I said I would never buy another Turntable...Argh !!!

[rockitman]

Hello Christian,

Is this the ND23 you were taliking about thats priced around $5,000? What would the table top be made of.

Kind regards,
Tang

That may be the price for the nano damp workstation tables without active isolation modules.
http://www.herzan.com/products/passive-vibration-control/nanodamp-series.html

Right now the top plate is 3/4" aluminum plate. I am sure I could do steel too...maybe 1/2" to 3/4". I wonder what is a better choice...aluminum or steel ???
Seems that steel may have more ring than aluminum ?

 

[rockitman]

That's a great drawing. Thanks for posting and sharing. What are the details for those four footers? They appear to be able to move in some way. Perhaps they are rollers.

There are a variety of footer options...height adjustable/leveling feet and a caster/foot combo. You raise the feet to get the casters off the floor and level the table, lower them to potentially roll the TT around on casters.

 

[rockitman]

After going back and forth I finally settled on the best top plate material for this TT application...1/2” plain old carbon steel. Aluminum and Stainless are bad choices from a high frequency resonance ring standpoint from what I understand.

 

[Ron Resnick]

After going back and forth I finally settled on the best top plate material for this TT application...1/2” plain old carbon steel. Aluminum and Stainless are bad choices from a high frequency resonance ring standpoint from what I understand.

Ooohhh! I think I specified 1/2" stainless steel. I will change that!

For steel I think 1/2" is the thickest Herzan will make.

Does the carbon steel need to be painted or sealed in some way to avoid rusting?

I got the colour chart today and a lot of cool automotive-type colours are available. Different finishes -- crackled, textured, polished clearcoat -- are available.

 

[Ron Resnick]

There are a variety of footer options...height adjustable/leveling feet and a caster/foot combo. You raise the feet to get the casters off the floor and level the table, lower them to potentially roll the TT around on casters.

Do you understand how the castors work? Once the stand is moved into place somehow the castors retract, leaving the stand in place?

 

[Folsom]

After going back and forth I finally settled on the best top plate material for this TT application...1/2” plain old carbon steel. Aluminum and Stainless are bad choices from a high frequency resonance ring standpoint from what I understand.

That is not why Herzan has different materials... There is no way you'll get ringing from either because the coupling pressure from the turntable is too much, which effectively drops the resonating frequencies very low (why the turntable is heavy to begin with). Problems with coupling could be generated if the mating surface didn't match well, or the "feet" to the table have zero give, in which case carbon would be the most flexible but it won't matter at 1/2".

My point being, Ron, don't bother to make the change until less David tells you the feet for the table are flat machined surfaces on the bottom. If they are not, there is no point. The active portion of the table will certainly quell any "ringing" that could be possible in that low of a resonate frequency that the coupled weight will create. It's not a diminishing return factor, it is a no return factor without the situation where you need machined to machined surface tolerances tight enough to make suction... And yet still probably not possible.

 

[rockitman]

Do you understand how the castors work? Once the stand is moved into place somehow the castors retract, leaving the stand in place?

This is how they were explained to me:

Essentially the foot is raised or lowered depending on the current need. During the design our engineers felt that our typical design of having the casters offset from the leveling feet may lead to some relatively easy tipping of the stand due to the height and relative narrowness of the stand, so they wanted me to run the combination caster leveling feet by you. Alternatively I believe we could have the casters installed where the leveling feet will eventually be put into place where you would then need to remove them and attach the leveling feet once the stand is in place.

I was originally offered the combo feet for my two other Herzan racks. Since I won't be moving the rack around and since I have carpet over my basement floor, I will most likely use this option from Herzan (pic below). A simple swivel hat type footer that raises and lowers using the nut on the footer and a wrench.

 

[rockitman]

That is not why Herzan has different materials... There is no way you'll get ringing from either because the coupling pressure from the turntable is too much, which effectively drops the resonating frequencies very low (why the turntable is heavy to begin with). Problems with coupling could be generated if the mating surface didn't match well, or the "feet" to the table have zero give, in which case carbon would be the most flexible but it won't matter at 1/2".

My point being, Ron, don't bother to make the change until less David tells you the feet for the table are flat machined surfaces on the bottom. If they are not, there is no point. The active portion of the table will certainly quell any "ringing" that could be possible in that low of a resonate frequency that the coupled weight will create. It's not a diminishing return factor, it is a no return factor without the situation where you need machined to machined surface tolerances tight enough to make suction... And yet still probably not possible.

This could all be true...but I went with David's recommendation for a carbon steel plate top. Not aluminum, panerholtz, stainless or other material.

 

[Folsom]

I wouldn't be the least surprised if he had a reason that was chemical related.

 

[rockitman]

The 1/2” steel top plate weighs 125lbs. Hopefully it can be easily unscrewed from the AVI modules for easier movement into my house and down the basement steps...which I am reinforcing with 2x4’s just in case. They handled 350lb Wilson Alexandria woofer cabinets okay...not taking any chances

 

[rockitman]

I wouldn't be the least surprised if he had a reason that was chemical related.

Interaction between aluminum and steel ?

 

[BruceD]

Interaction between aluminum and steel ?

Interesting--which one is the Anode?

Great thread guys

BruceD

 

[Folsom]

Interaction between aluminum and steel ?

I won't put words in his mouth. But those two can corrode.

Here's something interesting for you BruceD, as carbon and aluminum are closer to anode than aluminum and SS. That might be a big relation to choice.

 

[BruceD]

I won't put words in his mouth. But those two can corrode.

Here's something interesting for you BruceD, as carbon and aluminum are closer to anode than aluminum and SS. That might be a big relation to choice.

You're right F--that was Interesting thank you

BD

 

[bonzo75]

The 1/2” steel top plate weighs 125lbs. Hopefully it can be easily unscrewed from the AVI modules for easier movement into my house and down the basement steps...which I am reinforcing with 2x4’s just in case. They handled 350lb Wilson Alexandria woofer cabinets okay...not taking any chances

Wow this TT is heavier than the Alexandria? That is something, if you look at them visually

 

[microstrip]

Wow this TT is heavier than the Alexandria? That is something, if you look at them visually

Christian was referring to X2 bass cabinets - the complete XLF weights 655 lbs each!

 

[bonzo75]

Oh ok. So close

 

[Kingsrule]

Is Herzan putting the blue rubber damping sheet on the bottom of the top plate?

 

[rockitman]

Is Herzan putting the blue rubber damping sheet on the bottom of the top plate?

I don't think so as the top plate is attached directly via bolt/screws to the top of the AVI active isolation modules. That is how I understand it anyway.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Thank you, Christian, for explaining the casters. I'm not sure what I want to do about the castors.

I understand the typical offset castors, but I don't really understand the castor/foot combination.

The CEO of Herzan explained to me one time that they are not averse to a thin cushiony layer below the isolation platform upon customer request to dampen frequencies above 1,000 Hz, but it is still more common for their stands not to have such a layer.

With the American Sound's massive weight I do see any worry about it being buffeted by floorborne or acoustic vibrations above 1,000 Hz. I do not think we need a visco-elastic layer on our AS stands.

Interestingly, David does employ a vibration absorbing layer below the American Sound turntable when he uses industrial rubber washers to separate the table top from his Kinetics Systems stand.

Mike, David -- what do you think?