Taiko Audio Extreme DC Power Distributor

[Taiko Audio]

Thanks Emile for your excellent reply. The sonic differences among the filters are rather obvious. What I'm trying to figure out is which one (and which combination) is sonically correct, or to be more appropriate, sonically preferred. The first thing that comes to mind, is that the filters are a good solution to a problem that may not be relevant if a battery was utilized in lieu of an LPS. But that's a story for another day. Meanwhile, it seems they can be a excellent adjunct for system "tuning" as we often like to do, which is of course, the reason you provided such good flexibility among the filter options.

If I remember correctly from my crossover building days, the parameters of impedance, capacitance and inductance are obviously important in altering the bandwidth and slope of the filter function, but inherent in that is also the phase response that is dependent on the filter design (i.e. Butterworth, Bessel, Linkwitz-Riley). I'm currently trying to assess the various filters with particular regard to phase error and their sonic consequences since it is in this area that I think the filter differences impact the sonics in a way that seem to matter most as to what the recording microphones reveal (perhaps most easily assessed for orchestral recordings). Phase errors are, for me, often the key as to the much cited ":you are there" or "they are here" effect in which the time domain changes are perhaps more relevant than frequency domain differences when listening to music reproduction with the various filters in the DCD. I'm still sorting out my preferences but in the interim I'm grateful for the filter options provided while trying to learn their respective sonic signatures.

You're welcome!

Indeed these filters do not provide any benefit, and are even detrimental, when used with our BPS. But they can be beneficial for "off the shelf" battery solutions as the BMSs (Battery Management Systems) used in those are pretty decent noise generators themselves. It took quite some effort to design a BMS which does not contribute any noise to the battery cell noise which is mainly low frequency in nature and only measurable on a nanovolt scale (caused by the battery's chemical processes).

The controversary in all of this is of course that these different filters, which most electrical engineers would consider to be interchangeable and not actually be different at all, as they all more then suffice to "get the job done", create rather substantial differences in your sound, while they're only filtering DC power going into your switch and router which are already heavily filtered.

 

[Steve Williams]

Thanks Emile for your excellent reply. The sonic differences among the filters are rather obvious. What I'm trying to figure out is which one (and which combination) is sonically correct, or to be more appropriate, sonically preferred. The first thing that comes to mind, is that the filters are a good solution to a problem that may not be relevant if a battery was utilized in lieu of an LPS. But that's a story for another day. Meanwhile, it seems they can be a excellent adjunct for system "tuning" as we often like to do, which is of course, the reason you provided such good flexibility among the filter options.

If I remember correctly from my crossover building days, the parameters of impedance, capacitance and inductance are obviously important in altering the bandwidth and slope of the filter function, but inherent in that is also the phase response that is dependent on the filter design (i.e. Butterworth, Bessel, Linkwitz-Riley). I'm currently trying to assess the various filters with particular regard to phase error and their sonic consequences since it is in this area that I think the filter differences impact the sonics in a way that seem to matter most as to what the recording microphones reveal (perhaps most easily assessed for orchestral recordings). Phase errors are, for me, often the key as to the much cited ":you are there" or "they are here" effect in which the time domain changes are perhaps more relevant than frequency domain differences when listening to music reproduction with the various filters in the DCD. I'm still sorting out my preferences but in the interim I'm grateful for the filter options provided while trying to learn their respective sonic signatures.

Hi @MarkusBarkus ,

I don't recommend anything, it's just my personal preference

I honestly feel there is no correct answer. It all boils down to personal preference and one's system.

 

[Kingsrule]

OK So what combination of filters is everyone using?

So far I'm on default to switch and alt1 to router

 

[Steve Williams]

OK So what combination of filters is everyone using?

So far I'm on direct to switch and alt1 to router

im alt2 on router and default on switch and I use XDMS exclusively

 

[MarkusBarkus]

no correct answer. It all boils down to personal preference and one's system.

...oh yes, I get that. I was trying to understand if there was a frequency range the machine preferred for some reason. I suppose if it did, that would have been an engineered solution previously. Cheers...

 

[Kingsrule]

Today I moved the router to default..clearer and better bass, will see what a bit of break-in brings here

 

[Rhapsody]

Has anyone in the US purchased third party, longer than 1M DC cables for the DCD to the switch/router from a US supplier?

 

[RyanTX]

Has anyone in the US purchased third party, longer than 1M DC cables for the DCD to the switch/router from a US supplier?

I have not, but I was looking into this stuff quite a bit last night. One DAC cable that I was considering to try was from a company called Diablo Cable. This is purely from an internet search and nothing else. I have a number of the FS cables including a 4M one which is 24 AWG vs. 30 AWG for everything shorter. After spending most of my time listening with a 0.5M and 1M cable for the last month...when I put the 4M cable back into the system it was vastly different. All of a sudden I had a ton more bass, but the music sounded much slower, like really slow...not sure how else to describe it. So I decided to go on the search for a 1M DAC cable that was 24 AWG which is how I found Diablo--I would be very curious what others have found as well.

There's always been something that I wasn't liking (in my system) with the combo of DCD/router/switch so I've been doing a lot of experimenting over the last week. Just tonight though, I seem to have found something that might be the solution I go with for a while. I actually decided to insert a 1M wire world platinum ethernet cable between the Router and Switch--rather than a DAC connection. In my system, this really widened the sound stage, gave me a lot more bass (which I was lacking), and kept the music fast and lively sounding. So even though I believe the RJ45 connector gives off more "noise" than the DAC cable, this combo sounds really great in my system so it might be worth trying if you feel like tinkering a bit.

EDIT *Sorry, I read DAC cables...not DC cables!* But I'll leave this post here as I think it's relevant to the room and my journey with all these products.

 

[MarkusBarkus]

Has anyone in the US purchased third party, longer than 1M DC cables for the DCD to the switch/router from a US supplier?

Bob, I am "currently" using a 1.5 meter (~5') Sapphire Silver-plated, quad-shielded DC cable from Uptone Audio.

SAPPHIRE Silver-Plated Star-Quad DC Cable

This high performance DC cable is constructed with some of the finest wire available. The topology of the wire is inductance-lowering 'star-quad', ideal for DC power supplies. There are four heavy gauge (AWG 18) conductors, themselves comprised of stranded, silver-plated copper wire. The...

uptoneaudio.com

I knew I would need something with 2.1mm on one end, and 2.5mm on the other, so when I ordered the switch, I ordered the cable from Alex C. too (I powered my switch, and later my DCD with an Uptone LPS2.1, which has 2.1 fixtures, the Taiko gear is 2.5).

The fitment is primo and it all sounds great to me. I recognize some folks prefer unshielded cable, don't like Oyaide connectors, etc. but this works for me.

I actually purchased a set of the Oyaide connectors from VHAudio and plan to cut one of the two Sapphire cables I have in half to make another cable...when I have better vision on gear location when the Olympus I/O arrives.

Just another data point/FYI: with the addition of the DCD, my config is Sapphire cable Farad3 into DCD, stock Taiko cable DCD to switch. Cheers, guys.

ps: Sapphire connector size has size option when ordering.

 

[dminches]

Has anyone in the US purchased third party, longer than 1M DC cables for the DCD to the switch/router from a US supplier?

Bob, they aren’t US-based by Ghent Audio makes great DC cables and their shipping is fast if you choose FedEx.

 

[Rhapsody]

Bob, they aren’t US-based by Ghent Audio makes great DC cables and their shipping is fast if you choose FedEx.

Thank you, David!

 

[Moladiego]

@Taiko Audio Emile, need your clarification if I misunderstand. I gather the DCD is not itself a battery unit; it is an AC/DC power management and conversion system (if I understand correctly) for the Switch and Router. Read before that the erstwhile contemplated BPS would render the DCD obsolete. Because you are not going to produce the big BPS or, if I read correctly, a "mini" battery unit to power the Switch & Router anytime soon, do you think it would be better off for an end-user to develop a 12V battery unit himself to power (a) the household router, (b) the Router, and (c) the Switch rather than using a LPS to power the DCD? If so, should I use 1 mini battery unit for each of the devices (total of 3 mini battery units) rather than 1 big battery unit? Thanks.

 

[Christiaan Punter]

@Taiko Audio Emile, need your clarification if I misunderstand. I gather the DCD is not itself a battery unit; it is an AC/DC power management and conversion system (if I understand correctly) for the Switch and Router. Read before that the erstwhile contemplated BPS would render the DCD obsolete. Because you are not going to produce the big BPS or, if I read correctly, a "mini" battery unit to power the Switch & Router anytime soon, do you think it would be better off for an end-user to develop a 12V battery unit himself to power (a) the household router, (b) the Router, and (c) the Switch rather than using a LPS to power the DCD? If so, should I use 1 mini battery unit for each of the devices (total of 3 mini battery units) rather than 1 big battery unit? Thanks.

The DC Power Distributor does what its name implies: to distribute a DC power. It needs an external power source as it does not generate or store power itself. It is intended for the Extreme Router and Extreme Switch but can power any other devices over a wide voltage range (voltage in = voltage out). There are three independently filtered output sections: Default, Alt1, and Alt2. The two Defaults are wired in parallel, and the two unfiltered outputs are wired directly to the input.

We do not offer a BPS solution for the Router and Switch, and right now, the DCD is the best solution to power them. To power the DCD, you can use any good quality source, and if you like, you could build a BPS yourself. However, as we found, BPSses usually have rather large tradeoffs that we managed to get rid of by using non-standard batteries and bespoke charging circuitry. As such, we recommend sticking with a good quality linear power supply for the best balance of virtues.

The power to the household router also has an influence on the sound but relatively less so than the components closer to the server. You may have already gone down this route, but if not, you could start by trying a range of high-quality power supplies for the household router.

 

[Moladiego]

The DC Power Distributor does what its name implies: to distribute a DC power. It needs an external power source as it does not generate or store power itself. It is intended for the Extreme Router and Extreme Switch but can power any other devices over a wide voltage range (voltage in = voltage out). There are three independently filtered output sections: Default, Alt1, and Alt2. The two Defaults are wired in parallel, and the two unfiltered outputs are wired directly to the input.

We do not offer a BPS solution for the Router and Switch, and right now, the DCD is the best solution to power them. To power the DCD, you can use any good quality source, and if you like, you could build a BPS yourself. However, as we found, BPSses usually have rather large tradeoffs that we managed to get rid of by using non-standard batteries and bespoke charging circuitry. As such, we recommend sticking with a good quality linear power supply for the best balance of virtues.

The power to the household router also has an influence on the sound but relatively less so than the components closer to the server. You may have already gone down this route, but if not, you could start by trying a range of high-quality power supplies for the household router.

Thanks, Christiaan. My question was whether it would be better to power the Switch and the Router directly with a DIY BPS rather than via the DCD which is then powered by an LPS. If I can guess your answer, it may be "it depends". If the DIY BPS is close to Taiko standard, it would be better than via DCD; but if it is subpar, it would be worse. If it does not conform to Taiko's sale strategy, what prevents Taiko from developing a BPS for the two devices? Understand that the Taiko BPS would make the DCD obsolete. Can you confirm?

 

[Christiaan Punter]

I would not recommend building your own BPS because that will likely introduce drawbacks such as a subjectively "less expressive", " less dynamic" or "slow" sound. The Taiko BPS is a very special development, not comparable to any other existing battery power source currently available. Thus, using the DCD with a good quality LPS will more likely result in the best balance of virtues. But if you did build a BPS yourself, it would probably be best to power the Extreme Switch and Extreme Router with it directly, not via the DCD. In our case, using the DCD in series with our own BPS, the result is less stellar than when using the BPS directly.

There are several problems which currently prevent us from offering a mini BPS (or any external BPS) either as a separate device or as a direct DC output. Regulatory institution requirements surrounding battery supplies are quite stringent, and justly so. We do have a TPM (Trusted Platform Module) solution identifying a connected device as a Taiko Audio approved device after which the battery supply can enable its output, but this is not something we can just implement straight away.

 

[Moladiego]

The person who would build a BPS for me (if I proceed) is experienced with BPS. His system is completely off the grid and he is keenly aware of the traditional limitations of battery power. May I assume that it would be better to have 2 mini battery units to drive the Switch and the Router independently?

 

[Christiaan Punter]

The person who would build a BPS for me (if I proceed) is experienced with BPS. His system is completely off the grid and he is keenly aware of the traditional limitations of battery power. May I assume that it would be better to have 2 mini battery units to drive the Switch and the Router independently?

Separation can be good but it need not always be. It depends on the application. In our tests, multiple smaller BPSes are indeed preferable over one large BPS where it concerns various components of a Music Server such as the Network Card, USB Card, and other Output Cards, as they are now being implemented in the Olympus range. However, I have no knowledge of how the Router and Switch respond when powered by a single BPS versus dual individual BPSes.

 

[oldmustang]

The person who would build a BPS for me (if I proceed) is experienced with BPS. His system is completely off the grid and he is keenly aware of the traditional limitations of battery power. May I assume that it would be better to have 2 mini battery units to drive the Switch and the Router independently?

Be aware that if you connect your Taiko router and Taiko switch together via a direct attach copper (DAC) cable the ground planes of the switch and router are connected through the DAC cable.

Steve Z

 

[Moladiego]

Separation can be good but it need not always be. It depends on the application. In our tests, multiple smaller BPSes are indeed preferable over one large BPS where it concerns various components of a Music Server such as the Network Card, USB Card, and other Output Cards, as they are now being implemented in the Olympus range. However, I have no knowledge of how the Router and Switch respond when powered by a single BPS versus dual individual BPSes.

@Christiaan Punter Thanks again. The DIY guy said he will have 2 mini batteries power the 2 devices separately, but they will share one wood box and one charging cable connected to a wall wart. What brand or kind of battery Taiko uses for the Olympus? I want that guy to use the same kind or brand.

 

[nonesup]