Arender x100/s10 vs CAPS Pipeline

[Elberoth]

Good point. I have a CAPS 2.0 collecting dust, a CAPS 3.0 listed on audiogon (no takers) and another $4K PC multi media server I can't sell. PC based digital front ends are the only pieces of gear I am taking massive depreciation hits on.

That is because they are obsolete in terms of hardware and processing power. Even at the time of their launch, they were way underpowered, and when the time went by, that became even more of a limitation.

The CAPS v4 project on the other hand, has all the processing power you may ever need (ok, so maybe 'ever' is not the correct works as everything in computers ages eventually, but they should be good for the next couple of years) and can always be easily upgraded (with a board/processor/ram change).

 

[edorr]

That is because they are obsolete in terms of hardware and processing power. Even at the time of their launch, they were way underpowered, and when the time went by, that became even more of a limitation.

The CAPS v4 project on the other hand, has all the processing power you may ever need (ok, so maybe 'ever' is not the correct works as everything in computers ages eventually, but they should be good for the next couple of years) and can always be easily upgraded (with a board/processor/ram change).

The CAPS 3.0 Zuma with i7 processor has more horsepower than you'll ever need. It runs dirac MCH + DSD/PCM conversion without breaking a sweat.

 

[Elberoth]

I agree. Also, don't forget to consider the resale value (Aurender vs. DIY server) as part of the equation when looking at the economics.

CAPS is also a very well known brand name right now. I have sold my two CAPS v3 servers without problems last year (when they were still current), for the price of parts (so basicly lost nothing).

I agree about DIY projects though - they are impossible to sell, unless you are prepared to accept a big loss. This is whay I always recommend getting one of the CAPS servers as a base for server projects.

CAPS project computers have one clear advantage over Aurender - thay can be upgraded down the road.

 

[Elberoth]

The CAPS 3.0 Zuma with i7 processor has more horsepower than you'll ever need. It runs dirac MCH + DSD/PCM conversion without breaking a sweat.

I was thinking about Topanaga / Lagoon versions, based on the Intel 2800 mobo. The CAPS v3 Zuma is just too expensive - most people that want to spend that kind of money would probably steer towards the current CAPS v4.

 

[Elberoth]

Any direct comparisons done yet? I am building a CAPS pipeline, pkease stop me now if you have heard the s10 or x100 and think it's better sonically, because the used value of those products is comparable

The first question I would as is: which Pipeline ? The original Pipeline project as described on Computer Audiophile, or a Pipeline enchanced with Jcat bits (Jcat USB card, battery PSU, SATA cable - http://jplay.eu/jcat/). The later sounds MUCH better, and I consider the Jcat stuff absolutely essential for best sound quality.

 

[bonzo75]

The first question I would as is: which Pipeline ? The original Pipeline project as described on Computer Audiophile, or a Pipeline enchanced with Jcat bits (Jcat USB card, battery PSU, SATA cable - http://jplay.eu/jcat/). The later sounds MUCH better, and I consider the Jcat stuff absolutely essential for best sound quality.

So, hypothetically, if n100 beats caps pipeline without jcat, it is possible with jcat the result can reverse?

 

[Elberoth]

So, hypothetically, if n100 beats caps pipeline without jcat, it is possible with jcat the result can reverse?

Sure. With Jcat bits, sonic wise, it is a different animal altogether.

I have tried the SOtM bits recommended by Chriss - the SOtM USB card and SATA filter - but quickly sold them after trying the Jcat stuff. They are much, much better.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Sure. With Jcat bits, sonic wise, it is a different animal altogether.

I have tried the SOtM bits recommended by Chriss - the SOtM USB card and SATA filter - but quickly sold them after trying the Jcat stuff. They are much, much better.

how do products like the Teradak LPS figure into this comparison? does the Aurender have a similar level power supply?

 

[bonzo75]

how do products like the Teradak LPS figure into this comparison? does the Aurender have a similar level power supply?

Some Aurenders like S10 and x100 have SMPS. The n100 etc have LPS.

I think the best power supplies are known to be Paul Hynes, and now the Uptone JS-2 is getting great reviews. If you use Paul Hynes as LPS into the CAPS' motherboard for clean power, the mobo converts it to switching supplies of 3.3V, 5v, etc. If you want these voltages to be linear instead of switching, you can add Teradak Full ATX supply. Elberoth has done that and said it takes it a level up. So Teradak is not as good as Hynes but provides this functionality at a good price. Disclaimer: My understanding comes from research and not practice.

 

[Elberoth]

It would be perfect to use Hynes designed ATX PSU. It is not easily done though, as ATX standard requires the voltages to show up at certain intervals of time on startup. If you power up all the rails (+12V, +5V, +3.3V, -5V) at the same time, many MoBos will not boot. In other words, you need onboard logic circuit of sorts to make ATX supply work. This is why there are so few of them.

 

[CKKeung]

ATX standard requires the voltages to show up at certain intervals of time on startup. If you power up all the rails (+12V, +5V, +3.3V, -5V) at the same time, many MoBos will not boot. In other words, you need onboard logic circuit of sorts to make ATX supply work. This is why there are so few of them.

The Teradak Full ATX supply is able to do so. There is a long discussion on it at computeraudiophiles.com .
Several friends of mine in Hong Kong are using it too.

 

[Elberoth]

The Teradak Full ATX supply is able to do so. There is a long discussion on it at computeraudiophiles.com .
Several friends of mine in Hong Kong are using it too.

Yes, I have one too.

 

[Hyperion]

CAPS is also a very well known brand name right now. I have sold my two CAPS v3 servers without problems last year (when they were still current), for the price of parts (so basicly lost nothing).

I agree about DIY projects though - they are impossible to sell, unless you are prepared to accept a big loss. This is whay I always recommend getting one of the CAPS servers as a base for server projects.

As for "brand" awareness and resale value, this might hold true in the States. The very latest versions might also compete or even be superior to the newest Aurender units - who knows (?). That said, a vast majority - excluding the most initiated and technology savvy - would most certainly prefer the solid offerings from Aurender. The main point is to get a very high performing server/streamer without having to deal or worry about the ins and outs.

 

[asiufy]

Regardless of its performance, a CAPS machine is, and always will be, a computer. And have you looked up prices of used desktop computers on eBay or craigslist? People are just not used to paying big bucks for used desktop computers, no matter how fancy the USB card or power supply you have inside...

An appliance, a device like Aurender, is not seen as a computer, and holds its value considerably better. But you're not fooling anybody if you just take the computer innards and stuff into one of those generic chinese boxes, and call it an "music server"

alexandre

 

[JimmyS]

Just took delivery of my N100H. Very pleased so far with sound quality and ease of setup. It is feeding my dcs debussy with files being streamed from a windows homeserver box.
It replaces a dedicated PC running jrivrer & foobar. No negatives to report on sound quality when compared to the PC.

 

[bonzo75]

Just took delivery of my N100H. Very pleased so far with sound quality and ease of setup. It is feeding my dcs debussy with files being streamed from a windows homeserver box.
It replaces a dedicated PC running jrivrer & foobar. No negatives to report on sound quality when compared to the PC.

Was the PC with LPS and such components?

 

[JimmyS]

Was the PC with LPS and such components?

PC setup was an older quad core / 8g ram / SSD / 64-bit win7 setup with standard PC supply and no fancy USB cards.

 

[Nyal Mellor]

I would just be certain, that your ' music server' plays everything you might want it to play, I believe some won't play Tidal,Quboz etc.
Wheras a relatively cheap laptop...
Keith.

True, but only if you have the laptop in your hand. JRiver does not have a solution to control TIDAL from an iPad app unless you try and use remote desktop. Same for all the OSX players I think, though I am a little behind the times there.

 

[dminches]

I just received my N100H yesterday and had the chance to fully set up the library and play music for several hours. The N100H replaced a custom built, CAPS-like PC (ASUS Z87M-PLUS, Intel Core i5-4570S Haswell 2.9GHz LGA 1150, CORSAIR Vengeance LP 8GB, Streacom FC10, picoPSU 160 W, Paul Pang USB v2.0, Corsair Force Series GS CSSD-F128GBGS, Win Server 2012 R2, AO v1.3?). Honestly, I did not hear a significant difference in the sound. However, I am thrilled to have a box now that I don't have to support and tinker with (and I love tinkering). The Aurender App may not have the same level of customization options as jriver but in 2 hours I had my 100k files appearing at my fingertips in an organzied fashion.

For the same money I would go the Aurender (or other similar box) route and not bother with a computer PC build. I don't think there is any sacrifice in audio quality and you have much less to do to set this up and maintain it.

 

[bonzo75]

I just received my N100H yesterday and had the chance to fully set up the library and play music for several hours. The N100H replaced a custom built, CAPS-like PC (ASUS Z87M-PLUS, Intel Core i5-4570S Haswell 2.9GHz LGA 1150, CORSAIR Vengeance LP 8GB, Streacom FC10, picoPSU 160 W, Paul Pang USB v2.0, Corsair Force Series GS CSSD-F128GBGS, Win Server 2012 R2, AO v1.3?). Honestly, I did not hear a significant difference in the sound. However, I am thrilled to have a box now that I don't have to support and tinker with (and I love tinkering). The Aurender App may not have the same level of customization options as jriver but in 2 hours I had my 100k files appearing at my fingertips in an organzied fashion.

For the same money I would go the Aurender (or other similar box) route and not bother with a computer PC build. I don't think there is any sacrifice in audio quality and you have much less to do to set this up and maintain it.

Thanks, what LPS did you have, and what s/w did you use on your PC?

I agree that in terms of convenience Aurender is unbeatable. On the other hand that PC you had can be upgraded forever on both h/w and s/w, while the Aurender cannot (possibly can be on s/w)

I think I will build a PC, and get a N100h for a demo. If the sound is similar, and not night and day difference, will sell of the PC at component cost. The fact that we had HQP just over a year ago and this year there is Bughead Emperor, means in 2 or 3 years we will have jriver like functionality with much better sound, I think