The Path to Paradise . . . or the Road to Ruin?

[Ron Resnick]

I am on a personal quest for the last and ultimate loudspeaker system of my life. I find that as I audition each carefully researched candidate I discover a sonic compromise or a build quality compromise which causes it to fail my personal specification of perfection. (I know that no loudspeaker is perfect.) I try to solve the discovered compromise by nominating a different speaker which does not embody that compromise.

Through this process I find myself drifting inexorably towards state-of-the-art speaker systems as the only way to avoid a compromise in one area without opening a new compromise in another area. This is how audiophiles gravitate to loudspeaker systems such as Evolution Acoustics MM7, Genesis Dragon, Cessaro Beethoven, Gryphon Pendragon, Nola Grand Reference, Tidal La Assoluta, Rockport Arrakis, Wilson XLF with subwoofers, etc.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Ron, as you know, my thoughts are that as I go up the price and (so called) perfection path, the more fussy I become, and at the prices and talents of SOTA contenders like Rockport, Magico, Cessaro, I find sufficient doubts, that I go easier on less exalted/less pricey alternatives.
So, w/the Cessaro Liszts I've recently heard £65k-£85k, amazing class leading dynamics and texture are somewhat conterbalanced by moderate coherency and bass integration issues, that means I'd struggle to settle on them w/out some doubts. And at the price demanded by them, this is a dilemma.

 

[audioguy]

I am on a personal quest for the last and ultimate loudspeaker system of my life. I find that as I audition each carefully researched candidate I discover a sonic compromise or a build quality compromise which causes it to fail my personal specification of perfection. (I know that no loudspeaker is perfect.) I try to solve the discovered compromise by nominating a different speaker which does not embody that compromise.

Through this process I find myself drifting inexorably towards state-of-the-art speaker systems as the only way to avoid a compromise in one area without opening a new compromise in another area. This is how audiophiles gravitate to loudspeaker systems such as Evolution Acoustics MM7, Genesis Dragon, Cessaro Beethoven, Gryphon Pendragon, Nola Grand Reference, Tidal La Assoluta, Rockport Arrakis, Wilson XLF with subwoofers, etc.

I don't know how to break this to you, but each of your state-of-the-art speakers is also a compromise. Perfect does not exist and I am sure you know that. I can't tell you the total of how much money I spent when on your path (about 40 years), but WAY more than any of those speakers you listed cost. And no matter what speaker choice I ultimately made (none of those individual choices had that many places before the comma), I would eventually hear SOMETHING I thought could be better and to make matters worse, and like a complete moron, would actually go out and listen to other choices. I finally gave up on "perfect" and started chasing "fun". (Way less expensive).

I'm not saying you should not go on your quest, but from someone who was on your path, just be warned.

 

[KeithR]

I know some think "sound only" - but unless you have a dedicated room, aesthetics are important at this level as the speakers get so large. I'm sorry, those Cessaros are massive, ugly ducklings. You couldn't pay me to own them.

Albert Porters Grande Utopia EMs look great in his multi-use room...as do Steve Williams X2s in his dedicated space. No speaker is perfect sonically, but it must visually look SOTA in my room at that price level.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Audioguy, I COMPLETELY agree w/you.
Eight years I came across Zu speakers, and although they didn't fully tick all of the boxes that a'fools sign up to ie SOTA imaging, staging, forensic detail, it just was the most FUN and engaging speaker I'd ever heard, and just made me focus on the music. Now, I haven't given up my OCD membership yet, spending a small fortune on tweaks like Entreq grounding, and balanced power, but it's telling I've never felt driven to look elsewhere.
I'm just about to release a stack of cash from an astute property deal (sold high in London, bought low in the country), and for the first time I have the budget for a pair of uber speakers, considering AG Trios, Cessaro Liszts, Graz Apogee Duetta Signatures. But I have to wonder why when at no time since 2008 have I ever been less than fully entertained by my sound. For me, like you, the a'fool disease of finding fault and looking for perfection elsewhere, is maybe one to be fought. That's not to say if I find a presentation amongst these candidates that is streets ahead of the Zus I won't change, but this all-encompassing involvement I get from Zus is going to be hard to beat. Despite their many flaws that I'm aware of.

 

[Robh3606]

Roll your own and make your own set of compromises. It's fun and a great learning experience. I would be careful with statement speakers as many are just that. They are the designers statement of what the ultimate speaker should sound like. Instead of dropping all your eggs in one basket you might want to consider at least 2 set-ups. I have 3 separate systems all of different speaker types and it's fun jumping from system to system.

Rob

 

[spiritofmusic]

Keith, I am about to embark on a dedicated room, but guess what, I still find the simple, quasi-industrial chic of my Zu Definitions 4, w/plated driver rings/tweeter/base plate, and funky Cosmic Carbon finish, one of the best looks for any speaker, great domestically as well as in a dedicated room.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Hi Ron,

I am not too sure I understand your dilemma? Are you saying that you wanted to avoid paying for a sota speaker system?

 

[spiritofmusic]

He could. Settle on sticking w/his much-loved ML Prodigies, and maybe enliven them w/Seaton SubMersives sub twrs.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Initially I would look at the acoustics of your listening room, you may discover that you already own your 'statement' loudspeakers.
Keith.

I prob will do. I have NO idea whether my proposed triangular x-section loft space audio room of dimensions 45' deep x 9' high (to ridge) x 16' (useable) wide (30' total width) will sound great (all that space to breath, no parallel surfaces), or challenging (triangular, possible flexing in floor/roof)

 

[Ron Resnick]

Hi Ron, I am not too sure I understand your dilemma? Are you saying that you wanted to avoid paying for a sota speaker system?

I think I mainly was just making an observation. When I started this process I never really considered SOTA systems. But the process has led me in that direction.

A fun aspect of the hobby for me historically has been trying to achieve SOTA sound for less than SOTA outlay -- aiming for 70% or 80% of the best for 20% or 30% of the cost. For my current stereo project I am willing to move further up the curve of diminishing returns.

This

 

[spiritofmusic]

Ron, you CAN realise SOTA for 1/2 to 1/3 of cost.
4 twrs Genesis Dragons $350k+, OR...Graz Apogee Definitives/Audio Analysis Orions-4 twrs, plus 2 Seatons SubMersives subs twrs

 

[microstrip]

I think I mainly was just making an observation. When I started this process I never really considered SOTA systems. But the process has led me in that direction. (...)

The last issue of TheAbsoluteSound includes an enthusiastic review of the Marlin Logan Neolith by Robert Hartley

 

[Audiophile Bill]

I think I mainly was just making an observation. When I started this process I never really considered SOTA systems. But the process has led me in that direction.

A fun aspect of the hobby for me historically has been trying to achieve SOTA sound for less than SOTA outlay -- aiming for 70% or 80% of the best for 20% or 30% of the cost. For my current stereo project I am willing to move further up the curve of diminishing returns.

This

Got you, Ron. I think you can achieve incredible results for not much money. Time and again, shows frequently turn up these killer rooms with super value systems that just happen to work incredibly together. Similarly, many of the uber systems fail to live up to the investment and promise. From my own experience owning comparatively big speakers - I always had to work much harder to get them to work but the torture was invariably worth it in the end for me.

If budget is not an issue for you and you enjoy this hobby, then go all out and create your dream system with sota products as you will always wonder what if. If I could, I would

 

[Ron Resnick]

Are you defining SOTA in terms of engineering and measurememt , or desirability,rarity ,pride of ownership etc.
Keith.

I define SOTA in terms of sound quality and construction quality (and I think engineering factors into both of them).

 

[spiritofmusic]

So Ron, your proposition to get SOTA at a fraction of cost? After you hear Gary's Genesis Dragons, are you going to try to hear the Graz Definitives w/Seaton sub twrs, or latter w/AA Orions? You might be pleasantly surprised at how close these options are, w/the Dragons costing 3-4x as much as the other two.

 

[Ron Resnick]

If budget is not an issue for you and you enjoy this hobby, then go all out and create your dream system with sota products as you will always wonder what if. If I could, I would

Budget is always an issue, but I do want to aim pretty high this time.

(But don't Mook me, Bonzo!)

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Budget is always an issue, but I do want to aim pretty high this time.

(But don't Mook me, Bonzo!)

In all seriousness, you need to totally Mook your new system. Giant diamond resonators under all kit and full sextet

 

[spiritofmusic]

OMG!!! You've done it now, Bill. Too late, you didn't know you are addressing Ron "Don't Mook Me!" Resnick!

 

[bonzo75]

OMG!!! You've done it now, Bill. Too late, you didn't know you are addressing Ron "Don't Mook Me!" Resnick!

Once he hears them, he knows what is SOTA. SOTA is that which has no alternative. Mooks, and in digital Lampi, have no alternative. For speakers and amps there always is an alternative, at the same price, higher price, and even at a lower price. That is why search for SOTA always goes on.

ADYC bought mook resonators after reading my posts for his Lampi and now has ordered another pair for preamp - mooked. You should have seen how fast Bill got hooked and mooked