Small Business: Doctors going broke

[Steve Williams]

The sad state of our economy has shown that no sector is immune.

I found this in Yahoo Finance.

A good read with sobering implications.

When most of the country's seniors depend on Medicare and think they are well cared for......well think again.

"Doctors in America are harboring an embarrassing secret: Many of them are going broke.
This quiet reality, which is spreading nationwide, is claiming a wide range of casualties, including family physicians, cardiologists and oncologists."


http://finance.yahoo.com/news/small-business-doctors-going-broke-101200127.html

 

[flez007]

One can find some licensed doctors driving a cab down here, nothing against driving a cab, but far away from their core competences.... looks like 2012 will be a flat year in terms of economic growth

 

[Phelonious Ponk]

This economy is so bad that no one is immune except for bankers and politicians, if you can tell them apart as they embrace each other so warmly. When people literally can't afford healthcare, doctors lose business just like everyone else. It's really that simple.

I don't get the Medicare thing though, Steve. Maybe someday you can explain it to me offline. While I understand the argument -- that Medicare doesn't pay enough, and docs are losing money serving Medicare patients, I just don't see it in practice, if you'll excuse the pun. I manage my 94-year-old father's money and healtcare, and when I take him to his Oncologist, is highly recommended, works in one of the finest clincs in this heavily-healthcared city, and is housed in some of the priceiest professional real estate in the county, the lobby is full of Medicare patients. And I see this same thing repeated in clincs, labs, hospitals and rehab facilities throughout the healthcare community as we manage his many issues.

If what Medicare pays -- which is FAR less than what they initally bill -- is not enough, they must be selling drugs on the side.

Tim

 

[Steve Williams]

well the drugs they were selling on the side were those drugs they gave their oncology patients. They buy them at a bulk price and bill Medicare for more in order to make a small profit. Then Medicare reimburses them less than what they paid for the drug....that's just not right IMHO

 

[MylesBAstor]

well the drugs they were selling on the side were those drugs they gave their oncology patients. They buy them at a bulk price and bill Medicare for more in order to make a small profit. Then Medicare reimburses them less than what they paid for the drug....that's just not right IMHO

With all due respect, is that really news? This issue has been going on, really beginning with hospitals, for probably the better part of two decades now. I remember at my last institution, that any dept. treating more than 20% medicaid patients was broke (of course, the county would somehow bail them out but that finally ended). And then we do know that certain depts. are eminently more profitable than others at the hospital Then the hospitals were "selling" the depts to the MDs who took out a loan and then paid a premium back to the hospital.

I remember the state legislature passing a law a while back mandating that any MD that took Medicaire must also accept medicaid. The end result? The MDs stopped treating both groups and the legislature was forced to change the law.

 

[rbbert]

There's a huge difference in reimbursement between Medicaid and Medicare. Depending on the service provided and the efficiency of the physician's billing service, Medicaid reimbursement may not recover the cost of billing.

 

[audioguy]

Just did my annual visit to my cardiologist. I asked him why, given my history, he was not doing a test that has ALWAYS been done. His answer: "I am no longer allowed to 'practice medicine'. If I want to stay in business, I must ONLY do what the insurers tell me I can do. It is THEY who practice medicine".

Our healthcare system is very broken. We need to allow Doctors to practice medicine, not insurance companies and certainly not the drug companies. There is panel of "experts" who create the rules, (the practice guidelines) and a very large percent of these "experts" are financially linked to the pharmaceutical industry. (see Choudry, New England Journal of Medicine, 2002 or see "Conflict of Interest in Medical Research, Education, and Practice" at http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK22942/ ").

Do the research yourself. There are all kinds of resources that will support this position. Check it out.

The business that is making money in healthcare are the pharmaceutical companies, not the doctors. Obamacare does nothing to address this issue to my knowledge.

 

[MylesBAstor]

There's a huge difference in reimbursement between Medicaid and Medicare. Depending on the service provided and the efficiency of the physician's billing service, Medicaid reimbursement may not recover the cost of billing.

Hard to imagine $6 covers billing costs

 

[MylesBAstor]

Just did my annual visit to my cardiologist. I asked him why, given my history, he was not doing a test that has ALWAYS been done. His answer: "I am no longer allowed to 'practice medicine'. If I want to stay in business, I must ONLY do what the insurers tell me I can do. It is THEY who practice medicine".

Our healthcare system is very broken. We need to allow Doctors to practice medicine, not insurance companies and certainly not the drug companies. There is panel of "experts" who create the rules, (the practice guidelines) and a very large percent of these "experts" are financially linked to the pharmaceutical industry. (see Choudry, New England Journal of Medicine, 2002 or see "Conflict of Interest in Medical Research, Education, and Practice" athttp://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK22942/ ").

Do the research yourself. There are all kinds of resources that will support this position. Check it out.

The business that is making money in healthcare are the pharmaceutical companies, not the doctors. Obamacare does nothing to address this issue to my knowledge.

I think we've discussed this before. We don't have a healthcare system; we have a crisis care system

 

[Steve Williams]

Myles

All due respect to your due respect , yes that's news

 

[MylesBAstor]

Myles

All due respect to your due respect , yes that's news

I guess I just saw it that MDs have been struggling for a long time No longer can they simply practice medicine; they must also be businessmen.

 

[audioguy]

I think we've discussed this before. We don't have a healthcare system; we have a crisis care system

Correct: The current medical system doesn't want us well and doesn't want us dead.

If you want to read an interesting book, try "The High Blood Pressure Hoax" by Sherry Rogers, MD. It will certainly open your eyes. She has another book: "The Cholesterol Hoax".

If you don't get somewhat angry after reading either of them, then you will have read a different version than I did.

 

[mep]

I guess I just saw it that MDs have been struggling for a long time No longer can they simply practice medicine; they must also be businessmen.

Once upon a time when all doctors were pretty much in private practice, they all had to be businessmen. Besides sheer greed on the part of drug companies and lawyers who are constantly trolling for class action lawsuit members, someone needs to explain why the cost of health care rises each year at a rate that defies logic.

 

[mep]

Correct: The current medical system doesn't want us well and doesn't want us dead.

If you want to read an interesting book, try "The High Blood Pressure Hoax" by Sherry Rogers, MD. It will certainly open your eyes. She has another book: "The Cholesterol Hoax".

If you don't get somewhat angry after reading either of them, then you will have read a different version than I did.

I always tell people that drug companies want everyone on at least 10 different medications for life. The maximum blood pressure level you can have keeps going down as does the maximum cholesterol level before it triggers the “requirement” from your doctor that you have to be on medication to control it.

Nothing makes me madder than to walk into a medical office and the whole place is decorated in early Pharmaceutical Salesman. The clocks, calendars, the soft soap dispenser in the bathroom all are freebies from the drug companies. I’m surprised they don’t provide toilet paper to the medical offices that have drug advertisements written on the sheets. And if they had to restock the toilet paper all of the time, it would give them more of an excuse to be back at the medical offices trying to sell doctors on using more of their drugs.

Speaking of Pharmaceutical “Salesmen,” I have noticed a trend that the majority seem to be hot young women now days. Anybody think that’s a coincidence?

 

[MylesBAstor]

I always tell people that drug companies want everyone on at least 10 different medications for life. The maximum blood pressure level you can have keeps going down as does the maximum cholesterol level before it triggers the “requirement” from your doctor that you have to be on medication to control it.

Nothing makes me madder than to walk into a medical office and the whole place is decorated in early Pharmaceutical Salesman. The clocks, calendars, the soft soap dispenser in the bathroom all are freebies from the drug companies. I’m surprised they don’t provide toilet paper to the medical offices that have drug advertisements written on the sheets. And if they had to restock the toilet paper all of the time, it would give them more of an excuse to be back at the medical offices trying to sell doctors on using more of their drugs.

Speaking of Pharmaceutical “Salesmen,” I have noticed a trend that the majority seem to be hot young women now days. Anybody think that’s a coincidence?

There was an article I read in the WSJ several years ago on the top ten grossing drugs. Three of the top ten were anti-depressants. All of the top ten grossed over 2 billion dollars/year. At that time, the average person was on two prescription meds. So some are on ten and others are on none Well not quite but you get the idea

 

[mep]

Can you say "Restless Leg Syndrome?"

 

[MylesBAstor]

Can you say "Restless Leg Syndrome?"

Can you say Robert Klein I can't keep my leg from moving

 

[Phelonious Ponk]

I don't know what it is I'm seeing then. These clinics I'm taking my dad to. I guarantee they have more than 20% Medicare patients. I'd say his Oncology clinic has more than 50% medicare patients. They sure don't look broke.

Tim

 

[c1ferrari]

Consolidation, Mark...

...explain why the cost of health care rises each year at a rate that defies logic.

of Pharma, providers, hospitals, and insurance.

 

[MylesBAstor]

I don't know what it is I'm seeing then. These clinics I'm taking my dad to. I guarantee they have more than 20% Medicare patients. I'd say his Oncology clinic has more than 50% medicare patients. They sure don't look broke.

Tim

Don't you think that docs look at your insurance card before treatment? I know that happens for sure.

And medicare is not the same as medicaid. Apples and oranges.