Tim, would you care to elaborate ...Here, we have a discussion in which all of the objective evidence has been left off of the table.
Frank
Tim, would you care to elaborate ...Here, we have a discussion in which all of the objective evidence has been left off of the table.
No Bill I don't have any information about the wow and flutter that my turntable produces. Furthermore, I don't care because I don't hear it. I have a 30 lb platter that has had the run-out measured and the run-out adjusted (which the VPI TNT platter has adjustements for). My bearing has had new much tighter tolerance bushings machined and pressed in by a master machinist and my spindle has been micro-polished by said machinist. My TNT table sits on the TNT stand which has lead shot in the four legs. The motor is controlled by the SDS and the speed is set and checked with a strobe disc and light. I just don't hear any problems with wow and flutter. If I did, I'd buy a better turntable.
For those of you who hate all things analog-I get it and I for one am not trying to make converts out of any of you. Digital measures much better and it's a snap to use. You can buy a $20 DVD/CD player that will have better measurements than the most expensive analog rig could ever hope for. I'm sure some of you would even argue that a $20 CD player will sound better than a $100K turntable setup because it measures better. There is plenty of room in this hobby for all types of belief systems. As long as you are happy with the sound you are hearing, that's all that matters.
Tim-I understand your view points and I totally accept that you gave up analog for digital because to you (and many others), digital clearly sounds better. I'm fine with that and I accept that. The flip side of your viewpoint is that numerous people have made it quite clear they gave up on analog simply because it has zero convenience associated with it and it gets in the way of them being able to listen to music at the push of a button. There is truly something for everyone in this hobby.
Please, Bill, can you just check on the definition of a dialectic, in the forum header ...If you can't respect other people, start a different thread where you can proclaim the superiority of analog playback without other views getting in your way.
Please, Bill, can you just check on the definition of a dialectic, in the forum header ...
I find his comments there perfectly reasonable. Is there something in that that you still find unacceptable?I understand your view points and I totally accept that you gave up analog for digital because to you (and many others), digital clearly sounds better. I'm fine with that and I accept that. The flip side of your viewpoint is that numerous people have made it quite clear they gave up on analog simply because it has zero convenience associated with it and it gets in the way of them being able to listen to music at the push of a button. There is truly something for everyone in this hobby.
False characterization. Do we enjoy the convenience? Of course. But I don't think you'll find any digital proponents in this dialectic who abandoned their turntables for convenience alone. Quite the opposite. If I thought vinyl sounded better, I would have kept my turntable and my album collection for my best quality listening sessions and used digital for casual, convenient and portable listening. Just like so many vinyl users here do.
Tim
Tim, would you care to elaborate ...
Frank
From Gary's definition: "An important characteristic of a dialectic is the ability to put up with contradictions - that there can be opposite viewpoints which are equally valid"And then we'd just have to agree to disagree. Still no dialectic.
But we are trying very, very, very hard NOT to go there, aren't we ...And yes, I know this thread is about truth and tonality, not vinyl and digital. But surely we all knew it would go there.
Tim,
Different people, different stories.
I have abandoned vinyl for some years, but happily never sold my vinyl collection, and came back several years later. Several of my friends abandoned it just for convenience, and openly regret it now.
My love for vinyl is a preference. If I could have a decent price CD player that could make my Sergeant Pepper's CD sound as good as my Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab LP copy, I would surely buy it and start listening to the digital version.
BTW, I am sober - I have been listening only to CDs for the last seven days.
This is frequently touted, but for me the significant comment was made by Martin Colloms, considered by many to be a reasonable authority, who after being involved in such a session, remarked that the drop in quality caused by the addition of the AB/X circuitry comprehensively diluted the ability and chance to discern significant results.a few disciplined, statistically sound and strenuously denied blind AB/X listening tests
You preach not to settle the issue but to get a few converts.
Dialectic (also called dialectics or the dialectical method) is a method of argument, which has been central to both Indic and Western philosophy since ancient times. The word "dialectic" originates in Ancient Greece, and was made popular by Plato in his Socratic dialogues. Dialectic is based on a dialogue between two or more people who may hold differing views, yet wish to seek the truth of the matter through the exchange of their viewpoints while applying reason.
andThe whole point of a dialectic is to get a few converts,
So which is correct, Tim ...??Dialectic is based on a dialogue between two or more people who may hold differing views, yet wish to seek the truth of the matter through the exchange of their viewpoints while applying reason.
Tim-would that be the German DMM copy of the White Album? I had that too and it sucked. The bass was way overblown and it just wasn't very good overall. I sold my copy to another Beatle freak. The EMI Parlaphone version is still the best I've heard and I have all of the digital versions including the USB Apple.
and
So which is correct, Tim ...??
Frank
This is frequently touted, but for me the significant comment was made by Martin Colloms, considered by many to be a reasonable authority, who after being involved in such a session, remarked that the drop in quality caused by the addition of the AB/X circuitry comprehensively diluted the ability and chance to discern significant results.
Other thoughts ...?
Frank
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