Its truly a waste of time for audio now. You need to experience Munich for the variety of HE gear. The sound may only be adequate since the rooms are meant for the fashion industry but the variety is just INSANE. I have never seen so much top end gear in one place and one time. Its a fun show and I am going again this year
Jason Victor Serinus said it very well in his report for Stereophile:
"By Day Three of four-day CES 2019, reality had set in for most of the few high-end audio exhibitors who set up shop in the Venetian: the curtain has closed on CES as "the place" for high-end audio product introductions and business transactions. Several of the smaller companies I spoke with were already done with waxing nostalgic on the glory days of CES—an era when there were so many distributors, dealers, and journalists clogging the hallways and rooms that some exhibitors had to either close up shop at the factory or recruit extra help to cater to everyone. After wiping tears from their eyes, they had decided to move on."
Read more at https://www.stereophile.com/content/curtain-closes-ces#gyuxbpvbGl5eOMUb.99
The slow death of CES isn't a sign that there is a problem with high end, it is a sign that there is a problem with CES.
Axpona, RMAF, T.H.E. Show in Newport, High End Munich have no problems finding plenty of vendors and attendees.
Most product introductions these days, occur at RMAF, Axpona or High End Munich. CES hasn't been a center for high end audio for quite a few years.
As far as our "heard thinning". This only seems to be a US phenomena. Watch any video on YouTube from the high end shows in Europe or Asia, and you will see crowds much more skewed toward younger people, and more females.
I remember very well the glory days from audio mags reporting on CES of nostalgic years.
Audio was booming business deals then. The machine was well oiled and every links of the chain supported and maintained.
I started another thread on CES 2019, as mentioned by Marty, and I reported few of the new stuff happening. Of course lots has to do with visuals, video products and the latest technological developments. I did not choose those selections; that's what is making the news in Vegas CES now, Consumer Electronics Show.
Lots and lots of young people in Vegas, beautiful blue people.
Munich is a long way from home. Home is where the heart is.
_____
I used to fly to CES to scope out lines to add. These days I can save a boatload of money by going to HK or Tokyo where more manufacturers are represented.
I'm sure it's the same for US dealers who can opt for many other regional shows where prospective products might be displayed.
These days, if you are an established distributor or dealer it is very easy to touch bases with manufacturers. Typically only a basic introduction is required. There is an informal, pretty much unseen, network of manufacturers and distributors and it is global. Degrees of separation are more like 3 degrees rather than the theorized 6.
This in my opinion is what killed CES (along with the current limiting blue oxes LOL). The value of going has simply been stripped to next to nothing. It's the worst case scenario. Expensive to exhibit AND expensive to attend. That show treaded on prestige for a time. No more.
I think it is accepted that Munich has taken the West's crown and Hong Kong has taken the East's for both number of exhibitors as well as industry attendees.
I used to fly to CES to scope out lines to add. These days I can save a boatload of money by going to HK or Tokyo where more manufacturers are represented.
I'm sure it's the same for US dealers who can opt for many other regional shows where prospective products might be displayed.
These days, if you are an established distributor or dealer it is very easy to touch bases with manufacturers. Typically only a basic introduction is required. There is an informal, pretty much unseen, network of manufacturers and distributors and it is global. Degrees of separation are more like 3 degrees rather than the theorized 6.
This in my opinion is what killed CES (along with the current limiting blue oxes LOL). The value of going has simply been stripped to next to nothing. It's the worst case scenario. Expensive to exhibit AND expensive to attend. That show treaded on prestige for a time. No more.
I think it is accepted that Munich has taken the West's crown and Hong Kong has taken the East's for both number of exhibitors as well as industry attendees.
Not really Tim. It is projected to be more ...errrr.....exotic. High end prices are already practically out of reach for most in the region. I think the AE show caters to the wealthier North Asian countries and perhaps a smattering of clients from South East Asia. Hong Kong and China I believe are AE's main market. CKeung I believe is an AE forum member and should have insight on what is actually a community more than just a store.
CES was always way too draconian even in the 'good old days'. T.H.E. Show was good for them to come down to earth. But after 9/11, it got a lot harder for foreign nationals to come to the US; it was a lot easier to get to Germany. So the German show began to grow and had to be moved from Frankfurt to Munich where it is now the largest show and certainly the goto for foreign distribution. IOW not all of this is CES' fault and I do miss going to somewhere warm in January, but I'm glad to be done with the CES nonsense. RMAF eclipsed CES years ago for a US show and is a lot more fun, and now there's a sea of shows- too many IMO.
AXPONA has grown a lot but unfortunately is taking cues from CES and need to clean up their business dealings if they plan to continue. We got screwed our of our room and our points there even though we had signed up to renew our room contract (same room same rate if you sign up by midnight Saturday of the last show, which we did). When businesses won't honor contracts, IME they aren't long for the world.
RMAF has a new venue this year that is larger, classier and much closer to the airport. We'll definitely be at that one.
I’m more interested in home theater right now as my 2 channel system as a whole has reached perfection. Of course i’m Retired and have different priorities. I see no need to spend tens of thousands of dollars now on my stereo system...in fact I view my system as the “anti high end” system....but I think most have figured that out. Will I get my phono rig going again? Yes...but that’s it. YMMV
AXPONA is way better than RMAF. AXPONA has reminded me of the best that CES offered in its day. Lots of crowded people in a nice venue. RMAF does not compare and new venue will not make a difference in my opinion.
Hi-end audio died a long time ago, because it does just the opposite of what your supposed to do to create a successful industry.
Hi-end is weird impractical products that few want at a price no sane person would ever pay, sell through a few stores that few can find, and fill it with snooty condescending salespeople. Make sure the stuff is unreliable and make sure the company goes out of business in just a few years. Now add a genius sprinkling of snake oil(cd demagnetizers) and you have a perfect receipt on how to destroy what was once a thriving industry.
Hi-end audio died a long time ago, because it does just the opposite of what your supposed to do to create a successful industry.
Hi-end is weird impractical products that few want at a price no sane person would ever pay, sell through a few stores that few can find, and fill it with snooty condescending salespeople. Make sure the stuff is unreliable and make sure the company goes out of business in just a few years. Now add a genius sprinkling of snake oil(cd demagnetizers) and you have a perfect receipt on how to destroy what was once a thriving industry.
Wasting your time and money, when a very tiny handful of audiophiles buy a tiny handful of audio gear through a tiny handful of audio stores, to me, you don't exist.The problem is audiophiles are such narcissistic arrogant a-holes they don't realize what a tiny insignificant universe they live in, I should know I use to be one of them, thank God I liberated myself from this disorder. And yes when you spend 4 digits on speaker cable you are a mental patient.
Hm. Speak for your self Kimosabe. I'm pretty sure I exist. Saw myself in the mirror just this morning.
All forms of endeavor have a high end segment whether its audio, watches, cameras, bicycles, leather jackets, you name it.
Another thing to understand is high end audio is not driven by price as most people think, its driven by intention.Like bicycles or cameras the art can be celebrated at any level- if you know what you're doing.
If getting as close to the music as you can does not appeal there's nothing wrong with that. But if one does like getting closer to the music it does not define them as any of the comments you've made.
High end audio has achieved a level of artisan craft that was unimaginable even 15 year ago, and I suppose it takes a lot of money to float all that craft. I have to admit it surprises me.
Nothing wrong with spending your money on nice craft objects if you have the money and that's what you enjoy. Audiophiles will argue about sound whether it's a transistor radio or a full blown edifice system in the Taj Mahal.
As far as audiophile communism and issues of financial fairness/unfairness are concerned, that is probably a topic for a different blog.
The problem is audiophiles are such narcissistic arrogant a-holes they don't realize what a tiny insignificant universe they live in, I should know I use to be one of them, thank God I liberated myself from this disorder.
...so you post on an audio site (named What's Best BTW) where people enjoy exchanging ideas and info about their hobby and you inform them they're arrogant a-holes? What does that make you? Our savior?
And what kind of arrogance does that post take? Too bad you haven't yet liberated yourself from the quite obvious self-righteous know-it-all attitude that appears to have stimulated your post. Thanks for looking out for us! <= that's sarcasm in case it wasn't clear.
