If you watch their video (recommended), in the first minute they claim they use ceramic bearings and stainless steel, nothing else. But you could be right.
Incredible Stillpoints
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If you watch their video (recommended), in the first minute they claim they use ceramic bearings and stainless steel, nothing else. But you could be right.
I'd like to know. Each one of their "pockets" (one in the Ultra SS, 5 in the 5) is an enclosed unit, which is inside and between (all 5 of them in the Ultra 5's case) the two parts of the Stillpoint. So it's at least a little different in this way from Rollerblocks, Finite Elements, Aurios, etc, where you can see the ball and cup.
My own experience with speaker footers suggests that: no footer < spike into protector disc < spike into floor < Aurios < Stillpoint Ultra SS. As I said, it would be nice to get more of Gary's input into this picture if he's willing.
My own experience with speaker footers suggests that: no footer < spike into protector disc < spike into floor < Aurios < Stillpoint Ultra SS. As I said, it would be nice to get more of Gary's input into this picture if he's willing.
Great photos, Jazzhead. Thanks for sharing. Did you put Stillpoints between your speaker modules? There has been some discussion about there effectiveness closest to the source of vibration, so perhaps they would be advantageous between the upper two speaker units as well as below the bottom one. It appears as though the upper modules are spiked to the module directly below it.
I've wondered if speaker systems like this one, and perhaps even like the larger Wilsons with articulating tweeter and midrange units, behave similarly to monitor speakers on stands. That is, doesn't the bottom unit act like a stand supporting the upper units? So my question is, should it be coupled or decoupled from the lower units?
I've wondered if speaker systems like this one, and perhaps even like the larger Wilsons with articulating tweeter and midrange units, behave similarly to monitor speakers on stands. That is, doesn't the bottom unit act like a stand supporting the upper units? So my question is, should it be coupled or decoupled from the lower units?
No, the spikes need to fit in certain indents on a rail and there are different spikes for different height/tilt depending on setup. So no stillpoints on wilsons speakers other than on the bottom of the bass cabinet.
You can't do this with the Wilson adapters as the ends are different sizes and not reversible.
On my X1s, I have actually experimented with damping the upper modules...I placed a small weight on the back of the cabinet to dampen it...and it hardened the treble quite a bit. I also realized there is a lot of vibration on the top of the large bass module inside and underneath the upper modules...the sides of the bass cabinet are extremely still...but if you put your finger down on top of the bass cabinet underneath the upper modules you feel vibration. Finally, I have a 3lb weight inside each of the bass ports in the back...a 10lb weight definitely stifled and choked the bass...no weight and you get a bit of extra rumble...3lbs seems to be about right.
my two cents.
Hi Frank. No, I did not try the Stillpoints under my SME. First, I only had three Ultra 5s and I thought I should really remove the four existing feet and screw the Ultras in at those locations but I did not have enough Ultras to do that. Second, I've read so much differing advice about how to place them under components that I'm pretty confused at this point about whether or not they should be used with threaded inserts and left off the surface a tiny amount or if they should be flush under the table. I guess I could have just experimented like you did. Also, the table is about 120 lbs on a Vibraplane and I did not want to deflate the Vibraplane and try to move the table by myself. I suppose I could have asked my friends to help me. And third, ultimately, Christian's comment about using the Ultra's under a component that is already isolated, like the top chassis of the SME, is a bad idea. I did not want to defeat the excellent suspension just to try the Stillpoints under the table. I'm learning that they are not designed for every application, like was the case with my speakers.
The SME suspension isolates the platter from the noise of the motor. The ball bearings under the four feet drain mechanical energy from the table down into the 150lb steel ballast plate which is itself isolated from vibrations coming up through the stand by the Vibraplane. I have a great degree of confidence in how the front end system deals with vibrations.
Could you describe in more detail how you tried the Stillpoints under your table and what the results were? In my system, it seems that the most likely location for success with Stillpoints is under my amplifiers and perhaps the motor controller for the turntable.
That's interesting. I kind of suspected that there is some vibrating going on in those separate modules and that they are essentially spiked on the sides or bottoms into the larger Wilson cabinet frame/structure. They are adjustable and the ones that I've seen are on spikes as Christian explained. So they articulate and adjust, but are essentially coupled to the rest of the speaker which acts as their stand. That is why I am wondering if they actually behave similarly to a smaller monitor speaker which vibrates and is spiked/coupled to a stand and why I asked if it would benefit from a decoupling device like the Ultra 5. It was suggested that the Ultra 5 be placed under monitor speakers (closer to the source of vibrations) and not under the stands. If possible with my speakers, my results may have been different.
Generally, I agree...I'd love to find a way to isolate the modules a bit...but I have not found a way given how tightly everything is put together. And to be fair, I am sure Wilson know very well what is going on with their modules and have at least factored it into how they voice their designs. Again, when I damped 1 of the modules from the back, the sound got quite hard...I suspected its because the weight being on the back of the module meant I may have been inadvertently living up the front of the module...
...the main one I would seek to damp (if I could find a way)...is placing a few Artesania or HRS damping plates underneath the upper modules and directly on top of the bass module. Trust me, you can REALLY feel the vibration...again Wilson no doubt know this and have designed it with this in consideration...but nevertheless, I would like to find a way to experiment.
I think you are talking about dampening the vibrations by adding weight or some other mass. I was contemplating the idea of isolating the modules in the context of the Stillpoints which isolate and drain vibrational energy away from a component, if I understand their reported benefits correctly. You seem to have found success by employing a combination of the two in your system.
It's more of a theoretical inquiry because I'm sure all of the modules' behavior and interactions are considered in the complete design of the loudspeaker.
Stillpoints with monitor speakers
Yes, if we are talking Ultra 5s, the current version has a tap on the one side only. As you found, this necessitates securing the other side with tape, Blu-Tak like "stuff", etc. Not ideal. The Stillpoints product should always be placed as close to the component being isolated as is possible. My son-in-law uses Ultra SS between his stands and monitors to very good effect. The Ultra SS gives him the option of removing the hard hat so there is a 1/4-20 tap on each end he can use to secure to the stand and the speaker allowing the Ultra SS to 'ride' between the stand and speaker very effectively isolating the speaker.
Yes, if we are talking Ultra 5s, the current version has a tap on the one side only. As you found, this necessitates securing the other side with tape, Blu-Tak like "stuff", etc. Not ideal. The Stillpoints product should always be placed as close to the component being isolated as is possible. My son-in-law uses Ultra SS between his stands and monitors to very good effect. The Ultra SS gives him the option of removing the hard hat so there is a 1/4-20 tap on each end he can use to secure to the stand and the speaker allowing the Ultra SS to 'ride' between the stand and speaker very effectively isolating the speaker.
That sounds like a good solution. If I understand correctly, you are isolating the speaker from floor born vibrations and you are draining vibrational energy away from the speaker into the Stillpoints, but not into the stand. Do you happen to know if there is any lateral/horizontal movement between your son-in-laws' speaker and its stand?
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Yes on all of my components, I have isolation both underneath with damping on top. Every single component in my system including speakers and sub has HRS M3/Ultra 5 or Auralex isolation platforms underneath...with a combination of HRS damping plates, extremely heavy (40-70lbs) of brass weight on top. And this kind of isolation has made a huge improvement in the purity of the signal, the stillness of individual instruments, and lowering of the noise floor.
However, with the speakers...I have not been able to find a way to independently isolate each module, but would love to at least experiment...
Lloyd, if you could only keep one, would it be all of the isolation sandwiches, Stillpoints, HRS, etc or the Tripoint Troy?
That is honestly a very very tough one. The answer is I would keep the isolation over the Troy...but I can assure you it would be a big loss to lose the Troy, and I would have every aim to get it back. I am trying to think of an analogy...I suppose if you had a killer home, and you were asked to give up this amazing sweeping living room with cathedral ceilings or lose the indoor/outdoor infinity pool with waterfall. You'd keep the living room...its kind of a must...but the whole verve of the luxury house is also the fact that you've got such an amazing indoor/outdoor infinity pool with waterfall. Having both is what takes a home and makes it into magic...these 2 do the same for my system. (Note: We have neither...but it sure is a fun analogy!
)Fascinating. In terms of tweaks/mods there are 3 areas to maxx out system capabilities: vibration/isolation, power, and room acoustics. Whichever is most compromised will produce the biggest turnaround when addressed. In my case I have a good, lively room, and addressing acoustics has had only moderate benefit. I live on the 2nd floor of a really solid, old industrial building, and my ventures into isolation have been interesting but not groundbreaking, with even SOTA active isolation to my tt not causing me to drop my jaw. But power/electrics is totally compromised where I live w/apparently everyone here on broadband internet all day, local light industrial plant, and booster stations/aerials nearby - and so my solving these issues by throwing a bundle of cash at balanced power, and SOTA grounding, and now power cords, has been transformative.
This is one of the reasons that I may not get quite the bang for buck w/Ultra5s that others do. We'll see.
This is one of the reasons that I may not get quite the bang for buck w/Ultra5s that others do. We'll see.
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