installing 7 Furutech GTX-D NFC (R) outlets this morning

Joe Pittman

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Sep 14, 2010
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Peter, it's good to have fewer "links in the chain", however, each link then becomes more significant. I can't speak for Mike, but all of the NCF outlets and plugs improved every parameter in my reference system. The impact/improvement of a single FI-50 NCF IEC in your simplified power system could be good.

I should note that I like your simplified power wiring approach but I don't think that it would meet NEC requirements or pass inspection. So others interested in doing this, should be careful to implement it.
 

Joe Whip

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Feb 8, 2014
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Pass inspection it would not. There is no way I would ever consider doing it although I have known some who have.
 

Ron Resnick

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Jan 24, 2015
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I have 11 of the GTX-D (R) (9 now) as I found the top end too bright. I replaced the two powering my amps to the Gold version and it is quite noticeable. In fact Ron Resnick a member here has visited on several occasions. On his last visit he asked me if I had changed the tweeters on my speaker to the soft dome as in the Wilson XLF. When I told him that all I had done was change the 2 AC outlets to the Gold version. He was quite surprised because he noticed a change right away

This is very true!
 

spazmatron

Banned
Dec 4, 2015
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Wel I have bought the NCF outlets to fit in my mains conditioner, along with FI 50 NCF IEC and us plug end for the power cable I use for my pre amp.. And 5 FI 06 NFC ICE inlets for the inputs on all my amps pre and cdp plus mains conditioner. When they come and I fit them I will share thoughts, will be replacing top oyaide so will be interesting. On the cable side of things Only doing my mains cable on the pre to start with, will do the other mains cables if I get a successful result.
 

Mike Lavigne

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Apr 25, 2010
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800 pound Gorilla---the plugs on the amps

I was pretty stressed. and concerned.

I had some friends traveling from out of town, listening and staying overnight Friday night, then listening Saturday morning and then leaving. I'd made a number of significant positive changes and the visit was to hear those.

on last Sunday morning my drug dealer/audio dealer Joe Pittman had installed 7 sets of the new FI-50 NCP male and IEC plugs on all my power cords except on the dart monos. my previous comments about that and my rave on it's affect noted that we had not yet done the amp power cables and I considered that the 800 pound Gorilla still in the room. I had not done the amp power cables since I thought I should send them back to Evolution to have them done; but after further consideration I decided to have Joe do those too. I wanted to hear what they would do. I was sure it would be epic.

so Monday Joe ordered the additional plugs; they arrived Thursday and he came over Thursday evening to install them. the install took some time but went smoothly and by 9pm we started listening. typical professional job by Joe. note that the next night my friends would arrive.

lots of additional detail. but there was a tonal imbalance. it was bright. the mid range was missing. those amps are so transparent. the new plugs were doing things. we listened for an hour or so, they did start to get a bit smoother. I was worried. 24 hours to solve. I was skeptical that break in would fix it. I listened until midnight; then pulled out my Audiokharma Cable Cooker and power cable interface and got that going.

overnight did not sleep much as this was bugging me. then it came to me.....hey.....I can adjust the bass tower crossover. in the morning I got up and listened. a little better, but no where close to balanced. so I proceeded to adjust the bass tower crossover from 32 hz, to 34, to 36, finally 39 seemed just right. relief. it was going to be fine. no doubt when they were fully broken in I'd need to re-tweak but the magical mid range had returned along with the additional transparency and detail from the plugs.

I put the cables back on the Audiokharma and went to work.

got home a little before my friends arrived and reinstalled the cables.....better after the 12 more hours on the cable cooker.

my friends did arrive and we had 2 great listening sessions that night and in the morning. lots of smiles and raves. a good time had by all. they left yesterday at 11:30am. i never spent a minute in the sweet spot while my friends were there.

i had to work then and when i got home last night i tried to listen but was exhausted and so fell asleep.

so this morning i was finally able to see what happened and enjoy it.

I'm blown away by this final step. I'd heard raves all weekend but as they had not heard the progression of other things I'd done it was hard for me to judge this last step. but this is a big deal.

the amps love those plugs.
 
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spazmatron

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Dec 4, 2015
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Sleepless nights worrying about some fine detail of your hifi... I feel your pain :D

Glad your enjoying it now or at least have managed to convince your self it's ok. Either way I hope you sleep better tonight.
 

Mike Lavigne

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Glad your enjoying it now or at least have managed to convince your self it's ok.

the 7-8 hours of listening with my very experienced and naturally critical friends had already convinced me the tonal balance was just fine.

but the degree of step up from the previous changes was what I was curious about.
 

spazmatron

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Dec 4, 2015
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the 7-8 hours of listening with my very experienced and naturally critical friends had already convinced me the tonal balance was just fine.

but the degree of step up from the previous changes was what I was curious about.
I know what it's like to get thrown off kilter, of course it's trivial in real terms but if your nutty about your hifi then it can get bit stressful . Waiting for my plugs and sockets... Thanks for your input, nice to hear you into things like you are. Maybe we can get amir to test these plugs out measurement wise ;)
 

c1ferrari

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May 15, 2010
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Just installed custom Furutech IC's and speaker cables last night -- good stuff! :cool:
Retired this morning, circa 4 a.m. :)
Now, to listen to some new tapes
. :D
 

marty

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Apr 20, 2010
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I have 11 of the GTX-D (R) (9 now) as I found the top end too bright. I replaced the two powering my amps to the Gold version and it is quite noticeable. In fact Ron Resnick a member here has visited on several occasions. On his last visit he asked me if I had changed the tweeters on my speaker to the soft dome as in the Wilson XLF. When I told him that all I had done was change the 2 AC outlets to the Gold version. He was quite surprised because he noticed a change right away

Gee Steve, I wonder where you got that idea :)
I would caution anyone to do some simple experimenting with a single Furutech outlet before committing to multiple rhodium plated outlets over gold plated. I had all GTX-D Rhodiums and got rid of them last year in favor of the gold version because the rhodium outlets were just way to colored, unnatural and bright for my taste. Gold was far more natural sounding. I don't think its a matter of being colored. Everything is colored. Rather, I think its matter of what flavor suits a particular system best.
 
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Mike Lavigne

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Gee Steve, I wonder where you got that idea :)
I would caution anyone to do some simple experimenting with a single Furutech outlet before committing rhodium plated outlets over gold plated. I had all GTX-D Rhodiums and got rid of them last year in favor of the gold version because the rhodium outlets were just way to colored, unnatural and bright for my taste. Gold was far more natural sounding. I don;t htink its a matter of being colored. Everything is colored. Rather, I think its matter of what flavor suits a particular system best.

another way to look at it is that some systems allow tuning and others do not. if your speakers do not have any adjustments then yes; you have to find products which compliment the particular balance of your gear. and the other thing is break in; you need to allow for that before one judges the resulting balance.

in Steve's case he likely has resistors in the X-2's which would allow for the use of the Rhodium outlets. and the question is whether the different resistor + Rhodium performance might surpass the current resistor + Gold. in theory the Rhodium is more transparent and therefore has the higher upside.

but one needs to be cautious not to avoid the most transparent product possible when it tells you truth you don't want to hear. the answer is not always the most obvious choice.

when I wrote the above post I knew we would end up discussing just this issue. my comments are not to infer any ultimate truth or 'one' approach, only to stimulate consideration of the whole picture.

my approach has always been to have every component as neutral as possible to avoid balancing one information covering coloration with another. that can stifle musical flow.
 

marty

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Mike,

I grew up in the jewelry business and for many summers worked in my Dad’s plant where I did various jobs, including a lot of rhodium plating. My understand of why rhodium is used over silver and white gold, is due to its non-corrosive properties which makes it highly impervious to oxidation. However, in audio, I’m not sure I understand the benefits as easily. If we assume that one principle for audio signal transfer is to minimize resistance so as to enhance signal conductivity, everybody knows that silver is the king of the metals in this regard. However, it’s susceptibility to oxidation is often considered a detriment to its use in audio wires. Copper is a very good conductor and aside from being a very malleable metal, is often coated to protect it from oxidation (copper oxide is a horrible conductor). However, when plated, it is a quite acceptable material for contact surfaces. Gold is also a superb conductor and offers outstanding oxidation resistance.

Rhodium on the other hand is a metal whose rationale in audio escapes me. Rhodium is a precious metal from the platinum family. It is hard, acid-resistant, and has a very high melting point (1964°C). Compared to other platinum metals, it is a very good conductor, but still only half as good as gold and just one third as good as silver. Therefore, it is misplaced as a coating in a domestic environment. Its sound characteristics are often described as harsh and analytic. It does however have its justification in industrial environments with high temperatures, for instance near blast furnaces, where it reliably does its job at temperatures where gold would already start to melt (which it does at 1064°C).

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Despite these traits, I too thought that if companies like Furutech thought enough of rhodium to start plating their receptacles and contacts with it (and charge more for it!) then what the hell, I might as well try them. Any audiophile knows that data is data but the correlation with sonics often has nothing to do with technical performance, electrical or otherwise. So I did. When I built my home 3 years ago, I inserted all rhodium GTX-D Rhodium outlets in the music room. As many know, the room and the gear was virtually identical to my last home in Dallas which had good old copper plated hospital grade outlets, yet something just wasn’t well, “right”. It wasn’t until after someone I respect clued me in that my problem might be the rhodium plated outlets, that I started exploring that hypothesis. My first swap was on the amp outlets (because they were the easiest to install) and I was stunned at the effect of switching to the Furutech gold version of the same. The other outlets for the front end followed despite requiring the contortions worthy of Houdini to change them, but in the end, I have not looked back. I agree with you, it’s all about tuning and that is certainly system specific. Since these are relatively inexpensive changes that can have considerable effect, I would encourage anyone who wants to explore this to go slow and make one or two outlet changes first to see if one of these outlet materials is your particular cup of tea.

Marty
 

ack

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The problem with Rhodium is much higher resistance than other metals, as you show; but in these applications, the effect should be negligible because the layer is so thin. The problem with gold plating is that it typically needs a barrier metal. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_plating for a primer, and notice the following:

Gold plating is often used in electronics, to provide a corrosion-resistant electrically conductive layer on copper, typically in electrical connectors and printed circuit boards.

With direct gold-on-copper plating, the copper atoms tend to diffuse through the gold layer, causing tarnishing of its surface and formation of an oxide and/or sulphide layer.

A layer of a suitable barrier metal, usually nickel, is often deposited on the copper substrate before the gold plating. The layer of nickel provides mechanical backing for the gold layer, improving its wear resistance. It also reduces the impact of pores present in the gold layer.

At higher frequencies, the skin effect may cause higher losses due to higher electrical resistance of nickel; a nickel-plated trace can have its useful length shortened three times in the 1 GHz band in comparison with the non-plated one. Selective plating is used, depositing the nickel and gold layers only on areas where it is required and does not cause the detrimental side effects

So don't look at just the visible plating metals only, but everything that's involved in plating with each one. The other problem with direct gold-on-copper plating is that it's not a strong bond, and it tends to peel off (we see that in some RCA jacks, after much use); and finally, sparks when plugging and unplugging high-current components may melt the gold.
 

Mike Lavigne

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I'm agnostic about these metal coatings. to me it's about what works best. Rhodium works just perfect for me. gold might too.....but I've not tried it. I am able to adjust the tonal balance of my speakers to accommodate either.

I appreciate what you are saying Marty. I have no metallurgy background to have any opinion. I have a bit of an opinion on cable metallurgy based on my experience; I mostly like pure copper. in phono cables I like silver.
 

Speedskater

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Gold plating when done correctly is excellent for low voltage, low current contacts and connectors but it's not robust enough for high current connectors.
 

Folsom

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Gold plating when done correctly is excellent for low voltage, low current contacts and connectors but it's not robust enough for high current connectors.

Yup. That's why bus bar is often nickle plated for industrial stuff.
 

adyc

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The AC frequency is too low which skin effect is negligible. Gold plated with nickel backing is fine when used in AC plug.
 

ack

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The AC frequency is too low which skin effect is negligible.

Correct. However, high frequency noise may be at play here, so I was indirectly pointing out potentially high frequency noise in the line which might be getting attenuated by the gold version, thus having a more beneficial audible effect in some systems, depending on how they deal with such noise.
 

thedudeabides

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Sleepless nights worrying about some fine detail of your hifi... I feel your pain :D

Interesting stuff. One comment.

With all due respect, I thought audio was a hobby meant to enjoy music (and not listen to the gear) and supposed to be "fun" and not a source of stress.

FWIW, I bought one of Joe's used Furutech outlets for giggles and will be "curious" as to the impact.
 

spazmatron

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Dec 4, 2015
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Interesting stuff. One comment.

With all due respect, I thought audio was a hobby meant to enjoy music (and not listen to the gear) and supposed to be "fun" and not a source of stress.

FWIW, I bought one of Joe's used Furutech outlets for giggles and will be "curious" as to the impact.

well it is possible to be more than one thing...also its possible to empathise, well for me any way.

i am sure the furutech outlet won't ruin your music,the audiophile and music lover are not mutually exclusive. however if somehow installing it goes wrong and your amps melt, feel free to get a bit stressed, it won't mean you love music any less.
 

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