What is Reference level and how is it determined?

[Robh3606]

Rob,

With all due respect, your peak level may be far different than others.

What I've found over the years, is that the better the system (higher resolution, clarity, etc.) the lower the level one requires to enjoy the system.

Even though my system can do this, I've never reached that peak. Hurts my ears not to mention potential long term hearing damage.

Best.

Hello thedudeabides

You are missing the point. Have you ever used a peak reading digital SPL meter?? If you have you would know that even at average levels or 85dB you can get peaks above 105Db. We are talking instantaneous peaks not averages. If you listen around 85dB you getting exposed to those levels already you just don't know it.

Rob

 

[jmhenrie]

Recently went to an Elton John concert, I was really enjoying it so I
pulled out my sound meter app and the average was 95db at my seating position max was 103db. So when listening to Elton my reference volume is 95db
Cheers mike

 

[LL21]

Recently went to an Elton John concert, I was really enjoying it so I
pulled out my sound meter app and the average was 95db at my seating position max was 103db. So when listening to Elton my reference volume is 95db
Cheers mike

We have to be audiophiles to bring a sound meter to a concert! I love it. Most people try to take selfies, photos, videos, recording...but a sound meter? This is great...95db it is!

EDIT: i re-read it...you wrote sound meter app...is this one of those iphone things? ok...that makes more sense! hah!

 

[FrantzM]

This debate about Reference Level brings to mind one of the reasoning behind my preference or high power amplifiers: Real music has a lot of high SPL peaks. Power is needed to correctly reproduce these cleanly.

 

[microstrip]

This debate about Reference Level brings to mind one of the reasoning behind my preference or high power amplifiers: Real music has a lot of high SPL peaks. Power is needed to correctly reproduce these cleanly.

Unfortunately once you start using measurements - a simple RMS voltmeter and a calibration CD are enough - you will find that you are really using all this power, unless you have very inefficient speakers, a very absorptive room or do not care about your ears ...

Most people (surely not you...) get the idea they need power just because in some brands the more powerful amplifiers simply sound better, even at low levels.

 

[FrantzM]

Unfortunately once you start using measurements - a simple RMS voltmeter and a calibration CD are enough - you will find that you are really using all this power, unless you have very inefficient speakers, a very absorptive room or do not care about your ears ...

Most people (surely not you...) get the idea they need power just because in some brands the more powerful amplifiers simply sound better, even at low levels.

Ok

 

[jfrech]

This debate about Reference Level brings to mind one of the reasoning behind my preference or high power amplifiers: Real music has a lot of high SPL peaks. Power is needed to correctly reproduce these cleanly.

HI real power or ample headroom...or these these synonymous?

 

[PeterA]

I'm confused. Are we talking about a reference level for technical reasons and a matching level standard, or are we talking about reference level products that manufacturers often use to describe their best efforts and reviewers use to refer to those components which they use as a sonic reference to compare to others under review? It is not clear to me from the OP.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Rob,

With all due respect, your peak level may be far different than others.

What I've found over the years, is that the better the system (higher resolution, clarity, etc.) the lower the level one requires to enjoy the system.

Even though my system can do this, I've never reached that peak. Hurts my ears not to mention potential long term hearing damage.

Best.

I find that with pop/rock music which is relatively compressed, or even Jazz where most recordings are predictable I have a bit of leeway as to the reference level I can play it at. I find minimal adjustment to get the 'right' level.

however; with classical, particularly full orchestral pieces on my system, that getting the reference level right can make a significant difference to the flow of the music since the dynamic and SPL range is so wide. on crescendos and high level runs the SPL's and dynamic energy can be daunting. which is how it is live too. one has to be in the mood to be that involved. and when I am in that mood having that headroom and horsepower in speakers, amplifier and room design makes for quite a ride. of course, that issue is what drove me to move homes and build a dedicated large room. the room and that headroom allows the music to be natural and has sufficient ease on peaks to avoid that full-body-cringe factor. that is where the payback for the commitment lives.

listening to full tilt boogie levels and allowing the music to wash over you and get carried away sonically and physically is lots of fun for me.

there are a few live Jazz recordings which can mimic live energy if I turn them loose too.

I'm looking forward to my new darTZeel preamp which will have the numerical volume readout allowing me to be able to nail that reference level more consistently.

 

[Johnny Vinyl]

I'm confused. Are we talking about a reference level for technical reasons and a matching level standard, or are we talking about reference level products that manufacturers often use to describe their best efforts and reviewers use to refer to those components which they use as a sonic reference to compare to others under review? It is not clear to me from the OP.

The bolded. My apologies if I wasn't clear in my OP (I thought I was).

 

[thedudeabides]

Mike and Rob,

Point well taken.

In most cases, and as Mike points out, there simply isn't that wide dynamic range swing on the media.

And there is data that suggests that listening to higher SPL's for a sustained time, can eventually damage your hearing.

Am I guilty of listening to say, the Firebird, at aggressive levels. Absolutely.