don't always agree with his choices in products, but, so what.

VAC demos in whatever situation I have heard them have always sounded good to me. However, I have always heard them in very expensive setups at shows or dealers.

"For what's it worth, I heard a SIT3 driving the equally insensitive and wonderful Boenicke W5"

I have a DEFISIT amp on the way based on the general topologies of SIT3, but using TOKIN VFET/SIT. I am interested in comparing it to my tubes and push pull Sony VFET.

 

[Jeffy]

True, but Halcro uses a lot of it. Look at the distortion figures as that is how to get them low. All amps have to use some type of local feedback, but not global feedback.

 

[the sound of Tao]

Of the handful of components I have heard or had in my own system, Fremer's reviews have been spot on. He does indulge in gourmandizing purple prose on occasion. However, flavors of audio are really difficult to describe, so there's that.

If you can psychologically neutralize the cost issue of the components to reduce the wealth antagonisms, he has a developed ear. I don't always agree with his choices in products, but, so what.

Both lyrical and to me true cj... nicely put.

I’d agree that Michael Fremer is adept at describing what he hears but (as with you) I then don’t necessarily always share his preferences.

So when I have heard gear that he has reviewed (and as you rightly point out his is often the realm of the astronomical so much is beyond me humble hearing means) but I can often resonate to what he describes but also sometimes his choices (in gear and music as well) can also then not be my preference.

While not at all like rocket science in process writing through abstracting and then defining experience in music is just frickin difficult. Some don’t even try (which strikes me as rather a shame). Some see ideas as a competition but in truth there are few victors. In this writing about audio stuff some spend a shipload of time just being competitive in their great writing/debate. As a reader this is for me the most awkward part of the sport.

So is agreeing with another the sign that either of you are then right (think not) or more importantly is winning central to an argument and are we so frail to allow rare truth to be a collateral loss in our being right all the time (hope not).

So I humbly don’t agree that either agreeing and or disagreeing with Michael Fremer means anything much at all really and is certainly unimportant in the scheme of things... I like his style and can appreciate his content but everyone has their own way of hearing and their own writing champions and I can appreciate the varying efforts of quite a few reviewers.

Once again I’d figure we are simply just too often drawn to be absolutists in this delightfully subjective sport and that this idea may simply be caught up in the notion of one being declared wrong just so that others can then be proven to be right. Diversity of opinion is of great value in navigating towards any truth. Monocultures in ideas can just as easily steer us completely in the wrong way.

 

[caesar]

As far as reviewers go, would this thread have the legs and passion if it were written by Mark Johnson or Bob Peterson?

The only 2 reviewers who are Trusted Advisors in this business are Fremer and "Great Yoda" Valin. These guys may have big egos but at least they aren't solely focused on their ego boost and self-importance, but also add something to the guy trying to purchase gear after saving for many, many months or years.

The rest are mostly mediocre but not totally worthless- if they compare gear. Would like to see those guys focus more on what is important to their reader and to the gear purchaser.

And the guys who don't compare gear are filthy scum that spit in the face of the fans. The garbage they write like "articulate bass" , "clean midrange" and "sparkly extended highs" can be interpreted in any way, on any system, and one can't tell if they are talking about an amp, DAC, or speakers. I am sure that the famous self-loathing audiophile, Ethan Winer hears the same stuff through the perfectly-measuring gear he found in a garbage dump.

Maybe these guys can be asked to guess which song I am humming right now ... maybe it's "Happy Birthday" or something else... no one will ever know- just like no one can decipher what these guys are writing about... But as I started typing this and thinking of these guys, the song that came to my mind is ...

 

[morricab]

As far as reviewers go, would this thread have the legs and passion if it were written by Mark Johnson or Bob Peterson?

The only 2 reviewers who are Trusted Advisors in this business are Fremer and "Great Yoda" Valin. These guys may have big egos but at least they aren't solely focused on their ego boost and self-importance, but also add something to the guy trying to purchase gear after saving for many, many months or years.

The rest are mostly mediocre but not totally worthless- if they compare gear. Would like to see those guys focus more on what is important to their reader and to the gear purchaser.

And the guys who don't compare gear are filthy scum that spit in the face of the fans. The garbage they write like "articulate bass" , "clean midrange" and "sparkly extended highs" can be interpreted in any way, on any system, and one can't tell if they are talking about an amp, DAC, or speakers. I am sure that the famous self-loathing audiophile, Ethan Winer hears the same stuff through the perfectly-measuring gear he found in a garbage dump.

Maybe these guys can be asked to guess which song I am humming right now ... maybe it's "Happy Birthday" or something else... no one will ever know- just like no one can decipher what these guys are writing about... But as I started typing this and thinking of these guys, the song that came to my mind is ...

I don't trust Valin's opinion at all. Fremer I think at least has some intellectual honesty even if I don't really think he has a great handle on how the real thing should sound. I always really liked Martin Colloms's reviews as they were quite informative and pretty accurate (at least compared to my own experience on the same gear)...at least for tube gear.

 

[caesar]

I don't trust Valin's opinion at all. Fremer I think at least has some intellectual honesty even if I don't really think he has a great handle on how the real thing should sound. I always really liked Martin Colloms's reviews as they were quite informative and pretty accurate (at least compared to my own experience on the same gear)...at least for tube gear.

Yeah, I think Valin is complicated...

5-10 years ago I used to call him "Sterile" Jon due to his constant "MAGICO IS BEST" / "OOOH Magico" / "Aahh Magico" proclamations in every piece he wrote - review and show report. And, of course, he also invested considerable capital in building up the Raidho brand, which has caused a lot of pain and losses for a lot of people... And now he seems to be looking to review the Borressen speakers, which are probably very similar to the Raidhos...

But on the other hand, looking from the perspective of the US market, where we have what seems like 85% box speaker penetration resulting in an intellectualized sound that's killing the hobby, along with a small smattering of Magnepans and Martin logans, he's the only guy who has actually stepped out to review and point out the virtues of non-box speaker designs...

He has reviewed stats, omnis, planars, Avantgarde horns (5 years ago - but no one else really has reviewed real horns other than something obscure Art Dudley may have written about), in addition to frequently sterile sounding combinations like Magico/ CH Precisions...

He is an outstanding writer. The conclusion is the same - it sounds "real" and "musicians are in the room". Yet he knows how to get his reader to WANT the gear, or at least to talk about it and audition it. Like a giant walking above the liliputians,vermin and scum below him. TAS is pretty much over when he can't do it anymore.

No one with any intellectual integrity can claim that the Magico and Raidho would be the same without his publicizing those brands... Stereophile reviewed magico something like twice in the last 10-12 years.

No one is even close in writing talent, and presenting that big picture view, a la Peggy Noonan and Maureen Dowd. And Valin always compares gear/ different technologies. So by the breadth of work and by stepping away from that wilson/ dcs herd just about every other US reviewer is part of, he deserves a lot of credit.

 

[caesar]

Supposedly Valin used to be an Avantgarde owner before he got into Magico. I hope he goes on another high -efficiency / SET trip before he gets too old.

 

[Lagonda]

Supposedly Valin used to be an Avantgarde owner before he got into Magico. I hope he goes on another high -efficiency / SET trip before he gets too old.

Was he not also the first to give MBL raving reviews ? He was definitely part of positioning that brand too

 

[caesar]

Was he not also the first to give MBL raving reviews ? He was definitely part of positioning that brand too

Yep. He had the 101s and has reviewed the X-tremes twice.

Fremer has also reviewed the MBL 101s twice, which may be the only design outside of box speakers he has liked/ reviewed .
So has the white-haired, DSD - loving, smoke-puffing dude from Positive Feedback (look like huge hits; what's in his pipe?). And so has Peter Breuninger among the mainstream reviewers. So MBL appeals to a more diverse bunch of mainstream reviewer tastes than most other gear.

 

[Lagonda]

Yep. He had the 101s and has reviewed the X-tremes twice.

Fremer has also reviewed the MBL 101s twice, which may be the only design outside of box speakers he has liked/ reviewed .
So has the white-haired, DSD - loving, smoke-puffing dude from Positive Feedback (look like huge hits; what's in his pipe?). And so has Peter Breuninger among the mainstream reviewers. So MBL appeals to a more diverse bunch of mainstream reviewer tastes than most other gear.

And they probably have a nice fat marketing budget

 

[caesar]

And they probably have a nice fat marketing budget

No doubt. In this hobby/ industry, marketing is a fight for influence.

Yet their approach has several powerful prongs, all virtuously working together.

To their credit, the MBL team does an incredible job at shows (at least in the USA). Their rooms at shows are packed due to top notch sound. Show after show after show after show...They are truly the best team out there.

The gear also looks luxuriously designed (although I find it a way over the top, but I prefer minimalism: I prefer the look of Soulution to MBL and D'Agostino).

So exclusivity/ luxury design, packed rooms of satisfied fans, and top reviewers praising the product in reviews and after shows - all makes that marketing strategy that much more potent.

 

[Lagonda]

No doubt. In this hobby/ industry, marketing is a fight for influence.

Yet their approach has several powerful prongs, all virtuously working together.

To their credit, the MBL team does an incredible job at shows (at least in the USA). Their rooms at shows are packed due to top notch sound. Show after show after show after show...They are truly the best team out there.

The gear also looks luxuriously designed (although I find it a way over the top, but I prefer minimalism: I prefer the look of Soulution to MBL and D'Agostino).

So exclusivity/ luxury design, packed rooms of satisfied fans, and top reviewers praising the product in reviews and after shows - all makes that marketing strategy that much more potent.

I find some of their designs over the top too, but surprisingly everyone that sees and hears the 9011 amps in real life is impressed and understand why they are costly. Personally i prefer the looks of older Krell or Levinson, but Soulution is just to understated and boring for my taste. If you want to charge top prices for equipment please make it look more expensive than 500$ generic brand offering.

 

[morricab]

Yeah, I think Valin is complicated...

5-10 years ago I used to call him "Sterile" Jon due to his constant "MAGICO IS BEST" / "OOOH Magico" / "Aahh Magico" proclamations in every piece he wrote - review and show report. And, of course, he also invested considerable capital in building up the Raidho brand, which has caused a lot of pain and losses for a lot of people... And now he seems to be looking to review the Borressen speakers, which are probably very similar to the Raidhos...

But on the other hand, looking from the perspective of the US market, where we have what seems like 85% box speaker penetration resulting in an intellectualized sound that's killing the hobby, along with a small smattering of Magnepans and Martin logans, he's the only guy who has actually stepped out to review and point out the virtues of non-box speaker designs...

He has reviewed stats, omnis, planars, Avantgarde horns (5 years ago - but no one else really has reviewed real horns other than something obscure Art Dudley may have written about), in addition to frequently sterile sounding combinations like Magico/ CH Precisions...

He is an outstanding writer. The conclusion is the same - it sounds "real" and "musicians are in the room". Yet he knows how to get his reader to WANT the gear, or at least to talk about it and audition it. Like a giant walking above the liliputians,vermin and scum below him. TAS is pretty much over when he can't do it anymore.

No one with any intellectual integrity can claim that the Magico and Raidho would be the same without his publicizing those brands... Stereophile reviewed magico something like twice in the last 10-12 years.

No one is even close in writing talent, and presenting that big picture view, a la Peggy Noonan and Maureen Dowd. And Valin always compares gear/ different technologies. So by the breadth of work and by stepping away from that wilson/ dcs herd just about every other US reviewer is part of, he deserves a lot of credit.

Yes, due to his writing skills he has influenced a generation of audiophiles...but to what end? HP was the big influencer of a generation before but seemed genuinely interested in the actual pursuit but I think JV is interested in his influence and what goodies he can collect. I got really turned off by JV when the cable selling scandal broke and also his endless cheerleading brands that, to my ears, were not sure what he claimed.
Prior to that, I too was impressed with the clarity and style of his writing. But I stopped reading him once I felt he was not putting honest opinions out.

 

[spiritofmusic]

My abiding memory of Fremer was his championing of the little Whest phono, a small, inexpensive (sub-£500) British boutique product. He gave it a 5* review, saying it gave the big $25k Boulder phono (2000 era pricing) a reasonable run for it's money.

The next issue came the retraction from him...he wanted to make quite clear that the Whest couldn't really match up to the Boulder, and he'd been imprecise w his words.

I must say, I was so impressed w that whole episode.

 

[Lagonda]

My abiding memory of Fremer was his championing of the little Whest phono, a small, inexpensive (sub-£500) British boutique product. He gave it a 5* review, saying it gave the big $25k Boulder phono (2000 era pricing) a reasonable run for it's money.

The next issue came the retraction from him...he wanted to make quite clear that the Whest couldn't really match up to the Boulder, and he'd been imprecise w his words.

I must say, I was so impressed w that whole episode.

Yes Fremer seems to be a complicated man, and his reasons for liking or disliking products are always a nice mix of sound inputs, history with the distributor/manufacturer, potential marketing budgets and sometimes just plain old ego.
I still enjoy his reviews on occasion, he sure knows how to write an interesting tale

 

[spiritofmusic]

I've never seen a turnaround like it
He admitted to really bad choice of words
Obv he sacked his proof reader and got a better trained one Lol

 

[Lagonda]

I've never seen a turnaround like it
He admitted to really bad choice of words
Obv he sacked his proof reader and got a better trained one Lol

Maybe the check didn’t clear ?