Vinyl obsession

[dctom]

Don't know if members have seen this previously, this cartoon is from another forum.
It does beg the question, given the cost of a high quality analogue set up, would I bother with vinyl now given the high quality of digital playback possible currently.

Having been a die hard vinyl advocate with a fair sized collection, (I did not have a CD player until around 2000) digital was always an anathema to me.

The digital sound I can achieve now does rival vinyl. I have vinyl sessions usually when playing 50s and 60s jazz, but tend to use digital more.

What do others think?

 

[Steve Williams]

IMO it is never too late as I re entered the vinyl side of the hobby 18 months ago and TBH I listen to my vinyl set up most of the time

 

[microstrip]

I always had both since CD, and currently most of my listening is digital. IMHO the critical question in this type of thread is : if you had to have only one format source, digital or analog, starting tomorrow, what would you choose? No middle term!

 

[still-one]

I always had both since CD, and currently most of my listening is digital. IMHO the critical question in this type of thread is : if you had to have only one format source, digital or analog, starting tomorrow, what would you choose? No middle term!

I would give up this hobby if it was vinyl only. Life's to short to fiddle with vinyl all day. "IF" vinyl actually sounds better it isn't worth the effort or additional cost for me to listen more than a couple hours per month.

 

[MadFloyd]

I would give up this hobby if it was vinyl only. Life's to short to fiddle with vinyl all day. "IF" vinyl actually sounds better it isn't worth the effort or additional cost for me to listen more than a couple hours per month.

I can appreciate that, even if it doesn't apply to me. I love both, but have a special place in my heart for the physical ritual and the mental state of relaxation it seems to put me in.

Good thing both are rewarding!

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I'm in my room listening 5 hours a day during the week and up to double that on weekends. no way I could listen to vinyl that much as it's not multi-tasking friendly. then there is access to new music which is mostly digital. so my listening approach and time would be different if I was vinyl only.

would I jump into vinyl now? too many variables to say. I might do it now.

 

[DaveyF]

If we are talking convenience, IMO digital has it over vinyl all day. OTOH, if we are talking SQ, then vinyl..at least to my ears is the 'current' way to go. That might change in the future, but for the now...vinyl for superior ( and in most cases vastly superior) SQ. Add to that the actual vast libraries available on vinyl vs. digital and I think vinyl still rules. Digital may well catch up and surpass in all aspects...the key word being may. IMHO.

 

[FrantzM]

hI

Wrote many years ago that while I thought at the time repeating myself before 2010 that Analog was superior to Digital (my thinking 10 years ago, no longer the case I am a digital devotee) was that I found myself listening mostly to digital then.
.
I inherited a sizable record collection and acquired a more than decent Vinyl rig (Technics SP10- MKII, SME Tonearm,etc...) and expected to listen to it a few times... For all practical intents, I don't... My digital music suits me just fine and I am now of the opinion that digital , from Redbook and up is superior to what I hear from analog mine and other people's.

At this point in time I listen mostly to Tidal and my NAS ... I no longer spin CD.. As for Vinyl. It is going to be more than 9 months I haven't touch any... and have absolutely no regret not am I missing anything.

 

[YashN]

If we are talking convenience, IMO digital has it over vinyl all day. OTOH, if we are talking SQ, then vinyl..at least to my ears is the 'current' way to go. That might change in the future, but for the now...vinyl for superior ( and in most cases vastly superior) SQ. Add to that the actual vast libraries available on vinyl vs. digital and I think vinyl still rules. Digital may well catch up and surpass in all aspects...the key word being may. IMHO.

Digital can surpass vinyl for me already: requires a lot of work (clean power and solving ground plane/loop issues for one) or a big budget, and high-rate DSD into a native DSD DAC for me.

 

[bonzo75]

Digital can surpass vinyl for me already: requires a lot of work (clean power and solving ground plane/loop issues for one) or a big budget, and high-rate DSD into a native DSD DAC for me.

What vinyl set ups and recordings are you using as reference to make that comment?

 

[XV-1]

Digital is oh so boring.

Vinyl rules. So much new releases are on vinyl, I struggle to keep up.

 

[microstrip]

(...) My digital music suits me just fine and I am now of the opinion that digital , from Redbook and up is superior to what I hear from analog mine and other people's. (...)

Well, really a firm absolute claim - superior, although relative to a small world. Can I ask if you listened to good master tapes in a Studer A80 / A820 or equivalent to the machines our fellow members own and what was the best other people's turntable you have listened to?

I think that most opinions in this subject are due to implementation of formats and synergy with the systems and user musical preferences, not to the intrinsic formats. It is why I am always curious on precise details.

 

[microstrip]

Digital is oh so boring.

Vinyl rules. So much new releases are on vinyl, I struggle to keep up.

Can you sleep well knowing that most of the new releases are digitally processed? I know that sound quality is what matters, but can not avoid a visceral reaction against digital vinyl!

 

[FrantzM]

Well, really a firm absolute claim - superior, although relative to a small world. Can I ask if you listened to good master tapes in a Studer A80 / A820 or equivalent to the machines our fellow members own and what was the best other people's turntable you have listened to?

I think that most opinions in this subject are due to implementation of formats and synergy with the systems and user musical preferences, not to the intrinsic formats. It is why I am always curious on precise details.

micro

Did you notice the "me" in the post? Are you claiming that "I" will automatically prefer the A80/A820? Can I find MY music to play on a A80/A820? Thyose are the factors in the "me" and yes I have heard Vinyl from some sserious and no longer care about this medium .. MY opinion. How can you construct it as "absolute"? And what degree of precision do you require? So those people who listen to only digital like me, have never hears anything from the A80/A820? I could go on for years.

 

[YashN]

What vinyl set ups and recordings are you using as reference to make that comment?

Mostly my own and my own listening experiences of other's setups, including shows: old vinyl setups that my uncle and we had at our place, newer vinyl setup I now have with a Direct-Drive Technics and Audio-Technica cartridge, re-wired, DIY oil-based tonearm damping.

My own improved over a couple of years or more high-res DSD into a native DSD DAC (Quad DSD) into my DIY Single-Ended Triode Tube Amp, new custom low-noise USB Connector (filtering, a measure of isolation, split at the DAC-side), using a new DIY Linear Regulated Power Supply to inject clean power to the DAC, and a new battery pack/charger which is currently powering the DAC, vibration isolation, new AC Filter Box.

As for other feedback, you can look for other people like on Positive Feedback, who have been archiving their vinyl on high-rate DSD.

My digital setup has taken a lot of work, but it surpasses my vinyl setup by far.

I do have some further modifications planned for the vinyl setup: linear PSU, separate transformer enclosure, better platter material, improved tonearm damping, DIY Tube-based Pre-amp with RIAA (for now using the integrated Phono RIAA input of my SS Amp. My SS Amp is not as good as my SET Tube Amp though. I can route the SS Phono output into the SET Tube Amp via the TAPE monitor - works well, but I would like a more direct route through tubes.

My Digital has all the qualities of the analogue setup: fluidity, resolution, slam, delicate highs, rapidity of transients, etc... It specifically has all of these which are low points of vinyl:

1. No clicks, pops, crackles

2. No higher distortion for end tracks

3. No unevitable wear of the material listened to when played, with each playback

I specifically set out to make digital be as good or go beyond the vinyl setups I knew and loved. It can take work (or else a big budget) but it's very worthwhile.

 

[microstrip]

micro

Did you notice the "me" in the post? Are you claiming that "I" will automatically prefer the A80/A820? Can I find MY music to play on a A80/A820? Thyose are the factors in the "me" and yes I have heard Vinyl from some sserious and no longer care about this medium .. MY opinion. How can you construct it as "absolute"? And what degree of precision do you require? So those people who listen to only digital like me, have never hears anything from the A80/A820? I could go on for years.

Surely I noticed the "me" - its why I asked YOU about details. It is your opinion that I was reading and considering with interest. Sorry if I was too curious ... BTW, in my humble experience there is a difference between master tape in an high quality reel to reel machine and vinyl, it is why I can not consider "analog" in a generic way.

 

[Al M.]

I always had both since CD, and currently most of my listening is digital. IMHO the critical question in this type of thread is : if you had to have only one format source, digital or analog, starting tomorrow, what would you choose? No middle term!

Digital.

1. There is too little availability on vinyl of two of the music genres that take up most of my listening time, contemporary classical avantgarde and jazz avantgarde.

2. As the OP states, high quality analog is very costly, and it is too costly for me. While top-level analog is superior to my $ 8K digital set-up in several aspects, I would bet that my (Redbook CD) digital would quite clearly beat a $ 8K vinyl set-up (phono stage included) when it comes to general musical accuracy. I would, however, grant the possibility that the vinyl set-up would still beat my digital when it comes to believability of tenor- and baritone saxophone, a weak point of all but the best digital.

3. Clicks and pops. I can enjoy vinyl in other people's systems, but I could not do so in mine because of that factor. As someone once nicely put it, for me "analog is a land that I like to visit, but I couldn't live there" .

 

[DaveyF]

Digital can surpass vinyl for me already: requires a lot of work (clean power and solving ground plane/loop issues for one) or a big budget, and high-rate DSD into a native DSD DAC for me.

I'm pleased that digital works for you. Personally, I have never heard any digital that would surpass great vinyl. Most digital doesn't even sound better than entry level vinyl, but again all IMHO.

 

[jeff1225]

Digital.

1. There is too little availability on vinyl of two of the music genres that take up most of my listening time, contemporary classical avantgarde and jazz avantgarde.

2. As the OP states, high quality analog is very costly, and it is too costly for me. While top-level analog is superior to my $ 8K digital set-up in several aspects, I would bet that my (Redbook CD) digital would quite clearly beat a $ 8K vinyl set-up (phono stage included) when it comes to general musical accuracy. I would, however, grant the possibility that the vinyl set-up would still beat my digital when it comes to believability of tenor- and baritone saxophone, a weak point of all but the best digital.

3. Clicks and pops. I can enjoy vinyl in other people's systems, but I could not do so in mine because of that factor. As someone once nicely put it, for me "analog is a land that I like to visit, but I couldn't live there" .

Al,
It's interesting to see what you wrote about limited vinyl availability for avantgarde jazz, it was the limited availability of 70's and 80's avantgarde jazz on CD that made me start collecting vinyl. Other than ECM, my favorite labels (Soul Note, Inner Cit) had limited CD reissues and later Miles Davis (Agharta, Get Up With It, We Want Miles) had terrible CD transfers.

What avantgarde labels are you listening to on CD?

 

[jeff1225]

I do agree 100% with the commentary of the performance value of a $8K digital vs $8K analog rig. You have to spend much more on a analog rig to get world class performance.