Entreq Tellus grounding

[LL21]

BTW, Tripoint Troy Signature and Tripon Emperor are capable of signal ground. If you wish to try signal ground just allocate one binding post in the back of the Troy or Emperor for signal ground and don't mix it with the earth ground. Plugging in the unit is optional and up to the user. Apparently many audiophiles in Asia use this configuration with great results. If I remember correctly, Lloyd had done signal grounding with his Troy se in the past as well.

Yes, that is correct. I have basically got 14 connections on the back of my Troy! I separate the Entreq cables from the Tripoint cables...but otherwise, I have those cables reaching to chassis (Tripoint cables), to signal (Entreq RCA cables) and to a number of Entreq Receivus which sit atop Transport, DAC, DAC and Transport PSUs and Gryphon Amp.

 

[LL21]

Christian, I really wouldn't recommend plugging your preamp Atlantis' in and out as needed. Grounding takes time to work, and each time it's disrupted, has to start from scratch. You'll find the effects of Entreq improve at the 20 min point, get better over the next 24-48 hrs, and max out after 2 wks. Every time you pull the plug, so to speak, this has to start over again.
Personally I would advise you to stick w/as many Atlantis' as you can afford, and leave them permanently in the system. Even if this means a component like your R2R remains ungrounded to begin. Whatever dramatic results you got in your 5 hr trial will pale in comparison to how it'll sound when settled in.
So PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not unplug/plug Atlantis from preamp as you've suggested. I'm sure Lloyd will back me up on this.
Audiocrack, hope it goes well w/Emperor - they certainly went gaga over it at the recent AE High End show in HK, and it went a long way in maxxing the dreamy quality of the SQ achieved. If you can afford it, and it gives you something that even Troy SE cannot, I for one would support your decision to buy it. At the levels of most high end systems it gets harder and harder to get to the next level, and I suspect spending the $70k that Emperor costs on e.g. a couple of amp changes, or a few SOTA ICs or PCs won't put as big a smile on your face. The Emperor will be a system-wide impvt, so not as expensive in global terms as the price tag suggests.

In my own experience of having setup grounding in my system 3 times (and taking out the entire thing twice), I found:

1. 20 minutes - noticeable change
2. 3 hours
3. 48 hours

And then 2 full weeks before completely stable. however, if you unplug for a nano-second and break the connection...you start ALL OVER AGAIN. Hate that bit. I once accidentally disconnected the whole thing while I was changing some other bits of my system...I literally thought the new additions were terrible...but when I took them back out, the system was no better. And I thgout...sh*t...what have I done wrong? Surely, grounding could not have been THAT big an improvement...I have already done this 2x now.

Sure enough in 20 minutes, I realized it was improving again, and then 48 hours later I was relieved to find the improvements were steadily advancing again. I eventually put the new other changes back into the system that I had sidelined...and sure enough, they too were now great. Whew!

 

[rockitman]

Christian, I really wouldn't recommend plugging your preamp Atlantis' in and out as needed. Grounding takes time to work, and each time it's disrupted, has to start from scratch. You'll find the effects of Entreq improve at the 20 min point, get better over the next 24-48 hrs, and max out after 2 wks. Every time you pull the plug, so to speak, this has to start over again.
Personally I would advise you to stick w/as many Atlantis' as you can afford, and leave them permanently in the system. Even if this means a component like your R2R remains ungrounded to begin. Whatever dramatic results you got in your 5 hr trial will pale in comparison to how it'll sound when settled in.
So PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not unplug/plug Atlantis from preamp as you've suggested. I'm sure Lloyd will back me up on this.
Audiocrack, hope it goes well w/Emperor - they certainly went gaga over it at the recent AE High End show in HK, and it went a long way in maxxing the dreamy quality of the SQ achieved. If you can afford it, and it gives you something that even Troy SE cannot, I for one would support your decision to buy it. At the levels of most high end systems it gets harder and harder to get to the next level, and I suspect spending the $70k that Emperor costs on e.g. a couple of amp changes, or a few SOTA ICs or PCs won't put as big a smile on your face. The Emperor will be a system-wide impvt, so not as expensive in global terms as the price tag suggests.

Thanks for the advice Spirit. I was under the impression you could unplug the source while leaving the spade ends still connected to the tellus w/o effect. I guess that is wishful thinking.

 

[rockitman]

John, my system is run fully balanced from source to amplifier, but my line stage has both RCA and XLR inputs and outputs and I have unused connections of either type. Would you recommend using RCA to Spade or XLR to Spade for earth cables? Should it make any difference which connectors are used (i.e., should I try both)?

My system is fully balanced and dual mono for my phono pre and main pre. I chose to use the spare rca inputs for the ground cables. I did not have XLR ground cables..but in my mind, I don't think it will make a difference.... the signal to the rca's will be the same as the signal coming into the hot XLR pin.

 

[allvinyl]

Entreq on a TV

Food for thought RE video-aholics.

1. Try a Silver Minimus and cable on your favorite flat-screen TV.
2. Additionally, for streaming fans Entreq has a RJ45 cable you can put on your router.

John

 

[allvinyl]

Entreq Grounding Cables; XLR vs RCA

John, my system is run fully balanced from source to amplifier, but my line stage has both RCA and XLR inputs and outputs and I have unused connections of either type. Would you recommend using RCA to Spade or XLR to Spade for earth cables? Should it make any difference which connectors are used (i.e., should I try both)?

The only cables we've not experimented with are the XLR cables. I plan to do that on my Vitus player as soon as we receive them. It'll take some time, but I want to try it both ways using the XLR outputs for signal, RCAs for the ground cables, and then visa versa.

As experienced users have written here, there's no fast track to the best performance as it just takes the time it takes to fully settle in.

John

 

[dmnc02]

My system is fully balanced and dual mono for my phono pre and main pre. I chose to use the spare rca inputs for the ground cables. I did not have XLR ground cables..but in my mind, I don't think it will make a difference.... the signal to the rca's will be the same as the signal coming into the hot XLR pin.

The only cables we've not experimented with are the XLR cables. I plan to do that on my Vitus player as soon as we receive them. It'll take some time, but I want to try it both ways using the XLR outputs for signal, RCAs for the ground cables, and then visa versa.

As experienced users have written here, there's no fast track to the best performance as it just takes the time it takes to fully settle in.

John

Thank you for the advice. I will start with the RCA cables and then try what happens if those are replaced with XLR.

 

[Orb]

Is there really a difference between chassis and signal grounding ? Me thinks they both are the same , grounding is grounding . Reduction in EMI ...... Amazing though , and in my experience yet to hit a brick wall , the more you ground the better it sounds , no end in sight !

Yeah there is, although at some point in the hardware both are connected for safety; signal ground is reference 0V potential while chassis is safety.
This is why I think Entreq is recommended to connect to the RCA inputs as technically any RCA input/output must connect to signal ground and related circuitry, you could also do something similar with mains using star system combined with clean earth - whether their "performance" is equal would be interesting but tbh it has a lot less hassle and less safety considerations the Enteq way while providing in theory best "quality" for signal ground due to its direct interaction with said electronic sections.
Much may also depend upon the audio hardware design.

Just my take.
Cheers
Orb

 

[Mordecai]

My CDP has a ground lug, as well as RCA and XLR outputs. I'm wondering which would be best to use. I'm mindful that the player mutes the unused outputs, so does that mean it would be futile to use the unused output?

 

[audioblazer]

Makes sense that any dual-mono designed component will require 2 cables, one for each channel to affect the change on both channels.c

Another improvement awaits when you place an Atlantis box on top of each Silver Tellus.

John

John, I noticed the recommendation of putting Atlantis on top of Silver Tellus . Any reason for that ? Any difference if the units are connected side by side ?

 

[Barry2013]

New Entreq Olympos ground box!
Not long back from Hifi News and Record Review 2014 show.
Went to catch up with the Entreq distributor and surprised to find new dedicated ground box for preamps just delivered unannounced from Per Orloff. A bit less than half the size of a Silver Tellus with just one Atlantis earth for a preamp. Couldn't really evaluate it but the Vitus /Estelon XA system was sounding very good. Forgot even to ask the price but will find out and update shortly.
Took delivery of a Receivus and silver and Apollo earths (only short Apollo available today). Just installed on top of my Vitus SIA 025 amp using the silver as the Apollo is too short. Will try it with the Apollo on other components and update later. Hopefully will replicate Lloyd's good experience with it.
Can't presume to speak for others but the kid with a new toy syndrome is still alive and kicking it's just that I(we?) can adduce more sophisticated justifications for our new toys!

 

[Barry2013]

John, I noticed the recommendation of putting Atlantis on top of Silver Tellus . Any reason for that ? Any difference if the units are connected side by side ?

The Entreq website advises placing Atlantis box on top of Silver Tellus.
Mine is on the rack shelf above one Silver Tellus and parallel to the second Silver Tellus on the other leg of the rack with the Atlanis connected to both.
Installed that way by the Entreq distributor and works well but it maybe that the recommended siting would improve still further. Suck it and see I guess is the best advice.

 

[LL21]

New Entreq Olympos ground box!
Not long back from Hifi News and Record Review 2014 show...surprised to find new dedicated ground box for preamps just delivered unannounced from Per Orloff. A bit less than half the size of a Silver Tellus with just one Atlantis earth for a preamp...

...Took delivery of a Receivus and silver and Apollo earths (only short Apollo available today). Just installed on top of my Vitus SIA 025 amp using the silver as the Apollo is too short. Will try it with the Apollo on other components and update later. Hopefully will replicate Lloyd's good experience with it...
...the kid with a new toy syndrome is still alive and kicking...!

Great stuff Barry2013...I wonder...why separate out the grounding for the preamp? Isn't one of the grounding benefits also from bringing all components to common ground (ie, on central grounding box)?

 

[Barry2013]

Great stuff Barry2013...I wonder...why separate out the grounding for the preamp? Isn't one of the grounding benefits also from bringing all components to common ground (ie, on central grounding box)?

Thanks Lloyd.
I can't at this stage answer your question but I am sure it will emerge soon. I can only guess that because so much comes together in the preamp, or integrated to which the Olympos is also applicable, it is beneficial to have such a dedicated ground box.

 

[rockitman]

when using two silver tellus. one on top of the other with Atlantis "Dual" ended spade connectors, does it make sense to plug one spade in one unit and the other into the other unit essentially utilizing two boxes for every rca ground connection ?

 

[LL21]

when using two silver tellus. one on top of the other with Atlantis "Dual" ended spade connectors, does it make sense to plug one spade in one unit and the other into the other unit essentially utilizing two boxes for every rca ground connection ?

Yes, I would suggest trying it. In my own setup, I use Atlantis cables with my Tripoint Troy Sig...and I found that separating the 2 spades of the Atlantis cable onto 2 different binding posts on the back of the Troy was consistently clearer and better with no downside at all. Would be interested to read what you find if you try it. Good luck! And enjoy!

 

[dmnc02]

when using two silver tellus. one on top of the other with Atlantis "Dual" ended spade connectors, does it make sense to plug one spade in one unit and the other into the other unit essentially utilizing two boxes for every rca ground connection ?

Chris, have you already received the Entreq stuff you ordered? Why did you decide for two Silver Tellus?

 

[Barry2013]

when using two silver tellus. one on top of the other with Atlantis "Dual" ended spade connectors, does it make sense to plug one spade in one unit and the other into the other unit essentially utilizing two boxes for every rca ground connection ?

I can see no problem in connecting the two Silver Tellus if you are only connecting sources.
I have their signal cables as well as the component ground cables and keep those two sets of cables connected to separate Silver Tellus.
In your set up any excess demand on one Silver Tellus would be met by connecting it to the other in the way you suggest.

 

[rockitman]

Chris, have you already received the Entreq stuff you ordered? Why did you decide for two Silver Tellus?

I have not received my shipment yet...probably two weeks away. I decided on two boxes since I am running dual mono grounds. Two cables each for preamp and phono stage input, two cables for main pre out to get in front of the noise going to the power amps....6 in total. It's all about capacity. It is my understanding that too many leads can reduce the improvement one hears. In the future I may also get a couple more grounds leads for the RTR output and perhaps my dac..hence the need for another box.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Audiocrack et al, I'm a little confused as to how one uses Troy for signal grounding (a la Entreq), as well as chassis grounding. I understand the need to separate chassis and signal grounds so as not to share the same terminal/peg on the Troy. But the Troy ground leads are all spade-spade (unlike Entreq leads which come in spade-spade, rca-spade and xlr-spade varieties), so how can I use a Troy lead to signal ground? My input/output jacks on components are rca or xlr, and the Troy leads can't be used w/these.
And tbh, Troy comments up to this point have always been centered on chassis grounding via casewk screws.