The very best DACs today...

[bmoura]

Hi everyone,

I have on loan a new Metronome C8+ dac. Compared to the previous C8 model it has a new Amanero USB board which can play both PCM up to 24/192 and DSD up to 128 fs.

The sound of the new Metronome connected to W20 is rich, organic, musical combined with outstanding transparence and resolution . The SQ of hires like HRx from RR is just amazing, the best PCM I have heard in my system.
DSD compared to Lampi DSD DAC has darker background and more air. There is no hum or any noise when no signal while Lampi is a bit noisy .

While I don't read French (Metronome needs to post an English translation of the review as well), it looks like the new C8+ supports DSD up to 512fs - not just DSD 64fs and DSD 128fs according to the review. True?

On music servers, it would make sense to look at the Aria Music Server. It handles up to DSD 256fs and both Stereo and Multichannel files. That would allow you to take advantage of DSD 256fs downloads like the ones from Yarlung and Just Listen on Native DSD.
https://yarlungrecords.nativedsd.com/
https://justlisten.nativedsd.com/
http://ariamusicserver.com/index.php/features-aria-music-server

 

[bonzo75]

Ah Marslo you have the AG horns. I am visiting their factory on the 4th (it's a holiday in the UK so thought I would pop over)

 

[LL21]

Hi everyone,

I have on loan a new Metronome C8+ dac. Compared to the previous C8 model it has a new amanero usb board which can play both pcm up to 24/192 and dsd up to 128 fs.
The sound of the new Metronome connected to W20 is rich, organic, musical combined with outstanding transparence and resolution . The SQ of hires like HRx from RR is just amazing, the best pcm I have heard in my system.
Dsd compared to lampi dsd dac has darker background and more air. There is no hum or any noise when no signal while lampi is a bit noisy .
C8+ recognize automatically the type of conversion be it pcm or dsd . It gives more musical playback than vivaldi dac and better resolution that my La Fontaine dac. Moreover it has two different outputs - tube and ss and one can switch during the playback for the direct comparison.
All in all , very capable challenger for the title of the very best dac today

For those of you who can read french :
http://www.metronome-technologie.com/documents/42/c8_haute_fidelite_032015_lr.pdf

Sounds like a great solution...congrats. I have heard the older C8, Vivaldi full stack and the Audio Aero La Source. All nice sources to be sure.

 

[marslo]

Ah Marslo you have the AG horns. I am visiting their factory on the 4th (it's a holiday in the UK so thought I would pop over)

I envy you

 

[poly]

I'd love to hear the W20 with my Vitus master piece DAC

 

[KeithR]

Bruce- have you heard the newish MSB Alpha dac? How does it compare to the Playback which I know you have always liked.

 

[sbo6]

I guess no Esoteric lovers here? Grandioso D1 anyone?

 

[Bruce B]

Bruce- have you heard the newish MSB Alpha dac? How does it compare to the Playback which I know you have always liked.

No, I've only heard the pricier MSB stack with Diamond PS and compared it to my Playback.

 

[bonzo75]

I guess no Esoteric lovers here? Grandioso D1 anyone?

Had compared Esoteric K01 with the Lampi in two systems. In both systems both the owners and I preferred the Lampi. The first system is without the 10MHz clock, the second is with. The first system has a Shindo pre (second from top of the line), Shindo monos, and high end Audio Note speakers with external crossovers. Here, it was a no contest. Preferred the Lampi on each and every attribute, by far, when we used the Esoteric as transport into the Lampi via a low end spdif. When the Esoteric was replaced by a noisy mac air, we lost a lot but was still better than the esoteric alone.

The second system had the clock. With the clock, the performance of the K01 just shoots up. Now it was close. The soundstage without the clock loses a lot. The owner told me he thinks without the clock it is 40 - 50% less. Frankly, here i couldn't prefer one over the other. The owner preferred the Lampi. He lives local to me here in London. If someone wanted to chat with him for feedback, I could put you over, since people on the forum might consider me biased towards the Lampi. The owner of the Shindo gear and I are primarily classical and opera, while this owner is non-classical.

All comparisons are PCM

 

[Orb]

Looks like you had some good days listening there Bonzo.
Nice to see it compared to Esoteric as well.
Thanks
Orb

 

[mcduman]

i let my k-01 go as there was no upgrade possibility to k-01x which only replaces the AKM 4399 dac chips with AKM 4495S. Otherwise, the same case, same transport, same power supply, clock etc. instead of offering k-01 owners the opportunity to upgrade the dac boards, esoteric wanted users to buy (mostly) the same thing all over again, which is something no one else is doing nowadays. I am sure the k-01x is even a nicer sounding machine but I dont care for the company anymore. prior to k-01 I had the x-01 limited so I was sort of the long-term client.

 

[sbo6]

Thanks for the feedback on Esoteric and how it gets trounced by the competition! Couple of comments/questions if I may:

bonzo75 - Can you elaborate on explicitly what was better? Also, when you used the Esoteric as a transport into the Lampi, I don't believe Esoteric will transmit 2 channel DSD to the Lampi if playing SACDs. Also, I'm surprised to hear that an external clock would make that big a difference in a single box player/DAC. 40 -50%!, wow I may need to get a clock for my D-03, I've never heard anyone tout that much of a difference even with Esoteric or DCS separates..

mcduman - As I understand it, the K-01X has AKM4495S DAC chips, the Grandioso P1’s turntable(high-precision VRDS-NEO “VMK-3.5-20S”), runs at 35bit (vs 32 bit) and now plays DSD which the original K series cannot. So the differences are far above upgraded DAC chips only. It is of my opinion that to offer that level of upgrade would likely be a huge cost and significant service offering for Esoteric to offer, not that it couldn't be done.

I'd also still be curious to hear someone's take on the Grandioso D1s...

 

[bonzo75]

Thanks for the feedback on Esoteric and how it gets trounced by the competition! Couple of comments/questions if I may:

bonzo75 - Can you elaborate on explicitly what was better? Also, when you used the Esoteric as a transport into the Lampi, I don't believe Esoteric will transmit 2 channel DSD to the Lampi if playing SACDs. Also, I'm surprised to hear that an external clock would make that big a difference in a single box player/DAC. 40 -50%!, wow I may need to get a clock for my D-03, I've never heard anyone tout that much of a difference even with Esoteric or DCS separates..

Hi We played PCM through the Lampi, as I mentioned in above post. We didn't play DSD at all. The DSD in Lampi is superior to its PCM, but the PCM is awesome too.

The 40-50 number comes from the owner. I don't have much experience with and without clock, obviously, but when I compared the two different Esoterics, the one without the clock I found really disappointing. Like I said, the system with the clock, it was close.

When I say better, everything was better - the one without the clock had a very flat soundstage, so the Lampi just filled the room in comparison. The detail, speed, slam, musicality, warmth, tick all boxes.

I should also mention that the tubes used were $100 6A3s and $170 Psvane 101D replicas with the bakelite base (cost is for the pair). You can go up to $2000 Western Electric tubes if you choose to, and anything in between

 

[sbo6]

Hi We played PCM through the Lampi, as I mentioned in above post. We didn't play DSD at all. The DSD in Lampi is superior to its PCM, but the PCM is awesome too.

The 40-50 number comes from the owner. I don't have much experience with and without clock, obviously, but when I compared the two different Esoterics, the one without the clock I found really disappointing. Like I said, the system with the clock, it was close.

When I say better, everything was better - the one without the clock had a very flat soundstage, so the Lampi just filled the room in comparison. The detail, speed, slam, musicality, warmth, tick all boxes.

I should also mention that the tubes used were $100 6A3s and $170 Psvane 101D replicas with the bakelite base (cost is for the pair). You can go up to $2000 Western Electric tubes if you choose to, and anything in between

Thanks for the detail, Bonzo. I'm very surprised to hear the K-01 yielded a very flat soundstage. I have the K-03 and quite the opposite of what I experience. How much of this is system synergy, we'll never know..

 

[bonzo75]

Depends what you are comparing it with. I compared it to Lampi, and to without the clock. Big collapse

 

[sbo6]

Depends what you are comparing it with. I compared it to Lampi, and to without the clock. Big collapse

Irrespective to what it is compared to, the K-03 and I'm sure the K-01 can deliver a very big sound stage with strong and articulate bass (one of the traits that Esoteric is known for). I don't believe it's so much or solely what it is compared to, again it's what system, system <-> DAC synergy. I've owned 3 Esoteric DACs and have never had one yield a flat sound stage. Also, interesting opinion on the external clock - Almost everything I have read and those I know that have heard an external clock on the Esoteric combo units state the improvement is almost non-existent. Separates is another ball game all together.

 

[mcduman]

the k-01 is no way a flat or dull machine. try with the high output voltage option from settings (+6dB) and you will have your dynamism back. and do not use it as a dac from its usb input

 

[slowGEEZR]

I wouldn't read too much into the statement that the K-01 soundstage was "flat" or "collapsed" in comparison to the Lampi. The Esoteric will sound different based on what input was used, what cables were used, what filters were used, etc. Was the system optimized for the Lampi? What part did the rest of the system(s) play in this? We've all heard tube bloom, it's real and can have an effect on apparent soundstage and depth. I will say that the Esoteric, when set up correctly, throws an immense soundstage with tremendous depth. I will also say that the rest of the system should be optimized for this to occur correctly. It is just as valid and possible that in an appropriate system, the Lampi may not sound nearly as good as the Esoteric.

 

[bonzo75]

I wouldn't read too much into the statement that the K-01 soundstage was "flat" or "collapsed" in comparison to the Lampi. The Esoteric will sound different based on what input was used, what cables were used, what filters were used, etc. Was the system optimized for the Lampi? What part did the rest of the system(s) play in this? We've all heard tube bloom, it's real and can have an effect on apparent soundstage and depth. I will say that the Esoteric, when set up correctly, throws an immense soundstage with tremendous depth. I will also say that the rest of the system should be optimized for this to occur correctly. It is just as valid and possible that in an appropriate system, the Lampi may not sound nearly as good as the Esoteric.

Hi, I had taken my Lampi to owners of the esoteric, so obviously the system was optimized for Esoteric. They heard Lampi for the first time. I have already mentioned the system details above - post 243 and 247

 

[slowGEEZR]

Hi, I had taken my Lampi to owners of the esoteric, so obviously the system was optimized for Esoteric. They heard Lampi for the first time. I have already mentioned the system details above - post 243 and 247

Bonzo, you didn't seem to understand my point. In certain systems a DAC may not sound it's best due to the type of componentry (cables, speakers, amplifier, etc), or setup (speaker positioning, room variances, filter selections, etc.) Also, just because one DAC was already in a system does not mean that the system was obviously optimized for it.