Boiler room noise cancellation

[Mike]

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone has experience reducing boiler noise.

Our listening room is our living room, which is about 20 feet from the boiler room door. The boiler room is small and has a dry wall that separates it from the dining room, which is adjacent to the living room. The boiler room door has vents, which might be a good source of the noise. From my understanding of noise cancellation, mass is important, but I guess we have to be careful with what we surround a boiler, as over-heating or ventilation are important. I'm wondering if putting something with weight on the dining room side of the dry wall might absorb some noise or if I really need to use acoustic plasterboard closer to the boiler.

Any suggestions on how to reduce the noise? Apologies if this has been discussed.

Happy holidays.

Mike

 

[Another Johnson]

I wish there were better news to report, but here’s my list.

1. Noise cancelling headphones. Many brands are affordable these days.

2. Run the room temperature up before listening, and turn it off as you start your session. Put on a sweater if it coasts down too quickly to finish the session before you’re too cold.

3. Install an exterior door with full weather strip on the boiler room. But only close it for listening sessions. Otherwise leave it cracked open to allow ventilation. You could also add a second sheet of drywall to add mass, and maybe some rockwool insulation.

4. Best solution is to find or build a dedicated listening room where HVAC noise isn’t an issue.

5. Cheapest solution is to suck it up and ignore it. Easier said than done.

 

[Mike]

Thanks AJ. I thought of 2, too, but I think it will be a challenge to use this approach in the Summer, when ac is really needed.
My solution is to use a space heater or a fan for cooling. Neither are particularly noisy.

 

[wil]

Thanks AJ. I thought of 2, too, but I think it will be a challenge to use this approach in the Summer, when ac is really needed.
My solution is to use a space heater or a fan for cooling. Neither are particularly noisy.

I never have the HVAC on when music is playing. It’s not very loud but even a 5-10 db rise in noise floor has a huge impact in masking nuance and micro dynamics.
Fortunately my listening space, which is separate from the house, is only 1100 ft.² and holds its temperature pretty efficiently.

 

[Kcin]

That's a tough one. You may want to check with a heating contractor. If your boiler is newer- or has been replaced since that room was originally assigned to the boiler- The boiler may draw outside air for combustion and you may not require the vents in the door( a clue is plastic type vents for combustion on the boiler) . If this is the case, you can change the door to a sealed one like suggested above.

You have to check to see if you other fueled appliances , like a water heater, that requires combustion air and requires the vents regardless. ( You can also change the water heater if this is the case to tankless a more efficient type which also will draw air from outside eliminating need for vents).

Having said all that- the boiler will use pumps to circulate the water- pumps will always make noise of some sort- however there are some very good ones out now that are virtually silent--- even when you get the silent ones you may actually hear the water rushing through the pipes- although this is rare.

In my area, boilers are most always in the basement bolted to the concrete floor or to the foundation wall. Many of us have our listening rooms in the basement- I do- and my boiler a room away from my listening space is silent.

Boilers can be virtually silent- especially some of the new ones and are a far better way to heat than moving warm air around.

Good luck.

 

[Tuckia]

Class A amps for heating. Convertible for cooling. Or my preference would be motorcycle.

My listening area is in the lower level adjacent to the oversized hvac unit. I can’t do any critical listening when that noise maker runs, so I usually turn it off. Some day I will hang mineral wool batt insulation on the wall between rooms. This should knock it down quite a bit, but not eliminate it. Nothing as quiet as the off switch.

Acive noise cancellation is available for commercial forced air duct systems, which are expensive. Here the furnace blower is the main culprit so insulation is the best path.

 

[Mike]

That's a tough one. You may want to check with a heating contractor. If your boiler is newer- or has been replaced since that room was originally assigned to the boiler- The boiler may draw outside air for combustion and you may not require the vents in the door( a clue is plastic type vents for combustion on the boiler) . If this is the case, you can change the door to a sealed one like suggested above.

You have to check to see if you other fueled appliances , like a water heater, that requires combustion air and requires the vents regardless. ( You can also change the water heater if this is the case to tankless a more efficient type which also will draw air from outside eliminating need for vents).

Having said all that- the boiler will use pumps to circulate the water- pumps will always make noise of some sort- however there are some very good ones out now that are virtually silent--- even when you get the silent ones you may actually hear the water rushing through the pipes- although this is rare.

In my area, boilers are most always in the basement bolted to the concrete floor or to the foundation wall. Many of us have our listening rooms in the basement- I do- and my boiler a room away from my listening space is silent.

Boilers can be virtually silent- especially some of the new ones and are a far better way to heat than moving warm air around.

Good luck.

Thanks! I have some investigating to do, but I won’t be replacing anything in the near future, as we just spent a lot on a new hi-fi.

 

[Mike]

Class A amps for heating. Convertible for cooling. Or my preference would be motorcycle.

My listening area is in the lower level adjacent to the oversized hvac unit. I can’t do any critical listening when that noise maker runs, so I usually turn it off. Some day I will hang mineral wool batt insulation on the wall between rooms. This should knock it down quite a bit, but not eliminate it. Nothing as quiet as the off switch.

Acive noise cancellation is available for commercial forced air duct systems, which are expensive. Here the furnace blower is the main culprit so insulation is the best path.

Thanks! I think that this issue wasn’t even on our list of things when we bought this home. I wish it had been.

 

[Tuckia]

Mike, you identify your unit as a boiler, but you also have AC. To me, this means you have forced air distribution. By far, the blower will be the main culprit. As mentioned, the heating boiler makes little noise. I lived in a house with a boiler for many years with baseboard radiators. Pretty quiet. Even the combustion air fan is fairly innocuous.

Insulating the boiler room - walls and ceiling, if possible, may net the best results. My point with the convertible, is to say, if the AC is running it’s utterly pointless to listen to a quality system unless thrash metal at 100db is on the menu.

I have found that ice cubes in a glass make an acceptable level of noise when it’s hot. For me, unfortunately, my Norwegian wife thinks 55F is just right, hence the motorcycle

 

[Kingrex]

You have to seal the boiler room from the listening room. That means you have to find another way to provide airflow to the space. If you have a basement or crawlspace, cut the floor. You can also vent from the outside. You can pipe air with positive pressure with a blower to the room. But a blower makes its own noise. Be aware both the boiler needing air for combustion as well as venting excess heat from the room.

FWIW, you may also be experiencing virations that are coupling to the floor joist and eminating all through the house. I have a simple exhust fan in my attic that couples to a ceiling joist and dumps its noise in a back corner of my living room behind a speaker.

 

[PaulB]

ever measure the offending frequencies? You say mass is needed, but that may not be necessary depending on what noise is being emitted.

 

[Tuckia]

Modern building codes require combustion air inlet and exhaust be ducted to the exterior of the house, so there is no net change in internal air pressure. In residential, make up air isn’t required as air is just circulated internally.

In ducted systems noise originates from many sources with the blower being the main driving function. Vane pass frequency, flow turbulence, and their interaction with the flat faces of unbraced, thin gauge duct side walls, radiating through the passageways are culprits. Blower housing vibration coupling to a wooden floor can be a thing. Although spring isolators are common on industrial units, I’ve never seen them used in residential. They would be very difficult to retrofit as you need room under the unit. All good if mounted on concrete (Inertia base).

Bottom line is, without dimensional drawings, bill of materials, and unit specifications this is an academic exercise in what if.

 

[Mike]

Mike, you identify your unit as a boiler, but you also have AC. To me, this means you have forced air distribution. By far, the blower will be the main culprit. As mentioned, the heating boiler makes little noise. I lived in a house with a boiler for many years with baseboard radiators. Pretty quiet. Even the combustion air fan is fairly innocuous.

Insulating the boiler room - walls and ceiling, if possible, may net the best results. My point with the convertible, is to say, if the AC is running it’s utterly pointless to listen to a quality system unless thrash metal at 100db is on the menu.

I have found that ice cubes in a glass make an acceptable level of noise when it’s hot. For me, unfortunately, my Norwegian wife thinks 55F is just right, hence the motorcycle

Yeah. Maybe I should call it a furnace. The room contains the stuff that heats and cools. My wife likes the house warm, so I need to heat on.

 

[Mike]

ever measure the offending frequencies? You say mass is needed, but that may not be necessary depending on what noise is being emitted.

It's the sound of mechanics working and air blowing, I think.

 

[Mike]

Modern building codes require combustion air inlet and exhaust be ducted to the exterior of the house, so there is no net change in internal air pressure. In residential, make up air isn’t required as air is just circulated internally.

In ducted systems noise originates from many sources with the blower being the main driving function. Vane pass frequency, flow turbulence, and their interaction with the flat faces of unbraced, thin gauge duct side walls, radiating through the passageways are culprits. Blower housing vibration coupling to a wooden floor can be a thing. Although spring isolators are common on industrial units, I’ve never seen them used in residential. They would be very difficult to retrofit as you need room under the unit. All good if mounted on concrete (Inertia base).

Bottom line is, without dimensional drawings, bill of materials, and unit specifications this is an academic exercise in what if.

Yeah. I'll play around with what you all are saying, but, in the meantime, I'll keep the thing off and use a space heater until I'm satifsfied musically or hypothermia kicks in.

 

[dbeau]

Yeah. I'll play around with what you all are saying, but, in the meantime, I'll keep the thing off and use a space heater until I'm satifsfied musically or hypothermia kicks in.

@Mike, I sympathize as my living/music room is open to the kitchen which has a doored pantry containing both commercial fridge and freezer units which are loud when operating (can't shut down) so I use option (2) of shutting door to a crack while listening. It significantly cuts noise but not completely while frustrating wife because she believes the heat build up shortens shelf life of stuff (probably does).
I am thinking of installing a mini-split hvac from garage to the pantry which is expensive but less than a lot of audio upgrades.
Lots of Luck and let us know if/when/how you resolve this.

 

[Mike]

@Mike, I sympathize as my living/music room is open to the kitchen which has a doored pantry containing both commercial fridge and freezer units which are loud when operating (can't shut down) so I use option (2) of shutting door to a crack while listening. It significantly cuts noise but not completely while frustrating wife because she believes the heat build up shortens shelf life of stuff (probably does).
I am thinking of installing a mini-split hvac from garage to the pantry which is expensive but less than a lot of audio upgrades.
Lots of Luck and let us know if/when/how you resolve this.

Good luck to you, too!! I should probably add that I had tolerated this noise, but we recently got the Techdas AF 3p , Graham Elite, Koetsu Urusho Vermillion cart. and the Ch Precision integrated amp, among other things, so I want to hear the damn things

 

[JackD201]

Hi Mike,

Google vinyl acoustic barrier materials like this

Mass Loaded Vinyl (MLV) Sound Barriers | Soundproof Cow

MLV sound barriers are effective at reducing unwanted noise. Shop our selection of mass loaded vinyl barriers online and order today.

www.soundproofcow.com

The FAQ section will answer most of your queries

Sincerely,

Just another TechDAS, Graham Elite, Koetsu, CH guy

 

[Mike]

Hi Mike,

Google vinyl acoustic barrier materials like this

Mass Loaded Vinyl (MLV) Sound Barriers | Soundproof Cow

MLV sound barriers are effective at reducing unwanted noise. Shop our selection of mass loaded vinyl barriers online and order today.

www.soundproofcow.com

The FAQ section will answer most of your queries

Sincerely,

Just another TechDAS, Graham Elite, Koetsu, CH guy

Thanks Jack. Also, thanks for posting about TechDas and CH a while back (and others who did!), as that got my really thinking about these two.

 

[bcurtis1959]

Look at the psi c214