McInstosh purchase by Fine Sounds

[rblnr]

the group that owns Audio Research, Wadia, Sonus Faber, et. al.

http://www.stereophile.com/content/fine-sounds-acquire-mcintosh

Would be curious to see the D&M side of the story on this -- they were the prior owners whose portfolio includes Denon and Marantz. Gather they're not looking for low volume brands.

 

[mep]

Wadia needs to be owned by someone who knows how to run a company and service their products.

 

[kach22i]

I just read this at the AK forum, this is the link they gave.

Fine Sounds is owned by Quadrivio, an investment management company also based in Milan.
http://www.twice.com/articletype/news/dm-sells-mcintosh-fine-sounds/103476

 

[asiufy]

Not a good thing, from their track record...

 

[Johnny Vinyl]

Not a good thing, from their track record...

Care to elaborate?

 

[asiufy]

I mean, Quadrivio's track record, not McIntosh's
It's just my opinion, ok, so don't take it as gospel. Quadrivio is out there to make a quick buck off, what themselves call, "luxury brands". They give one iota about good sound. It's all about maximizing profits.
They're in their right, of course. They manage other people's money, and if I were their client, I'd demand a good return on my investment. It's just a shame that they're preying on some good, solid audio brands to do that.
So we can expect some more milking out of McIntosh, just like they did with Sonus faber and AR... First stop, China.


alexandre

 

[metaphacts]

So we can expect some more milking out of McIntosh, just like they did with Sonus faber and AR... First stop, China.


alexandre

You do realize that D&M is an Asian company and FineSounds is not?

 

[FrantzM]

asiufy

That is what High End Audio has become: A luxury market. We will see more of these acquisitions as time passes. A good cash offer and the owners will sell or have to sell their brand. I am certain one of these days we wills see a cable company acquisitions . The returns are very interesting.
I think the disconnect between price and performance endemic to the luxury market segment has been there for a while in High End Audio, we simply refuse to acknowledge it .. I repeat, High End Audio is now if you weren't already convinced, a luxury market segment, performance be damned... Perception is everything.. We will see more and more acquisitions and I believe some famous audiophiles brands are right this moment being targeted. How long can they resist??

 

[kach22i]

I mean, Quadrivio's track record,.............. just like they did with Sonus faber and AR... First stop, China.

Maybe I missed it, did Sonus Faber go down in quality after the acquisition?

I do know that to my ears the Sonus Faber Ellipse loudspeaker is a wonderful thing when mated to Acoustic Research gear. It does however come at a steep price. The more expensive SF speakers were more "impressive" but did not move me..........AR gear mated with Maggies also does a swell job.

Much of the current McIntosh gear similarly impresses me, but fails to move me. Maybe if Mac gets one good item out of a future line-up which moves me to an emotional level, I'll end up with another piece of their gear. I'll have to wait for it to be a used item a few years down the road, but if it's good enough, then it's god enough to wait for.

 

[microstrip]

Not a good thing, from their track record...

Alexandre,

I am astonished with your comment. As far as know, the fears shown when Fine Sounds took over ARC and Sonus Faber were shown to be unfounded, and the injection of fresh money and fresh knowledge in both companies was very successful, at less from a technical point. The recent products of both companies are excellent and managed to evolute in a sense advised by many WBF members - use of science to get both good measurements and excellence in the subjective listening.

Most probably the fast growth of both companies will also bring new problems, such as assuring reliability and service in a larger scale, and a big change in the family business way of existence.

IMHO, contrary to what some people are telling, the consequence of the take over is mostly a democratization of high-end, as these companies know that they can make more money selling one hundred thousand middle price units than a few tens at expensive prices.

 

[microstrip]

(...) First stop, China.
alexandre

I was recently told that China is currently one the biggest, if not the biggest market of Sonus faber speakers.

 

[metaphacts]

I was recently told that China is currently one the biggest, if not the biggest market of Sonus faber speakers.

The Chinese market loves Sonus faber. It's certainly the fastest growing large Sonus faber market.

 

[asiufy]

Guys,

As I said, it's my opinion. I don't like Sonus faber's new product, from every point of view, and that's directly attributable to Quadrivio's attitude towards them.
And at some point, I even considered AR products for myself, but once I started seeing them blowing up left and right, for no reason, similar to my experience with Sonus faber, I gave up on anything that Quadrivio touches.

Microstrip,

I don't think Quadrivio wants to democratize the hi-end, sorry. They want to make cheap stuff in China and sell for the same ol' price (or a tad lower), and make a bigger buck.

Besides, the chinese love *everything*. China is the fastest growing market for *everybody*. Heck, the germans are selling more cars to a foreign land (China) than to germans, for the first time ever!


alexandre

 

[microstrip]

Guys,

As I said, it's my opinion. I don't like Sonus faber's new product, from every point of view, and that's directly attributable to Quadrivio's attitude towards them.
And at some point, I even considered AR products for myself, but once I started seeing them blowing up left and right, for no reason, similar to my experience with Sonus faber, I gave up on anything that Quadrivio touches.

alexandre

Alexandre,

Thanks for letting us know in all fairness you have a strong anti Sonusfaber and ARC bias. It seems unhappily you had current bad experiences with the brand.


I have to say that my experience was the opposite - I have owned Stradivari and then tried several speakers, setting on the large Soundlab panels for some years. However two auditions of the TheSonusfaber with ARC top electronics have persuaded me that there was something new in the domain of box speakers. The young R&D team at Sonusfaber, with help of some acoustical consultants with excellent academic CVs, most probably with a large budget and access to modern facilities, and working with the experienced factory people managed to create a speaker that fascinated me - and many friends!

I did not have the resources or space to host the TheSonusfaber, but when the Aida arrived the foolishness won. Meanwhile a short stay of the Futura Amati with an ARC REF150 in my listening room also produced a great sound experience.

BTW, before deciding on the Aida I did my homework - I researched all I could about the "new" Sonus Faber company. After all I was going to spend a lot for these speakers. As I manage to read Italian I could even read the posts and discussions in italian audio forums where the Sonus Faber designers participate. These people are enthusiasts, not only for speakers, but for all aspects of music reproduction. They care for what they do.

Just to end with an happy note - the Dartzeel NHB108 and the Aida are a great match - on par with what we get with ARC and Aida!

 

[LL21]

Alexandre,

Thanks for letting us know in all fairness you have a strong anti Sonusfaber and ARC bias. It seems unhappily you had current bad experiences with the brand.


I have to say that my experience was the opposite - I have owned Stradivari and then tried several speakers, setting on the large Soundlab panels for some years. However two auditions of the TheSonusfaber with ARC top electronics have persuaded me that there was something new in the domain of box speakers. The young R&D team at Sonusfaber, with help of some acoustical consultants with excellent academic CVs, most probably with a large budget and access to modern facilities, and working with the experienced factory people managed to create a speaker that fascinated me - and many friends!

I did not have the resources or space to host the TheSonusfaber, but when the Aida arrived the foolishness won. Meanwhile a short stay of the Futura Amati with an ARC REF150 in my listening room also produced a great sound experience.

BTW, before deciding on the Aida I did my homework - I researched all I could about the "new" Sonus Faber company. After all I was going to spend a lot for these speakers. As I manage to read Italian I could even read the posts and discussions in italian audio forums where the Sonus Faber designers participate. These people are enthusiasts, not only for speakers, but for all aspects of music reproduction. They care for what they do.

Just to end with an happy note - the Dartzeel NHB108 and the Aida are a great match - on par with what we get with ARC and Aida!

Interesting...i either forgot or did not know that you also owned SF Strads...those i know well having owned them as well. How do the Aidas compare? I have an idea having heard a number of the new SF speakers...Just curious as to your more experienced opinion of them. Thanks!

 

[asiufy]

microstrip,

I've also owned many Sonus faber speakers (and, ironically, paired them with McIntosh 275s at some point in time). I liked them very much, and I always get positively impressed when I hear the Stradivari at a friend's place. I might have this "bias", as you say, but I still can recognise a good speaker.
I'm not disputing that whoever works for Sonus faber (metaphacts included) have true passion for what they do. I just believe that their owners don't have that same passion. I also didn't mean to say that they don't know what they're doing. Obviously, money can buy you a group of designers, in fact, this seems to be a trend in audio now (see Constellation Audio).
And good to know about the 108! That amp keeps surprising me all the time! I'll see if I can get my friend here, who owns an Aida, to let me bring my 108 there


cheers,
alexandre

 

[joeinid]

edit ...

Just to end with an happy note - the Dartzeel NHB108 and the Aida are a great match - on par with what we get with ARC and Aida!

microstrip,

edit ....

And good to know about the 108! That amp keeps surprising me all the time! I'll see if I can get my friend here, who owns an Aida, to let me bring my 108 there


cheers,
alexandre

The Dartzeel NHB-108 is absolutely an awesome amp. I love it.