The origin of arts according to Harvard

opus111 · Jul 18, 2012

Phelonious Ponk said:
It is a goofy puzzle reduced to goofier semantics.

...is another wrong answer then.

Phelonious Ponk · Jul 18, 2012

Have it your way, opus. If a tree falls in the forest is a deep philosophical question about human perception and the nature of reality. Pondering it will lead to a firm grasp of Truth because there is a right and, evidently, at least a couple of wrong answers. Enjoy.

Tim

NorthStar · Jul 18, 2012

--- Thy who can 'feel' the Earth's rotation and with all the world's vibrations is becoming closer to man's awereness and understanding. And only then he can fine-tune his environment in a balanced and harmonious tomorrow.

Let the rivers run clean and pure so that our future children can enjoy fishing in them.

Who said that?

FrantzM · Jul 18, 2012

At tims some postions taken by some members of this WBF are startling. I had thought that the anthropocentric view of the universe was so passse. Now it seems that we have come full circle and a sound don't seem to exist if no one is there to hear it ... Do we need to go there ... The existence ofthe Universe has to nothing to do with our ability to ponder it .. We are now seeing phenomenon that occurred when we were just trying to go upright (well this also may be attacked but hety!!) Some Stars whose light we are receiving may not even exist anymore .. Does anyone honestly believe that we have to be there for these to exist? That only our presence (and or observation) determine the existence or occurrence of a a phenomenon? Really? Really ????
Haven't read the article yet .. I will later, for now .. I find these positions childish and no matter how thick the veneer of language and innuendo one manages to put on these, they remain insincere shots at logic and they do fail as they should ...

Oh and before I forget If a tree falls in a Forrest it still makes noise that we be there to perceive the noise or not ...

NorthStar · Jul 18, 2012

---Perhaps we should read more, listen more, and talk less ... :b

"Talk is Cheap." - Keith Richards

opus111 · Jul 18, 2012

Phelonious Ponk said:
Have it your way, opus.

Ironically I was just going on what you'd said.

Phelonious Ponk · Jul 19, 2012

opus111 said:
Ironically I was just going on what you'd said.

Have it my way, then.

Tim

microstrip · Jul 19, 2012

FrantzM said:
(...) Oh and before I forget If a tree falls in a Forrest it still makes noise that we be there to perceive the noise or not ...

Frantz,

Ignoring the philosophical issues, the main objective question is not the nature of physical vibration, but the definition of sound and its relation to perception ...
BTW, the subject is not childish - the sentence comes form the book Physics by Charles Riborg Mann and George Ransom Twiss, and was debated in many scientific publications.

Gregadd · Jul 19, 2012

There is no right answer here.

Agreed Tim. It's a Rorschack test. Whatever you see is correct.

FrantzM · Jul 19, 2012

microstrip said:
Frantz,

Ignoring the philosophical issues, the main objective question is not the nature of physical vibration, but the definition of sound and its relation to perception ...
BTW, the subject is not childish - the sentence comes form the book Physics by Charles Riborg Mann and George Ransom Twiss, and was debated in many scientific publications.

It is a take of the anthropocentric view of the world. There was a strong Anthropocentric movement in philosophy at the beginning of the last century in Science .. Of course it din't last. although its tenets are ofen resurrected by some anti-environmentalist and indeed environmentalist factions. While some serious philosophers , one of the most famous being John Passmore have debated the issue, it is to me akin to the question of how many angels can dance on a pin ... In other words wasting good amount of intellectual energy (if such thing exist

). The absence of observation cannot negate the existence of a phenomenon this to me is a given: that I wasn't there during the WW2 doesn't mean it never happened. Tree falls ... there is noise (ok call it a sound) and you may not be there to hear it but it did disturb other things ... Now as for the nature of noise .. Rap is music to me and Noise to many of my friends and likely to many here on the WBF .. Point of view , opinions on what constitute arts or "music" debatable but hardly something one could come with a factual argumentation...

JasonI · Jul 19, 2012

Let's get pedantic and call the result a mechanical pressurization of matter in the immediate vicinity.

microstrip · Jul 19, 2012

FrantzM said:
It is a take of the anthropocentric view of the world. There was a strong Anthropocentric movement in philosophy at the beginning of the last century in Science .. Of course it din't last. although its tenets are ofen resurrected by some anti-environmentalist and indeed environmentalist factions. While some serious philosophers , one of the most famous being John Passmore have debated the issue, it is to me akin to the question of how many angels can dance on a pin ... In other words wasting good amount of intellectual energy (if such thing exist ). The absence of observation cannot negate the existence of a phenomenon this to me is a given: that I wasn't there during the WW2 doesn't mean it never happened. Tree falls ... there is noise (ok call it a sound) and you may not be there to hear it but it did disturb other things ... Now as for the nature of noise .. Rap is music to me and Noise to many of my friends and likely to many here on the WBF .. Point of view , opinions on what constitute arts or "music" debatable but hardly something one could come with a factual argumentation...

Exactly - this definition of sound is anthropocentric (love the word, much more serious SOUNDING than Galileo Galilei heliocentric) and it why it is valuable for audio. Any one having watched ET knows his sound priorities were different.

opus111 · Jul 19, 2012

Phelonious Ponk said:
Have it my way, then.

But that 'way' turned out not to be a way at all - it was contradiction.

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