Esoteric to Bricasti?

[vrac]

Currently using an Innuos Zenith mk3, Phoenix USB & Phoenix Net as my music server. My DAC/player is an Esoteric K03XD. Sounds great however I don't think the Esoteric may be optimized for the Linux based Innuos. (Does not play native DSD for example.) I've been considering the Bricasti M1s2 DAC and M19 SACD transport HOWEVER there is very little info on the M19. Just wondering if any forum members have experience with Bricasti and how their products would compare with esoteric products. Contacted Innuos and Esoteric and both see to suggest a possible compatibility issue. Every works OK but just wondering if Bricasti would sound better? Thanks in advance! Happiest of Holidays!

 

[GSOphile]

"Does not play native DSD for example." It does via the USB input. And the K-03XD's DAC operates as a delta sigma DSD DAC. What aspects of the sound disappoint you? Is it confined to streamed music over the internet, stored music, CD/SACD disc playback, or some combination? Or are you just wanting to try Bricasti? (As a K-01XD owner, I am curious too.)

 

[Gladiator]

I can't comment on Esoteric or your Linux compatibility question. Bricasti products are top notch, sound really good and come with exemplary customer service. I have owned the M1 DAC for a number of years and recently upgraded to the M1S2 and purchased the M20 Preamp and I couldn't be happier. I'd suggest demoing the M1 to answer your Linux compatibility query. Hopefully you have a local dealer who can assist you with that. The M19 is a new product and might be a little harder to demo or get review feedback.

 

[2fastdriving]

I can't comment on the bricasti, but your Esoteric is a great unit, and it does support DSD. I think you should figure that issue out and keep it.

 

[ptman]

I've had my Bricasti M1 Limited Gold DAC for seven years, and am considering upgrading it to the M1SE Series II (performed at the factory).I have had two upgrades of my DAC (both done quickly and very reasonably priced). Purchased M25 amp four years ago. Have an M20 preamplifier coming in shortly. Gear is built like a rock, upgrades are very reasonable, and customer service is top notch. I agree you should demo the DAC somehow to make sure it suits your ear. There was a review of the M1SE Series II in Future Audiophile this week.

 

[matthias]

@vrac
If you want the SQ of the M1S2 but want to spend less consider the MC1 from the professional line.
It has the same PS as the M2S1 but only two filter settings and no volume control.

 

[vrac]

Thanks to all. The Esoteric sounds great. Have no issues with sound quality but in the Innuos settings DSD files will ONLY play when the setting is DSD over PCM. I'm not even sure that matters but is noteworthy. I think the Esoteric only plays native DSD in a windows based OS but I'm unsure.
I will reach out to my Bricasti dealer to see if a demo is possible. As I have many many SACD discs a DAC/player that plays SACDs is a must. I know it's old school but it works for me. Happy and Healthy to all!!!!

 

[vrac]

"Does not play native DSD for example." It does via the USB input. And the K-03XD's DAC operates as a delta sigma DSD DAC. What aspects of the sound disappoint you? Is it confined to streamed music over the internet, stored music, CD/SACD disc playback, or some combination? Or are you just wanting to try Bricasti? (As a K-01XD owner, I am curious too.)

GSOphile,
I really enjoy the Esoteric player. Not disappointed at all. I use it with the Innuos to stream (Qobuz) but mostly with many high Rez files that I've downloaded to the 4 TB internal drive in the Zenith. I do spin SACDS and other discs as well. I know that the Bricasti seamlessly works driverless with Linux OS based servers and curious if it should would be better or just different. I guess I need to demo. Thanks!
BTW have you updated your K-01XD to the current software? If so did it improve anything? I have not yet.

 

[Notdead]

I have a K03XD which shares the same firmware update as the K01XD. I highly recommend the update. In my case dynamics and clarity were improved. I only spin discs.

 

[GSOphile]

GSOphile,
I really enjoy the Esoteric player. Not disappointed at all. I use it with the Innuos to stream (Qobuz) but mostly with many high Rez files that I've downloaded to the 4 TB internal drive in the Zenith. I do spin SACDS and other discs as well. I know that the Bricasti seamlessly works driverless with Linux OS based servers and curious if it should would be better or just different. I guess I need to demo. Thanks!
BTW have you updated your K-01XD to the current software? If so did it improve anything? I have not yet.

I have installed all but the latest software. Did not notice any appreciable improvements in SQ with these. I'll make it a point to catch up.
Like you, I am addicted to SACDs, hence my K-01XD.
I have a friend with a Zenith Mk3 and quite few SACDs. Asked him if he was able to in some way rip his SACDs to his Innuos' storage. Said he had no problem using the Zenith's ripping drive, except for a few that wouldn't rip. What was actually happening was that he was ripping the CD layer of SACDs that had a CD layer.

 

[vrac]

Just updated to the latest Esoteric firmware V2.60. Dynamics seem improved. Perhaps more impact. More real. Very happy. I did not rip any discs but downloaded my previously purchased DSD files from Native DSD and Prostudiomasters accounts. Took a while to do but well worth it.

 

[Cellcbern]

Currently using an Innuos Zenith mk3, Phoenix USB & Phoenix Net as my music server. My DAC/player is an Esoteric K03XD. Sounds great however I don't think the Esoteric may be optimized for the Linux based Innuos. (Does not play native DSD for example.) I've been considering the Bricasti M1s2 DAC and M19 SACD transport HOWEVER there is very little info on the M19. Just wondering if any forum members have experience with Bricasti and how their products would compare with esoteric products. Contacted Innuos and Esoteric and both see to suggest a possible compatibility issue. Every works OK but just wondering if Bricasti would sound better? Thanks in advance! Happiest of Holidays!

As far as I know Bricasti DAC's don't accept the native DSD bitstream from SACD's (which can only be transmitted via I2S over HDMI) and convert them directly to analogue without first converting then to PCM. Only aware of three DAC's that do - Audio-GD, Denafrips, and Holo Audio. See my comments in the thread "DAC Comparison and Recommendation Request regarding my new pairing of the PS Audio Perfectwave SACD Transport with the Audio-GD R7 HE Mk. 2 R2R DAC.

 

[Macattack]

As far as I know Bricasti DAC's don't accept the native DSD bitstream from SACD's (which can only be transmitted via I2S over HDMI) and convert them directly to analogue without first converting then to PCM. Only aware of three DAC's that do - Audio-GD, Denafrips, and Holo Audio. See my comments in the thread "DAC Comparison and Recommendation Request regarding my new pairing of the PS Audio Perfectwave SACD Transport with the Audio-GD R7 HE Mk. 2 R2R DAC.

I believe accepting the I2S Bitstream is only allowed by law in specific cases where a manufacturer develops a proprietary connection between their transport and DAC. It is not supposed to work to another company’s DAC. That’s what PSAudio has done.

Bricasti just recently introduced their own Transport that will in fact send the bit stream from an SACD to a Bricasti DAC. I believe it is called the M19 and it lists for somewhere around $10,000.

 

[GSOphile]

I believe accepting the I2S Bitstream is only allowed by law in specific cases where a manufacturer develops a proprietary connection between their transport and DAC. It is not supposed to work to another company’s DAC. That’s what PSAudio has done.

Bricasti just recently introduced their own Transport that will in fact send the bit stream from an SACD to a Bricasti DAC. I believe it is called the M19 and it lists for somewhere around $10,000.

Agree with this. There are SACD licensing restrictions against sending an SACD bit stream from one manufacturer's transport to another manufacturer's DAC.

 

[Cellcbern]

The PS Audio Perfectwave SACD Transport can be used with any DAC that accepts the I2S bitstream

Agree with this. There are SACD licensing restrictions against sending an SACD bit stream from one manufacturer's transport to another manufacturer's DAC.

The PS Audio SACD transport can be used with any DAC that can accept the DSD bitstream via I2S over HDMI.There are no legal restrictions on DAC’s since it is not possible to copy an SACD via I2S over HDMI. I am using the PSA unit with an Audio-GD DAC as I’ve said. I have colleagues who have used it with Denafrips and Holo Audio DAC’s.The legal issues start and end with the transport. Note by the way that the Bryston BDA-3 DAC, which has been on the market for a number of years, allows for SACD playback from any universal player with an HDMI or HDMI Audio output.There is a circuit built into the Bryston that strips and converts the DSD signal but only into PCM. Perfectly legal. You can also buy a converter box with similar circuitry that splits out the DSD signal from an HDMI or HDMI Audio output, and transmits it via I2S over HDMI to a compatible DAC-again, legal, as far as I know. Not sure what reason there is for a manufacturer to have a proprietary linkage between transport and DAC, except to keep you locked into their products.

FYI: https://audiophilestyle.com/ca/revi...-physical-sacds-through-an-outboard-dac-r971/

 

[thedudeabides]

As I have many many SACD discs a DAC/player that plays SACDs is a must. I know it's old school but it works for me.

If vinyl and R2R is not old school, I do not know what is.

No need to apologize to the "must be analogue club" to get SOTA sound. That is because it can, and does sound really good.

 

[Cellcbern]

I believe accepting the I2S Bitstream is only allowed by law in specific cases where a manufacturer develops a proprietary connection between their transport and DAC. It is not supposed to work to another company’s DAC. That’s what PSAudio has done.

Bricasti just recently introduced their own Transport that will in fact send the bit stream from an SACD to a Bricasti DAC. I believe it is called the M19 and it lists for somewhere around $10,000.

What isn’t clear is whether Bricasti DAC’s with the “optional” I2S HDMI input will also have the capability to convert the DSD bitstream directly to analogue the way Audio-GD, Denafrips, and Holo Audio can. The fact that the I2S input is optional and can be installed on earlier models suggests not. If the DSD signal has to be converted to PCM for playback then I would expect the Bricasti DAC’s to be inferior sonically, at least for SACD playback.

 

[vrac]

Is Native DSD superior to DSD over PCM? Can't seem to get a clear answer. Or are they basically the same sonically?

 

[asiufy]

Bricasti DACs are great, though I'm particularly fond of the M21, as it has a ladder DAC + a true 1bit DSD path. Also love that they're network DACs, so no USB complications...
We are getting an M19 to test, along with the new input I2S input module. As far as I know, via I2B, the M19 outputs Native DSD, and via legacy ports (AES), it's DoP.

 

[Cellcbern]

Is Native DSD superior to DSD over PCM? Can't seem to get a clear answer. Or are they basically the same sonically?

Significantly superior to my ears.