Hi-rez analog?

[fas42]

Clearly the above virtues definitely diminish when we go down towards lower formats. You get more darker passages between the musicians where the definition of space and air in between them starts to go missing. Hence you get this 'sudden leap of sound' from a musician playing on red book which could be misconstrued as dynamics.

Since I don't have this problem I never really understood what people were talking about here until the second last time I visited the system of the friend, who has now caught my disease . The sound of RB was fine until the level dropped to a certain point, and the sound seemed to disappear! I thought, what the hell's going on here, the recording almost sounds like it was a completely different mastering!

Obviously this highlights a fairly typical problem that a lot of listeners seem to have with RB playback: through a combination of engineering and system configuration there is an end result of losing a lot of low level information on playback. And this was the first time I had noticed it so clearly on someone else's system ...

Frank

 

[Bruce B]

So Bruce, my answer to your question would be 2xDSD as the format of choice for hi-rez.
Neville

Ding.. Ding.. Ding.... We Have A Winner!!

Yes, DSD128fs inserted into an AD/DA loop from our tape machines is indistinguishable to me.

 

[c1ferrari]

Ding.. Ding.. Ding.... We Have A Winner!!

Yes, DSD128fs inserted into an AD/DA loop from our tape machines is indistinguishable to me.

Would you know which hi-rez format Jonathan was accessing at THE Show in California? It was astonishingly pleasing

 

[microstrip]

Ding.. Ding.. Ding.... We Have A Winner!!

Yes, DSD128fs inserted into an AD/DA loop from our tape machines is indistinguishable to me.

Bruce,
Do you know of any place where we can find a technical summary of all the DSD variants? Good old days of PCM (that was been with us since 1937...).

 

[Bruce B]

Bruce,
Do you know of any place where we can find a technical summary of all the DSD variants? Good old days of PCM (that was been with us since 1937...).

There's really not much out there.

Wiki has an article that references various DSD papers that have been written.

Wiki

 

[Robin Hood]

Ding.. Ding.. Ding.... We Have A Winner!!

Yes, DSD128fs inserted into an AD/DA loop from our tape machines is indistinguishable to me.

Where can we buy DSD128fs music? Do you sell any or do you know if anyone is planning to offer DSD128fs music?

 

[microstrip]

There's really not much out there.

Wiki has an article that references various DSD papers that have been written.

Wiki

Can I conclude that DSD128 uses a similar encoding of what is used in SACD but just at the double of the master frequency (twice as good as SACD )?

 

[Bruce B]

Can I conclude that DSD128 uses a similar encoding of what is used in SACD but just at the double of the master frequency (twice as good as SACD )?

Yes, that is correct. The DSD sample rate of SACD is 2.8224MHz
There is double data rate DSD described as DSD128fs, or 5.6MHz, which is used by several recording devices and converters. This is generally preferred since the UHF noise starts further from the audible band.
These are, on the workbench, DSD512fs and DSD1024fs sample rates.

DSD can come in several formats .diff .wsd .dsf

 

[RogerD]

I've been reading some of the forums over at CA and there was a discussion between Cookie Marenco (Blue Coast Records), Barry Diament (Soundkeeper Recordings) and Mark Waldrep (AIX) on what constitutes a Hi-rez recordings. Barry is adamant that anything from analog master tape is not hi-rez since "most" analog devices can't produce anything over 17-18k. (Of course my thinking is that these 3 people have an agenda because they each have something to sell.)

But as most people that have been to shows and some even being able to use first-hand, analog tape just has that magic. So what I'm asking people is what is the minimum needed in the digital domain to satisfy the inclusion of analog tape as "true" hi-rez?

There is no doubt that tape is hi-rez in my mind. Most do not have access to modified studio recorders that have been setup properly. The best tape has low level detail,just like digital and can capture space and time as good as the latest digital technology. I asked a friend if we had hit the wall with tape and he responded I don't know. Myself I don't think we have,but the direction seems to be digital and I think that is a good thing. I will continue to perfect my tape systems,as tape to my ear is the ultimate medium for now.

 

[microstrip]

Bruce,

About a year ago you considered that

"Too bad you couldn't have tested the Pyramix MassCore system in DSD128fs or DXD. That's what we use and have found nothing better. (...)
For anyone really getting into vinyl archiving, the best unit I've heard for under $10k is the Korg MR2000s at DSD5.6. It's the Bee's Knees!"

Do you still have the same opinion?
BTW, is DSD128fs the same thing as DSD5.6?

 

[Bruce B]

"Too bad you couldn't have tested the Pyramix MassCore system in DSD128fs or DXD. That's what we use and have found nothing better. (...)
For anyone really getting into vinyl archiving, the best unit I've heard for under $10k is the Korg MR2000s at DSD5.6. It's the Bee's Knees!"

Do you still have the same opinion?
BTW, is DSD128fs the same thing as DSD5.6?

I still believe this. Yes, DSD128fs is the same as DSD5.6MHz

 

[microstrip]

Bruce,
One more question concerning the Korg MR2000s : can we apply equalization to a DSD128fs file in DSD format?

 

[Bruce B]

Bruce,
One more question concerning the Korg MR2000s : can we apply equalization to a DSD128fs file in DSD format?

No...

 

[bdiament]

Hi Bruce,

I've been reading some of the forums over at CA and there was a discussion between Cookie Marenco (Blue Coast Records), Barry Diament (Soundkeeper Recordings) and Mark Waldrep (AIX) on what constitutes a Hi-rez recordings. Barry is adamant that anything from analog master tape is not hi-rez since "most" analog devices can't produce anything over 17-18k. (Of course my thinking is that these 3 people have an agenda because they each have something to sell.)

But as most people that have been to shows and some even being able to use first-hand, analog tape just has that magic. So what I'm asking people is what is the minimum needed in the digital domain to satisfy the inclusion of analog tape as "true" hi-rez?

If you were familiar with me and if you read that thread carefully, you'd see that it was Mark Waldrep, not me, who would not include analog tape as "high res".

Doesn't it suck when folks attribute words to you that are not your own?

Best regards,
Barry
www.soundkeeperrecordings.com
www.barrydiamentaudio.com

 

[Bruce B]

Hi Bruce,

If you were familiar with me and if you read that thread carefully, you'd see that it was Mark Waldrep, not me, who would not include analog tape as "high res".

Thank-you for the correction. I'm happy to have you at our forum here.

 

[bdiament]

Hi Bruce,

...(Of course my thinking is that these 3 people have an agenda because they each have something to sell.)...

Thanks for the welcome.

As to my having "something to sell", yes, that is correct. But it would be a mistake (at best and something else at worst) to suggest that I advocate a format because I sell it. Again, if you were familiar with me and with Soundkeeper Recordings, you'd know that if I sell something, it is only because I believe in it. I started Soundkeeper exactly for that reason - to create the best recordings I know how to make. Our releases are offered in several formats and allow our customers to make their own choices.

Besides, if I really wanted to make a lot of money, I'd offer downloads. If you check the site, you'll see there are none - for several reasons. The artists I work with spend a lot of time and energy creating whole works as albums, so I won't break them into "singles". Neither will Soundkeeper offer any of the so-called "lossless" formats, which make for faster downloads, because I don't feel those formats, when de-coded while listening, are in fact "lossless". If bandwidth ever increased to where a 4G album at 24/192 can be downloaded in a reasonable time, we might reconsider but for now, we deem it impractical.

I like vinyl too, even though I don't sell any.
It isn't always about money and having something to sell, Bruce. Sometimes, it really is about seeking to offer the highest Quality possible.
And providing real customer service, as well as making sure our artists get a larger share of all sales than even the biggest acts get from major labels.

Best regards,
Barry
www.soundkeeperrecordings.com
www.barrydiamentaudio.com

 

[Steve Williams]

Hi Barry and welcome to WBF. Looking forward to your contributions. I have been trying to get Cookie to join as well but without success.

 

[bdiament]

Thank you Steve.
As a newbie here, I still need to look around and read some more.

Best regards,
Barry
www.soundkeeperrecordings.com
www.barrydiamentaudio.com

 

[MylesBAstor]

Hi Bruce,



Thanks for the welcome.

As to my having "something to sell", yes, that is correct. But it would be a mistake (at best and something else at worst) to suggest that I advocate a format because I sell it. Again, if you were familiar with me and with Soundkeeper Recordings, you'd know that if I sell something, it is only because I believe in it. I started Soundkeeper exactly for that reason - to create the best recordings I know how to make. Our releases are offered in several formats and allow our customers to make their own choices.

Besides, if I really wanted to make a lot of money, I'd offer downloads. If you check the site, you'll see there are none - for several reasons. The artists I work with spend a lot of time and energy creating whole works as albums, so I won't break them into "singles". Neither will Soundkeeper offer any of the so-called "lossless" formats, which make for faster downloads, because I don't feel those formats, when de-coded while listening, are in fact "lossless". If bandwidth ever increased to where a 4G album at 24/192 can be downloaded in a reasonable time, we might reconsider but for now, we deem it impractical.

I like vinyl too, even though I don't sell any.
It isn't always about money and having something to sell, Bruce. Sometimes, it really is about seeking to offer the highest Quality possible.
And providing real customer service, as well as making sure our artists get a larger share of all sales than even the biggest acts get from major labels.

Best regards,
Barry
www.soundkeeperrecordings.com
www.barrydiamentaudio.com

Good to see you here Barry

 

[bdiament]

Thanks Myles.
How long has this forum existed?
It is new to me.

Best regards,
Barry
www.soundkeeperrecordings.com
www.barrydiamentaudio.com