I said I would never buy another Turntable...Argh !!!

[NorthStar]

Your humor is oxygen for me NorthStar.

Tang

Google should have give us a Tesla Roadster engine. ...That one orbiting in space, oxygen-free.

 

[NorthStar]

Tang needs to get the Vyger tt, and finally put to bed the preposterous notion that air bearing linear tracking arms are somehow not to be considered at these levels of perfection.

The Vyger has two planes of air bearing as compared to the AS, and air bearing to the arm.

If he's not listening to the Kronos or AF1, then there's plenty of real estate available if he moves these tts on to pastures new.

This one?, linear tracking:
• http://www.vyger.com/atlantis-generation/

* VYGER means VOYAGER (its name Baptist took the vowels "O" and "A" out)
• http://www.living-sound.com/html/oesterreich/news/review_vyger.htm

Another linear tracking:
• http://www.hifitimereview.com/av-design-haus-dereneville-vpm-2010/

And its designer is a member here, Rainer Horstmann

 

[dminches]

I have a great tape collection..."almost" my entire wish list on tape at this point. It is still for special occasion listening. The LP spinners are used 90% of the time for listening. The AS is about 99% with occasional AF1 listening. Once I'm moved to my new place and the stereo is in the great room, all three of my TT's will be spinning at one time or another. Lack of time is the main culprit lately for my lack of use of my other TT's, Tape and digital. I still believe variety is the spice of life...

Christian, there are still a lot of goodies that can be added to your collection .

 

[rockitman]

Vintage Ortofon SPU GTE is sounding very nice for its first listen on my system. Built in transformer and nude elliptical diamond. Tracks at 4 grams. $850 all in at auction

Other carts on remaining arms: Koetsu Coralstone Diamond, Dynavector XV-t, Lyra Olympos SL mono

 

[Lagonda]

Vintage Ortofon SPU GTE is sounding very nice for its first listen on my system. Built in transformer and nude elliptical diamond. Tracks at 4 grams. $850 all in at auction

Other carts on remaining arms: Koetsu Coralstone Diamond, Dynavector XV-t, Lyra Olympos SL mono

How does your “Bob’s Devices” compare to your other MC inputs ? I’m using a 1/40 with a Benz Ebony TR and like it a lot ! Got mine mostly to utilize my MM input but was positively surprised. On top of that Bob is a really nice guy, and custom made mine with alternate inputs so i could integrate it in my TT.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Vintage Ortofon SPU GTE is sounding very nice for its first listen on my system. Built in transformer and nude elliptical diamond. Tracks at 4 grams. $850 all in at auction

Other carts on remaining arms: Koetsu Coralstone Diamond, Dynavector XV-t, Lyra Olympos SL mono

Are you not worried about that cartridge ruining your vinyl tracking at that weight?

 

[Al M.]

Are you not worried about that cartridge ruining your vinyl tracking at that weight?

Yes, good question. I was dismayed when someone else's cheap cartridge tracking at 4 grams, with which I played my records, ruined them when I was young. A few runs was all it took until I started to hear increased noise and distortion -- and that was from a low-resolution system.

 

[ddk]

Are you not worried about that cartridge ruining your vinyl tracking at that weight?

I’m using similar SPUs and 6 gram Neumann for years without any damage to the records. There are still thousands of people still using a vintage SPU of some type today and there’s a good chance that the used vintage records you buy now were played with the SPU another day.

david

 

[Al M.]

There are still thousands of people still using a vintage SPU of some type today and there’s a good chance that the used vintage records you buy noow were played with the SPU another day.

david

Which would explain the noise on many of them. Or not?

 

[ddk]

Which would explain the noise on many of them. Or not?

How’s noise related to the tracking weight of the SPU? Which type of noise?

david

 

[microstrip]

How’s noise related to the tracking weight of the SPU? Which type of noise?

david

Stylus profile, quality of its contact surface and tracking abilities are more relevant than just the tracking force. In fact, if due to friction in the tonearm or too low tracking force the contact is poor we will add much more noise damage to your LPs.

Sometime in the past extremely low tracking force was mainly a marketing argument.

 

[Al M.]

How’s noise related to the tracking weight of the SPU? Which type of noise?

david

Surface noise.

 

[ddk]

Surface noise.

Been using for years and I’ve never seen any evidence of a working SPU causing surface noise or any additional wear to my records Al. Your experience with your friend’s cartridge was unfortunate but there could be other reasons for the damage besides tracking force.

Some styli designs also exaggerate any type of surface noise making majority of records unlistenable, even new pristine looking ones.

david

 

[Al M.]

Stylus profile, quality of its contact surface and tracking abilities are more relevant than just the tracking force. In fact, if due to friction in the tonearm or too low tracking force the contact is poor we will add much more noise damage to your LPs.

Your experience with your friend’s cartridge was unfortunate but there could be other reasons for the damage besides tracking force.

Fair points, Gentlemen.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

But all things equal (correctly set up arm and cart), one would rather track lower than higher surely. There must be a finite lifespan for vinyl that would be substantially reduced when tracking with double or triple the tracking force employed by SPUs (4g or 6g vs say 1.72g of a Lyra). That said, I would also expect that tangentially tracking arms would also lead to more groove wear than linear tracking (both arms setup correctly).

 

[ddk]

But all things equal (correctly set up arm and cart), one would rather track lower than higher surely. There must be a finite lifespan for vinyl that would be substantially reduced when tracking with double or triple the tracking force employed by SPUs (4g or 6g vs say 1.72g of a Lyra). That said, I would also expect that tangentially tracking arms would also lead to more groove wear than linear tracking (both arms setup correctly).

I've never come across any data regarding this subject only the odd claims here and there from some manufacturers. Neumann was recording industry's golden boy and all his creations and designs are still highly sought after and in use, I very much doubt he would have designed a cartridge needing 6g VTF if it was going to damage records. SPU is also one of all time greatest cartridge designs with decades of service, it couldn't have lasted all this time damaging records.

Vinyl life is finite like everything else and proper setup is only one of many variables that can affect a record, things are rarely equal with analog playback.

david

 

[rockitman]

Are you not worried about that cartridge ruining your vinyl tracking at that weight?

Nope...it doesn't wear out the vinyl anymore than a cart that tracks at 2 grams. Damage to the groove can happen when your too light or too heavy outside of the carts tracking range which is 3-5 grams for the SPU GTE

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Nope...it doesn't wear out the vinyl anymore than a cart that tracks at 2 grams. Damage to the groove can happen when your too light or too heavy outside of the carts tracking range which is 3-5 grams for the SPU GTE

Hi Christian,

You answer this emphatically - please could you cite your data source for further reading my end. It would be entirely intuitive that other things being equal tracking at double the weight will wear out your vinyl faster.

I have spoken to someone at length on this subject who I consider a vinyl guru - he take similar view to me. Will ask him to chime in.

 

[ddk]

Hi Christian,

You answer this emphatically - please could you cite your data source for further reading my end. It would be entirely intuitive that other things being equal tracking at double the weight will wear out your vinyl faster.

I have spoken to someone at length on this subject who I consider a vinyl guru - he take similar view to me. Will ask him to chime in.

What do you mean by wearing out your vinyl? How many plays over how long a period? Stylus profile and tonearms also play a significant role in wear and tear how do you account for that forming a bias in tracking force? How much VTF is too much for vinyl, is there any data anywhere? Not knowing any of this I don't have any opinions one way or another on the subject but based on my experience I haven't had any audible wear with SPUs VTF of 3.5g+.

david

 

[dan31]

Nope...it doesn't wear out the vinyl anymore than a cart that tracks at 2 grams. Damage to the groove can happen when your too light or too heavy outside of the carts tracking range which is 3-5 grams for the SPU GTE

This rings true to me. If you are running the cartridge at the VTF it was designed for the stylus will be able to track the groove as designed. Too much or to little will take the suspension out of compliance and mistraking and groove damage will follow.