Tripoint troy signature grounding device

[bonzo75]

http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...llus-grounding&p=217244&viewfull=1#post217244

 

[Tango]

Hello Mike,

With your Elite in the system, try Dean Martin's Dream with Dean on your NVS with friends in the room. Last week, Michael of Zellaton was listening with me and we ended up singing out loud while listening to "I Will Buy That Dream". Very joyful.

Kind regards,
Tang

 

[Mike Lavigne]

As someone who does not employ any grounding devices at the moment I also appreciate this question. If someone can explain what I need to do to get started or point me to a post which explains in brief the order in which I should try I would appreciate it. How do I even know of its needed in my system? Only by trying a component? Not sure I can wade through 88 pages of grounding comments! Thanks.

not sure of Spirit's stream of consciousness (or question if it is a question), can be condensed into something simple.

but you ask why grounding, and why Tripoint? where to start?

this whole subject is a grey area since it's a fine tuning process to an already settled system. I would not recommend throwing grounding products into a significantly evolving system. any/all systems can benefit from bettering grounding. but you will just muddle your system building efforts with grounding products inserted at the wrong time.

OTOH; if you do have a system that you are essentially satisfied with and would like to push it further then grounding is an area that can be optimized. grounding can be cost effective since it can result in performance benefits exceeding other gear upgrades. or benefits not otherwise achieved.

the most significant effect of grounding is (1) on a preamp since it's the pivot point, then next is (2) sources since garbage in-garbage out. add more information and lower the noise floor on the source and everything gets better. next (3) is amplifiers.

as far as specific products; this thread is about Tripoint. there is another one about Entreq. I use both in my system. there are other products as well as DIY approaches too.

i'll make one comment comparatively; in my opinion the Tripoint is significantly superior to other products I have tried, by about it's cost X difference. but again; it's a cherry on top to the main course, not a fundamental system building device. and the more capable system, and the lower it's noise and the greater it's information retrieval capability is to begin with, the greater the benefit from these grounding products. which is why a mature system is needed to begin with.

so feedback on these products does not have universal application. they are not plug and play.

what does grounding do? why does it work? isn't quality gear already properly grounded? chassis grounding? signal path grounding? tied to the power grid ground? or floating?

all good questions. google is your friend.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Mike, for me of all the tweaks that were dramatic in my previous, mains quality corrupted Inner London apartment, my Entreq has been least effective here in the quiet countryside.
My transformer, dedicated lines, Furutech duplexes, Sablon Reserva and Elites cables and pwr cords, have all been dramatic here in my new room, and the cherry on the cake being my Stacores.
But Entreq? I wouldn't invest now if this was the first time I was auditioning the effects.
There is a gently opening up of soundstage w it in, and some degree of extra sweetness/less grunge, but it's a lot more subtle than in London.
This has been quite an eye opener, and I put this down to my mains quality being so unadulterated to start, and my lines and pwr cords being so noise free, that signal grounding is just not the decisive factor it was in the electrical miasma before.
What I am finding critical in my new room is vibn control, hence my Stacore journey.
Maybe once that lot is done, and I recharge my finances, I'll reinvestigate grounding, and Troy.
Btw Mike, when your wife asks how much the Troy Elite box is, and what's in it, do you have the smelling salts to bring her around from her faint?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Hello Mike,

With your Elite in the system, try Dean Martin's Dream with Dean on your NVS with friends in the room. Last week, Michael of Zellaton was listening with me and we ended up singing out loud while listening to "I Will Buy That Dream". Very joyful.

Kind regards,
Tang

hello Tang,

your Tripoint pictures were part of the inspiration to move me forward with the Elite.

I will look forward to playing 'I Will Buy That Dream' with the Elite and friends. 'Dreaming with Dean' is already a joyful 'grin producing' recording I play often for visitors.....'Blue Moon' is the cut I've most played.

kind regards,

Mike

 

[microstrip]

(...) what does grounding do? why does it work? isn't quality gear already properly grounded? chassis grounding? signal path grounding? tied to the power grid ground? or floating?

all good questions. google is your friend.

IMHO google is our worst enemy in such matter ...

Since developers decided to hide the relevant information, only owners could help us trying to understand how these devices work. IMHO the critical question is knowing about the bandwidth covered by the device. Then we could think about measuring the absorption spectrum!

 

[howiebrou]

not sure of Spirit's stream of consciousness (or question if it is a question), can be condensed into something simple.

but you ask why grounding, and why Tripoint? where to start?

this whole subject is a grey area since it's a fine tuning process to an already settled system. I would not recommend throwing grounding products into a significantly evolving system. any/all systems can benefit from bettering grounding. but you will just muddle your system building efforts with grounding products inserted at the wrong time.

OTOH; if you do have a system that you are essentially satisfied with and would like to push it further then grounding is an area that can be optimized. grounding can be cost effective since it can result in performance benefits exceeding other gear upgrades. or benefits not otherwise achieved.

the most significant effect of grounding is (1) on a preamp since it's the pivot point, then next is (2) sources since garbage in-garbage out. add more information and lower the noise floor on the source and everything gets better. next (3) is amplifiers.

as far as specific products; this thread is about Tripoint. there is another one about Entreq. I use both in my system. there are other products as well as DIY approaches too.

i'll make one comment comparatively; in my opinion the Tripoint is significantly superior to other products I have tried, by about it's cost X difference. but again; it's a cherry on top to the main course, not a fundamental system building device. and the more capable system, and the lower it's noise and the greater it's information retrieval capability is to begin with, the greater the benefit from these grounding products. which is why a mature system is needed to begin with.

so feedback on these products does not have universal application. they are not plug and play.

what does grounding do? why does it work? isn't quality gear already properly grounded? chassis grounding? signal path grounding? tied to the power grid ground? or floating?

all good questions. google is your friend.

Mike,

Appreciate the extensive answer. From your comments it would seem that grounding has the potential to be more than a 'tweak', more significant than, for example, a Dac or cable upgrade. I agree if your system is constantly changing and you have yet to truly understand its nuances then tweaking merely complicates the picture. I have always wondered how clean my power coming in is and whether grounding might help. Using power regenerators has not brought a huge change to previous systems. I guess dedicated lines from a dedicated fusebox does help. Well, I am no hurry to try grounding yet. One day I'm sure a tripoint might find itself being tested but in the meantime I will enjoy watching your journey. Thanks

howie

 

[howiebrou]

IMHO google is our worst enemy in such matter ...

Since developers decided to hide the relevant information, only owners could help us trying to understand how these devices work. IMHO the critical question is knowing about the bandwidth covered by the device. Then we could think about measuring the absorption spectrum!

Kind of what i was alluding to as well. Too much BS and marketing BS on the web. Real world recommendations carry more weight imho.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Howie, you'll get nothing of use online.
No consensus as to how it works.
Disputes it even should be called "grounding".
Relations or not to star grounding.
References to "kitty litter".
Disputes if the whole thing is pure placebo.
And of course gripes about the price.
But hard information? Forget it.
Purely an exercise in "suck it and see".

 

[Audiocrack]

thanks Rudolf. following your bold lead.

I have high expectations (I better for the $$$'s). but it's funny how sometimes until your ears actually hear a new step for the first time you are never prepared for the leap.

knowing what the Troy Signature and the -2- Thor SE Master Ref cables have done for my pre+sources, at some point I was going to find a way to get some Tripoint love on my amplifiers, confident what that should/could do. and this approach should raise the bar in both source and amplifier areas significantly. last night, per Herve's (Mr. darTZeel) instructions, I went to the hardware store and found some stainless screws nuts and washers to allow me to attach a ground cable to a specific stainless steel chassis screw on the back of each dart mono block. I tested it and i'm good to go. just need the Elite to arrive.

You will not be disappointed, Mike, on the contrary: I am sure the (audio) effect will surpass your expectations. Your Elite - if you understand what I mean - is an extraordinary piece of audio equipment that is going to seduce you!

 

[Audiocrack]

Howie, you'll get nothing of use online.
No consensus as to how it works.
Disputes it even should be called "grounding".
Relations or not to star grounding.
References to "kitty litter".
Disputes if the whole thing is pure placebo.
And of course gripes about the price.
But hard information? Forget it.
Purely an exercise in "suck it and see".

You should trust the people with top notch systems and good ears: those who employ Tripoint devices are without exception (hugely) enthusiastic about them.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Rudolph, as you know I've spent a fortune and tore my hair out for 9 months getting my room right.
Acoustically and electrically, and thankfully v successfully.
Everything is immediately evident in making an impvt, or not.
No half measures.
Troy could work a treat here.
I would like to consider Troy, but find the journey likely prohibitive.
Most people w analog and digital, monoblocks, streamers and dacs and phonos, and multiple psus, would need say a dozen components grounded.
Minimum.
SURELY for such a final destination solution like the Elite, or even the not at all shy SE, there should be more than 3-4 ground posts?
I cannot imagine wanting to ground more than 2 components per post.
That means in my system needing 12 grounds I'd be forced to invest in 2 SEs or 2 Elites.
No way can I contemplate considering that.
Maybe when Miguel comes up with a ground box that has at least 6 posts (but not twice price of current units), I'll revisit.

 

[Audiocrack]

My Tripoint emperor has 8 binding post but is not produced anymore. I believe the Tripoint Prince has 8 binding posts as well but I am not 100% about that. Can be checked easily.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Yes, but now we're in $60-80k territory.
With Master Ref cbls at $6k a throw, that's $150k.
Add the ?Empress? to grnd spkr terminals, and were N of $200k.
Rudolph, I'm not going to argue pricing, it is what it is.
And hey, he can't make them fast enough as they get snapped up by the AE crowd.
So bitching about it has no effect.
But I'm fairly sure that 2 grnd cbls per post is the maxx advised, and that means 1 SE or Elite box grounds a max of 6-8 components, not sufficient for my needs.
An SE box at the same price w six posts not three, COULD JUST swing concept/affordability my way.
Obv this isn't going to change, the demand is there for the pricey stuff, so his cheapest option of Standard box w Standard cbls would be my ballpark.
But I do feel there is justifiable comment to be made raising an eyebrow over uber priced boxes where you need two to fully serve a system.

 

[gian60]

I was interesting in Tripoint,but i stop for their high price

One day i will try,Italian distributor borrow to me,TELOS AUDIO GNR,is active and you can connect 6 machine
Price list in Italy 6.000 euro,i think could be no bad

 

[Audiocrack]

Yes, but now we're in $60-80k territory.
With Master Ref cbls at $6k a throw, that's $150k.
Add the ?Empress? to grnd spkr terminals, and were N of $200k.
Rudolph, I'm not going to argue pricing, it is what it is.
And hey, he can't make them fast enough as they get snapped up by the AE crowd.
So bitching about it has no effect.
But I'm fairly sure that 2 grnd cbls per post is the maxx advised, and that means 1 SE or Elite box grounds a max of 6-8 components, not sufficient for my needs.
An SE box at the same price w six posts not three, COULD JUST swing concept/affordability my way.
Obv this isn't going to change, the demand is there for the pricey stuff, so his cheapest option of Standard box w Standard cbls would be my ballpark.
But I do feel there is justifiable comment to be made raising an eyebrow over uber priced boxes where you need two to fully serve a system.

You are repeating yourself, Marc. So please let's go on with the thread regarding the performance of the Tripoint devices.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Repeating oneself is a trait of audiofools, spend, listen, spend some more

 

[microstrip]

As far as I see the Tripoint troy signature has three grounding posts. Any rules on how should we distribute grounding wires between them?

 

[RogerD]

Rudolph, as you know I've spent a fortune and tore my hair out for 9 months getting my room right.
Acoustically and electrically, and thankfully v successfully.
Everything is immediately evident in making an impvt, or not.
No half measures.
Troy could work a treat here.
I would like to consider Troy, but find the journey likely prohibitive.
Most people w analog and digital, monoblocks, streamers and dacs and phonos, and multiple psus, would need say a dozen components grounded.
Minimum.
SURELY for such a final destination solution like the Elite, or even the not at all shy SE, there should be more than 3-4 ground posts?
I cannot imagine wanting to ground more than 2 components per post.
That means in my system needing 12 grounds I'd be forced to invest in 2 SEs or 2 Elites.
No way can I contemplate considering that.
Maybe when Miguel comes up with a ground box that has at least 6 posts (but not twice price of current units), I'll revisit.

The capacity of any Tripoint should be unlimited as far as grounding multiple components. The only limitation is the users ability to configure the connection. There is no hocus pocus here,the connection to mains ground is sufficient.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I was interesting in Tripoint,but i stop for their high price.

Gian my friend, I've seen the beautiful pictures of your wonderful system.....high price does not appear to be a hindrance.