DCS Vivaldi

[microme]

No but I'll try now. Guessing filter/upsampling differences?

For PCM material, I've been listening to UPS F2 to DXD, DAC F6 mapper 3

For DSD material I use F5 Mapper 1

dCS guys recommend mapper 1. I tried mapper 1 and 3 comparisons last year when the SW was upgraded. At that time, I felt mapper 1 was smooth and mapper 3 was dark(background).


BTW, I used to live in Austin for a couple of years around 20 years ago.

 

[MadFloyd]

dCS guys recommend mapper 1. I tried mapper 1 and 3 comparisons last year when the SW was upgraded. At that time, I felt mapper 1 was smooth and mapper 3 was dark(background).


BTW, I used to live in Austin for a couple of years around 20 years ago.

Interesting. I just tried mapper 3 and compared it to mapper 1 and thought mapper 3 brought out the cymbals more.

 

[asiufy]

It's ok...details are important on this subject. And some here will not agree with me regarding Roon and sound quality..

1) But I prefer my NAS drive (Synology DS716 +II) running Minim Server (uPnP) with dCS app over Roon server running on the same NAS drive using the same Apple airport extreme router and Transparent high performance ethernet (2 cables - one NAS to router, other router to UPS)
2) Typo should have said ethernet vs USB cable...I just corrected it in my post above)

Don't get me wrong...Roon on my NAS sounds great. However in direct comparison in my system I prefer Minim Server on sound quality. Roon is soft sounding dynamics seem restricted. Obviously the Roon interface is NICE.

You will not regret the UPS. It's a significant step up in performance for PCM based files of all resolutions. As for DSD, I usually use the pass through mode to get it the DAC...

jfrech,

While it's perfectly possible for Roon to be straining on your NAS, and thus compromising SQ, may I suggest you check your Roon settings? Since version 1.3, their DSP Engine comes enabled by default, which does impact SQ quite a bit.
So go on Settings, Audio, pick your dCS, and you should see a "DSP Engine" option there. Make sure that is DISABLED for a proper comparison!
I don't understand why that comes ON by default....


cheers,
alex

 

[jfrech]

jfrech,

While it's perfectly possible for Roon to be straining on your NAS, and thus compromising SQ, may I suggest you check your Roon settings? Since version 1.3, their DSP Engine comes enabled by default, which does impact SQ quite a bit.
So go on Settings, Audio, pick your dCS, and you should see a "DSP Engine" option there. Make sure that is DISABLED for a proper comparison!
I don't understand why that comes ON by default....


cheers,
alex

Hi Alex, I had that disabled. Also have a pretty fast processor and upgraded the ram to 8mb. I've heard others have similar findings (my dealer for one). I agree I wish they'd set that as off vs on...

 

[BMCG]

Thank you for sharing your experience. I think I have to save more money for UPS+NAS

Contingent on how comfortable you are fettling a PC's hardware and software in the pursuit of enhanced audio...you might consider omitting the dCS Upsampler...and run straight to the Vivaldi DAC using USB ....

Much on ComputerAudiophile and WBF to guide such endeavours...with the Aurender W20 and SGM representing commercial "reference level" implementations

 

[jfrech]

Contingent on how comfortable you are fettling a PC's hardware and software in the pursuit of enhanced audio...you might consider omitting the dCS Upsampler...and run straight to the Vivaldi DAC using USB ....

Much on ComputerAudiophile and WBF to guide such endeavours...with the Aurender W20 and SGM representing commercial "reference level" implementations

The upsampler adds much here around filtering and upsampling that's hard to loose for PCM material...

 

[microme]

Interesting. I just tried mapper 3 and compared it to mapper 1 and thought mapper 3 brought out the cymbals more.

I made a comparison between mappers again today. Since last time I tested them, many things have been upgraded/changed in my system so it was worth while to test them again.
And the result was.....to my ears, more air and ambient space around the players were sensed from mapper 1. And when I switched to Mapper 3, the sound became clean and neat like Dolby switch was on of an old stereo. (Sorry for my bad English )

BTW, I also tried Roon(v1.3)'s upsampling feature too to see if it could substitute Vivaldi Upsampler. When I upsampled songs(44.1) to DSDx2, the sound definitely became different but it doesn't suit my taste.

 

[mribob]

New poster, new to dCS family, and looking for guidance. Just purchased a used Vivaldi DAC with 2.01 software. Using PC laptop, Windows 10, and JRiver 21. I'd appreciate it if someone knowledgeable on JRiver can suggest best DSD output options for me to appreciate the DSD thru Vivaldi. In a word, advice on configuring JRiver, to optimize the qualities of the Vivaldi DAC. Also looking for what folks feel are good filters for USB interface with hi res downloads, 24/96, 24/192, and DSD.
When MQA becomes available, I may follow JFrech's lead, and buy the UPS and switch from portable HD"s and usb to a NAS and ethernet...but until then need to optimize where I'm at.
Thanks for your time and guidance.
Best,
Bob P

 

[asiufy]

Hi Bob,

You might want to invest in a proper server/streamer for your Vivaldi, instead of using a laptop PC. The gains in performance and ease of use are immense.
Or another option would be to go for the Vivaldi Upsampler or Network Bridge, and use the Ethernet/network input in conjunction with a NAS or maybe even that laptop PC.


cheers,
alex

 

[jfrech]

New poster, new to dCS family, and looking for guidance. Just purchased a used Vivaldi DAC with 2.01 software. Using PC laptop, Windows 10, and JRiver 21. I'd appreciate it if someone knowledgeable on JRiver can suggest best DSD output options for me to appreciate the DSD thru Vivaldi. In a word, advice on configuring JRiver, to optimize the qualities of the Vivaldi DAC. Also looking for what folks feel are good filters for USB interface with hi res downloads, 24/96, 24/192, and DSD.
When MQA becomes available, I may follow JFrech's lead, and buy the UPS and switch from portable HD"s and usb to a NAS and ethernet...but until then need to optimize where I'm at.
Thanks for your time and guidance.
Best,
Bob P

Welcome to What's best, I think you'll like this forum. Some great info here. As for filters, I seem to like DSD F5 best vs all others on DSD (it's a new filter with the v2 software). I also use Mapper 1 with DSD. With PCM more choices and I better let someone using jriver comment here...

 

[ksalno]

New poster, new to dCS family, and looking for guidance. Just purchased a used Vivaldi DAC with 2.01 software. Using PC laptop, Windows 10, and JRiver 21. I'd appreciate it if someone knowledgeable on JRiver can suggest best DSD output options for me to appreciate the DSD thru Vivaldi. In a word, advice on configuring JRiver, to optimize the qualities of the Vivaldi DAC. Also looking for what folks feel are good filters for USB interface with hi res downloads, 24/96, 24/192, and DSD.
When MQA becomes available, I may follow JFrech's lead, and buy the UPS and switch from portable HD"s and usb to a NAS and ethernet...but until then need to optimize where I'm at.
Thanks for your time and guidance.
Best,
Bob P

Not that much to JRiver, fortunately. I have an UpSampler so there are a few more options for connecting but for USB, I use the dCS ASIO driver configured with JRiver defaults except for Use Large Buffers checked and DSD bitstream in DoP format checked. Bitstreaming is set to "Yes DSD" and DSP disabled because I do the upsampling in my dCS. But you may want to play with letting JRiver do some upsampling for RB in software. If your PC is a dedicated device for audio, you may also want to try Audiophile Optimizer or Fidelizer to shutdown all the unnecessary Windows processes and really optimize the OS for playing audio. I use AO on both a Win10 and Win12 Server machine and it works great on both.

 

[mribob]

Ksalno; Thanks, that's just the advice I was seeking. I'll try to make those recommendations.
Best,
Bob

 

[AudioAl]

Hi Alex, I had that disabled. Also have a pretty fast processor and upgraded the ram to 8mb. I've heard others have similar findings (my dealer for one). I agree I wish they'd set that as off vs on...

Hi jfrech, Alex,

I'm a long time lurker and first time poster...

I had to jump in on this thread because this causes me a bit of frustration. My experience using Roon is identical to jrech's. I much prefer the sound quality of minimserver doing UPnP to my upsampler over the sound using Roon server. I hear the same veiled presentation from Roon that jfrech describes. Minimserver is much cleaner by a significant margin.

I hoped that the changes in 1.3 would help but I didn't hear an improvement.

 

[MadFloyd]

Hi jfrech, Alex,

I'm a long time lurker and first time poster...

I had to jump in on this thread because this causes me a bit of frustration. My experience using Roon is identical to jrech's. I much prefer the sound quality of minimserver doing UPnP to my upsampler over the sound using Roon server. I hear the same veiled presentation from Roon that jfrech describes. Minimserver is much cleaner by a significant margin.

I hoped that the changes in 1.3 would help but I didn't hear an improvement.

Are you running Roon on a dedicated PC server or on a NAS?

 

[jfrech]

Hi jfrech, Alex,

I'm a long time lurker and first time poster...

I had to jump in on this thread because this causes me a bit of frustration. My experience using Roon is identical to jrech's. I much prefer the sound quality of minimserver doing UPnP to my upsampler over the sound using Roon server. I hear the same veiled presentation from Roon that jfrech describes. Minimserver is much cleaner by a significant margin.

I hoped that the changes in 1.3 would help but I didn't hear an improvement.

Glad you posted ! I have yet to solve my roon issues. My dealer has similar issues and has reported it to dCS. I've tried Roon headless (on my NAS) as well as on my laptop. Even upgraded my NAS' RAM...no change (roon did run faster, but same sound quality)

 

[dandylinpsst]

http://www.avcat.jp/main/avnews/2017/05/10/dcsから、ついに「-vivaldi-player-」登場か？！！/

WA!!dCS Vivaldi Player

 

[jfrech]

http://www.avcat.jp/main/avnews/2017/05/10/dcsから、ついに「-vivaldi-player-」登場か？！！/

WA!!dCS Vivaldi Player

Interesting...looks like a Vivaldi Transport with integral Vivaldi DAC?

 

[MadFloyd]

Glad you posted ! I have yet to solve my roon issues. My dealer has similar issues and has reported it to dCS. I've tried Roon headless (on my NAS) as well as on my laptop. Even upgraded my NAS' RAM...no change (roon did run faster, but same sound quality)

Inspired by someone backing up John's Roon vs Minimserver I spent a great deal of time listening to Mimimserver this weekend. One thing I noticed is that changes in sample rates are handled much more gracefully vs Roon (where I often don't hear the beginning few seconds of a song if the sample rate changes). I also did some comparisons of sound quality between the two and remain hard pressed to hear a big difference in tonal balance, transients etc. That said, if I had to choose one as being better, it probably would be the Mimimserver, but the next time I have audiophile friends over I'm going to ask them to compare as well.

 

[Kingsrule]

I find the network input to sound much better than the USB input....could be what u are hearing as differences with Roon. Of course the network needs to be isolated. I use fibre here.
And the digital cabling between the dac and upsampler makes a huge difference...the Transparent stuff most Vivaldi owners use sounds slow and veiled IMO.

Then there is the topic of what settings u use on dac and upsampler as well as firmware versions......

 

[Kingsrule]

Inspired by someone backing up John's Roon vs Minimserver I spent a great deal of time listening to Mimimserver this weekend. One thing I noticed is that changes in sample rates are handled much more gracefully vs Roon (where I often don't hear the beginning few seconds of a song if the sample rate changes). I also did some comparisons of sound quality between the two and remain hard pressed to hear a big difference in tonal balance, transients etc. That said, if I had to choose one as being better, it probably would be the Mimimserver, but the next time I have audiophile friends over I'm going to ask them to compare as well.

Go into audio settings, then device settings and set resync delay to at least 2000ms That will help to start tracks at beginning. Also DXD takes longer to resync than DSD