No, it's not the same one, Amir measured the Bifrost i think. JA published measurements on the Yggdrasil in Stereophile which made it seem that it didn't perform well. I was worried, and already wanted to shoot Schiit an email to ask what's up with that. But then I read on some sites arguments why JA's measurements are no good -- on technical grounds. Others have also measured the DAC and found it superb on the test bench. After having discovered all this I decided on "never mind" -- not worth getting into this whole debate or paying further attention to. I also decided that I would judge the unit purely by its sonics. I'll get more into details once the unit is fully burned in and I have performed extensive comparisons with the Berkeley DAC. But so far so good. The DAC has both finesse and balls, and is very natural sounding to my ears.
High end Munich 2017
- Thread starter flyer
- Start date
No, it's not the same one, Amir measured the Bifrost i think. JA published measurements on the Yggdrasil in Stereophile which made it seem that it didn't perform well. I was worried, and already wanted to shoot Schiit an email to ask what's up with that. But then I read on some sites arguments why JA's measurements are no good -- on technical grounds. Others have also measured the DAC and found it superb on the test bench. After having discovered all this I decided on "never mind" -- not worth getting into this whole debate or paying further attention to. I also decided that I would judge the unit purely by its sonics. I'll get more into details once the unit is fully burned in and I have performed extensive comparisons with the Berkeley DAC. But so far so good. The DAC has both finesse and balls, and is very natural sounding to my ears.
Did anyone else see one of the several half-hour long "performances" of Chris Feickert in the conference center where he just DJ'ed his favorit records for 30 mins? For me that was definetely amongst the "best of show" experiences, not only because the sound coming from the new ME Geithain ML811K1 was superb but also because of the sheer fun factor. 
Was there saturday and sunday, some of my favorite rooms were : the Aries Cerat room, Ypsilon/Wilson Benesch room, Engström/Totaldac/Martens room and the Silbatone/WE room.
The TAD room was pretty good too, unfortunately CH Precision was not what i expected even with the big Goebel speakers.
I also auditioned a certain number of headphones and the ones i liked best were the Final Audio Design Sonorous Vlll and X.
The TAD room was pretty good too, unfortunately CH Precision was not what i expected even with the big Goebel speakers.
I also auditioned a certain number of headphones and the ones i liked best were the Final Audio Design Sonorous Vlll and X.
It was great meeting you over lunch. I hope that you had a safe trip back to the South of France.
I own my apogee caliper signature from 1990/1991 and have had no problems at all. All is original. I am going to get them overhauled but apogee was very well built. As for all panels they are not exposed to sun in my room.
I own my apogee caliper signature since 1990 1991. I have had no problem at all. All is original. I am going to get them overhauled in a near future. Apogee are very well built . As for all panels they are not exposed to sun in my room
Hi are you referring to the WE room, where they had the VDH on the Schick plinthed-Commonwealth 12 turntable was playing. They let me AB my Betthoven's Emperor on that vs the small TT schroeder had put together with the Schroder arm and the Tzar DST (copy of the Neumann DST). In that set up I preferred the schick VDH combo
On Thoeress, he let me play with changing his curves on my vinyl. By using the filters on the phono, you can not only change the brightness, but also make the soundstage come forward or go more to the back
I preferred the Soundsmith Hyperion on the VPI arm to the Soundsmith Strainguage on the Schroeder arm.
I heard the Etna on the Doehmann with the Ypsilon Benesch and another Etna on the Transrotor. There was also a Kleos on a smaller Doehmann with Thrax Audio.
In the WE room on the Caeles they had the Art 1000, which I did not get to hear but they liked. The Viva masterhorn room also had the Art 1000 on the Vertere which I did get to hear.
SME had the Ortofon A95. The owner of SME is also the owner of Audio Lounge here in central London, a shop where he also deals in YG, Nagra, and Burmester, and the SME room was with YG Sonja and Nagra. Don't think Nagra has the drive for YG. I have heard the SME sounding way better with the YG Hailey in his shop (more space too) with the Burmester, because of the greater drive (not that I like Burm tone over Nagra).
Last edited:
IMHO only if you can not understand how good can sound SOTA high end or can't or don´t want to afford them!
Surely some equipment is overpriced and does not deliver performance to cost, but knowledgeable audiophiles know what they pick.
Audio is not an efficient market that all have all information and there is no liquid demand and supply for price discovery, so price will not reflect quality. After a certain point if one can pay up he should do so for customization, not for any off the shelf brand.
Did anyone else see one of the several half-hour long "performances" of Chris Feickert in the conference center where he just DJ'ed his favorit records for 30 mins? For me that was definetely amongst the "best of show" experiences, not only because the sound coming from the new ME Geithain ML811K1 was superb but also because of the sheer fun factor.
No, I missed that. I like Chris and am happy he is doing well with the TT business.
Hi Gian,
Well for sure trying at home is far better than unfamiliar systems in unfamiliar places. As to CH, I have heard it about ten times in various configurations with different speakers, rooms etc. I have not tried them at home. I am not sure how that gear would gell with horns. From what I have heard so far I can say that it doesn't seem to put a foot down wrongly but what I call the "breath of life" seems to be sadly absent. I would have thought at least one combination I have heard with this gear would do that, show conditions or not, but so far it hasn't even ticked up an interest where I say to myself, "I need to check tne.his out more closely". That in fact did happen to me last year with the Wilson Alexia and Nagra system. I had heard the Alexia at least 6 or 7 times at shows and dealer demos with big tubes and big transistors and it never sounded interesting. Then last year with the very compact Nagra gear (also the Classic amps were compact) it sounded simply great! This year, Wilson used their new Alex and Nagra the new HD amps and the magic was largely gone. Not clear why but I sat down and felt...nothing...then I left shortly after. So far every CH demo has left me feeling...nothing. If that is what happens then it is not the kind of perfection I seek.
You have heard the P1 compared to other very good but significantly cheaper phonostages? For me that is the only way to tell if it is worth the money or not.
I did not Poo poo Spectral...I poo pooed Magico + Spectral at this show. And believe me I was right to do so. It was dead, dead dead sounding.
Spectral used to be one of the more expensive SS amp brands out there. They got passed up by other companies in the luxury pricing wars. If you think they are a bargain for the sound they are delivering that is your perrogative...I would say they are only a bit better value than the other crap that is WAY overpriced.
Its rather sad that we have come to the point of pointing to a company with a tongue firmly in cheek name as the budget leader. The real question to me is whether or not the Yggy is better than a $1K ladder dac from 20 years ago...I suspect it is not or only marginally so. I would put my Monarchy DAC up against it (with BB PCM63s...the all-time favorite of Moffat or so he says) and I bought it factory direct and brand new for $1K. Maybe it rocks as hard as you say...only one way to know for sure...
Yes, but this motor will still have cogging issues as it is not a coreless design. Kind of disappointing on an extreme priced TT. The motor that the Continuum Caliburn used was a really good motor without cogging and torque ripple. This one from TecDas will not be capable of that based on the fact it has 12 poles...that means inherently cannot be cog free and have uniform torque ripple.
The new Primary Control Kinea DD tt uses a low/variable torque coreless motor to avoid cogging issues
I had a discussion with the designer of the Caliburn a few years ago and he said that the motor + controller cost them $8K alone! That is a serious motor! Look at the solutions that the Japanese came up with in the 80s and you see where the money went.
Using modern DSP techniques a 12 pole motor can be cog free and have uniform torque ripple. If you use the computer power of DSP and knowledge you can create an uniform drive.
Anyway IMHO these arguments are meaningless in terms of sound quality. Analog fans consider that reel to reel is the best sound source. In the best professional a tape machines the tape capstan is direct or belt driven by a cored motor with a classic servo mechanism to keep speed and no one complains about the cogging and torque ripple.
This probably deserves its own thread, but it's definitely one of the things pushing me away from high-end audio and making it easier to get out of the game. This might sound like sour grapes and jealousy, because in many ways that's what it is, but the brazenness of the pricing is starting to annoy me. I'm earning decent money, well above the national average here and all that, but it's clear that the high end is no longer interested in me. OK, neither are yacht-builders and Ferrari dealerships and lots of other things, but to see aspirational gear stretching further and further away as I get older and supposedly wealthier is somewhat annoying.
I'm also of the opinion that as the gap between mid and high-end audio has widened in money terms, the sonic gap has narrowed. But maybe I just tell myself that to feel better.
All that said, I'm not missing Munich again next year.
Similar threads
Staff online
-
treitz3Super Moderator
Members online
- Mobiusman
- andromedaaudio
- VPN
- Rooneydog
- seatrope
- aLLeARS
- Mike Lavigne
- Hilroy48
- Geoffkait
- Pichler
- treitz3
- trekpilot
- Labpro
- fbs
- kmyl
- jadis
- dan31
- flowcharts
- willgall
- Achilles
- TST
- mikem
- mtemur
- Gregadd
- DonH50
- J007B
- kswanson27
- GSOphile
- 108CY
- matthias
- Audio Addict
- Atmasphere
- Mark212121
- MPW
- helmut
- Kingsrule
- speakerlust
- ticktock
- tsaett
- Juiced
- nirodha
- Sablon Audio
- sbnx
- Audio Quack
- Bonesy Jonesy
- RCanelas
- haveaseatandlisten
- bonzo75
- defride
- dminches
 | Steve Williams Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator |  | Ron Resnick Site Co-Owner | Administrator |  | Julian (The Fixer) Website Build | Marketing Managersing |