Magico introduced the Q series subwoofers

LL21 · Oct 1, 2013

microstrip said:
I often see people referring to the Q7, but forgetting the Q5. Wouldn't the Q5 with a few subs be in the same level as the Q7? Is there any significant difference in the performance of the tweeters and medium units of these speakers?

Although the efficiency is very different, it does not seem to be a main reason - most people also refer to using very powerful amplifiers with the Q7.

Hi Micro,

The main reason (for me) is that I have heard the Q1-Q5, and simply wanted to hear the Q7 to see what the hype is about. Additionally, I have found with certain speaker lines that the bigger models do actually present a bigger, fuller more real-scale treble and mid presentation. The Genesis and Arrakis have certainly taught me a lot about what a big speaker can do in the mids that I have never heard any other speaker do before.

So when Frantz suggested that for some reason the Q7 projects much bigger despite not having the big woofer on the top, etc...I became intrigued. That, plus Stereo's absolute commitment to Magico along with several discussions with reviewers has at least made me curious to hear for myself.

Then, taking that to the next level with a QSub seems a natural extension. Ultimately, do I 'fall back' to Q5 plus sub? Only if the Q5 can equal the mid-range and treble scale of an Arrakis...I am already questioning whether a Q7 can do so.

stereo · Oct 1, 2013

microstrip said:
I often see people referring to the Q7, but forgetting the Q5. Wouldn't the Q5 with a few subs be in the same level as the Q7? Is there any significant difference in the performance of the tweeters and medium units of these speakers?

Although the efficiency is very different, it does not seem to be a main reason - most people also refer to using very powerful amplifiers with the Q7.

Answer is no, it would never be at same level. Q7 is significantly better than Q5 across the full frequency range. Much more dynamic- and of course the 8-10dB sensitivity difference helps.....
More transparent. It uses completely different drivers, custom designed for the Q7. There is a huge gap on sound quality between a Q7 and all the other Q, as you can expect from price difference.
I don't think Q7 needs a very powerful amp. Like all good speakers, it needs an amp with headroom, but you don't need watts.

LL21 · Oct 2, 2013

stereo said:
Answer is no, it would never be at same level. Q7 is significantly better than Q5 across the full frequency range. Much more dynamic- and of course the 8-10dB sensitivity difference helps.....
More transparent. It uses completely different drivers, custom designed for the Q7. There is a huge gap on sound quality between a Q7 and all the other Q, as you can expect from price difference.
I don't think Q7 needs a very powerful amp. Like all good speakers, it needs an amp with headroom, but you don't need watts.

Good to know...in fact, now that you put it this way, it reminds me I have heard the Q5 is a beast to drive, whereas comparatively speaking, the Q7 is actually a more manageable load. I have spoken with people who absolutely loved the Q7s (one of their 'all time favourite listening experiences') being driven by Zanden 9600 tube monos.

stereo · Oct 6, 2013

Computer audiophile wrote a quick review of the Qsub18 at Cedia:
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/542-cedia-expo-2013/
"Magico introduced its QSub-18 subwoofer. Weighing 570 pounds the QSub-18 is a monster. This subwoofer has 8,000W of power and two 18" woofers. The monstrous enclosure features two inch thick aluminum similar to the thinner Q series of loudspeakers. The QSub-18 retails for $36,000. I listened to both movies and concert Blu-ray performances through the Magico / Constellation Audio system. No matter what audio was sent through this system the bass produced by the QSub-18s (two of them in the room) was like nothing I'v ever heard. I've never heard bass so clear yet so deep. There was no annoying deep rumble during explosions while watching movies. Rather the bass was incredibly controlled while it shook my clothing with displaced air. Keep in mind that this sub, like all Magico products, features a sealed enclosure. While watching Chris Botti and Katharine McPHee perform I've Got You Under My Skin the QSub-18 subwoofers appropriately disappeared until needed. The experience of hearing a QSub was unlike anything I've heard and I highly recommend Computer Audiophile readers seek out an opportunity to hear this controlled monster. "

Roysen · Oct 6, 2013

Stereo,

Are you seriously considering these subs? I am! I hope to share information and experiance with you.

LL21 · Oct 6, 2013

stereo said:
Computer audiophile wrote a quick review of the Qsub18 at Cedia:
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/542-cedia-expo-2013/
"Magico introduced its QSub-18 subwoofer. Weighing 570 pounds the QSub-18 is a monster. This subwoofer has 8,000W of power and two 18" woofers. The monstrous enclosure features two inch thick aluminum similar to the thinner Q series of loudspeakers. The QSub-18 retails for $36,000. I listened to both movies and concert Blu-ray performances through the Magico / Constellation Audio system. No matter what audio was sent through this system the bass produced by the QSub-18s (two of them in the room) was like nothing I'v ever heard. I've never heard bass so clear yet so deep. There was no annoying deep rumble during explosions while watching movies. Rather the bass was incredibly controlled while it shook my clothing with displaced air. Keep in mind that this sub, like all Magico products, features a sealed enclosure. While watching Chris Botti and Katharine McPHee perform I've Got You Under My Skin the QSub-18 subwoofers appropriately disappeared until needed. The experience of hearing a QSub was unlike anything I've heard and I highly recommend Computer Audiophile readers seek out an opportunity to hear this controlled monster. "

I GOTTA hear these...bass really matters to me. But I have not got the room for multiple-sub setup.

LL21 · Oct 6, 2013

Roysen said:
Stereo,

Are you seriously considering these subs? I am! I hope to share information and experiance with you.

Roy - definitely please let us know what you think. I have long had the old Krell Master Ref Sub on my list as part of the 'final' system.

Roysen · Oct 6, 2013

Lloyd,

A friend of mine owns a Krell Master Reference Subwoofer. Maybe I can try it. It is for sale. My local distributor has ordered a Magico QSub-18. Maybe I can do a comparison.

LL21 · Oct 6, 2013

Roysen said:
Lloyd,

A friend of mine owns a Krell Master Reference Subwoofer. Maybe I can try it. It is for sale. My local distributor has ordered a Magico QSub-18. Maybe I can do a comparison.

Interestingly...the description of the QSub 15" and the Krell MR Sub are very very similar. Both dual 15" cones in a solid aluminium billet casing upwards of 1"-2" thick depending on where you measure, with a massive few-thousand watt amp and both suggest 1% distortion at 120db at 20hz. I think the Krell weighs more maybe? Or are both are 185kg/400+lbs?
The Krell apparently has lots and lots of crossover options built in...not sure about Q Sub. Again, would absolutely love to try...I know from my own experiments how big a difference (to me) clean clean superpowerful effortless bass can make...even when the sub is only operating below 41hz.

stereo · Oct 15, 2013

A few more facts on why I doubt I would need a sub to complement the two 15"of my Ultimate.
The 27 SMT Varitune Helmholtz resonators I use in my room are working like modal distributors: they are not killing room nodes, they change phase of selected frequency bands to give an even frequency response in the whole room, but energy is preserved. Without such a treatment, the only solution is to use several subs in different positions in the room to smooth the frequency response and to compensate for the big dips at room mode frequency.

In my case, frequency response barely change across the whole room. See below the sonar response at sweet spot and in the corner behind the sub: it barely changes!

- sweet spot:

- corner behind sub:

spiritofmusic · Oct 15, 2013

Stereo, I think you have it covered. We're all getting a vicarious thrill fantasising about the possibilities thru you! Personally I'm running the equivalent of 2 x 12" powered subs with room correction in a 27' x 22' x 13' space, and this is sufficient. I can't imagine what your Ultimates' 2 x 15" or QSubs 2 - 4 x 15' - 18" would do to my mental health

!
Re your ongoing SOTA quest for setup with 5 DACs etc, have you come across Trinity? The designer Dietmar's stuff, incl preamps, phono stages and soon to be released power amps seem to be a new contender for absolute SOTA. In the Far East, they are falling over each other to buy his DACs esp, one customer at least ditching his 4 box DCS Vivaldi for the Trinity DAC. Check out the Audio Exotics forum board for more info, incl lots of replies by the designer. He seems the real deal, and I feel for the "ultimate" set up you should consider Trinity along with the other usual suspects.

microstrip · Oct 15, 2013

stereo said:
A few more facts on why I doubt I would need a sub to complement the two 15"of my Ultimate.
The 27 SMT Varitune Helmholtz resonators I use in my room are working like modal distributors: they are not killing room nodes, they change phase of selected frequency bands to give an even frequency response in the whole room, but energy is preserved. Without such a treatment, the only solution is to use several subs in different positions in the room to smooth the frequency response and to compensate for the big dips at room mode frequency.

In my case, frequency response barely change across the whole room. See below the sonar response at sweet spot and in the corner behind the sub: it barely changes!

- sweet spot:

Stereo,

I am curious about the Varitunes - how do you adjust the frequency of absorption of these devices?

spiritofmusic · Oct 15, 2013

Sorry if I seem to repeating the obvious with Trinity stuff discussed elsewhere. As with all things uber expensive, there is a reasonable amount of skepticism, just was wondering if Trinity was on Stereo's radar.

Mctwins · Oct 15, 2013

stereo said:
A few more facts on why I doubt I would need a sub to complement the two 15"of my Ultimate.
The 27 SMT Varitune Helmholtz resonators I use in my room are working like modal distributors: they are not killing room nodes, they change phase of selected frequency bands to give an even frequency response in the whole room, but energy is preserved. Without such a treatment, the only solution is to use several subs in different positions in the room to smooth the frequency response and to compensate for the big dips at room mode frequency.

In my case, frequency response barely change across the whole room. See below the sonar response at sweet spot and in the corner behind the sub: it barely changes!

- sweet spot:
View attachment 12213

- corner behind sub:
View attachment 12214

Excellent!!!

As can be seen in the Burst Decay, there is no ringing(resonances), the pressure is even and preserved. If treated as in Stereo's room, you can put the speaker or listeningposition to your liking and still maintain a flat freq response in the room. The interference(SBIR) is a non issue in this kind of room.

stereo · Oct 15, 2013

microstrip said:
Stereo,

I am curious about the Varitunes - how do you adjust the frequency of absorption of these devices?

You tune the frequency by moving a sliding door which varies the opening area of the resonator

stereo · Oct 15, 2013

spiritofmusic said:
Sorry if I seem to repeating the obvious with Trinity stuff discussed elsewhere. As with all things uber expensive, there is a reasonable amount of skepticism, just was wondering if Trinity was on Stereo's radar.

No, I have never listened to the Trinity. Will try to find a dealer in the region

stereo · Oct 17, 2013

spiritofmusic said:
Sorry if I seem to repeating the obvious with Trinity stuff discussed elsewhere. As with all things uber expensive, there is a reasonable amount of skepticism, just was wondering if Trinity was on Stereo's radar.

If they are serious about being the new DAC reference, maybe they could start with avoiding copy-paste on their manuals (p7)....:
"To install the DAC, select a stable, level surface directly next to the turn table so that the connecting cable to the tone arm is as short as possible"
If after that somebody still says this DAC doesn't sound like analog

PS: it is not an option for me as it doesn't use a standard clock input.

LL21 · Oct 17, 2013

stereo said:
You tune the frequency by moving a sliding door which varies the opening area of the resonator

interesting...they seem to cover very lower frequencies (below 40hz)...how much does one of these cost, and is this something where you need to buy a roomful of them (like I have seen on their website)...or is this something where you can buy 1 or 2 to try to work on a specific area in the room with a bass node at 30hz?

spiritofmusic · Oct 17, 2013

Oo-er, something DEF lost in translation there! Copy checker asleep at the wheel. Or maybe the perfect intersection of digital and analog. Anyhow, a blind alley for you.

microstrip · Oct 17, 2013

LL21 said:
interesting...they seem to cover very lower frequencies (below 40hz)...how much does one of these cost, and is this something where you need to buy a roomful of them (like I have seen on their website)...or is this something where you can buy 1 or 2 to try to work on a specific area in the room with a bass node at 30hz?

Loyd,

I could find their price in Denmark at this site (remember the price is given in danish crowns)

http://high-performance.dk/product/268/48/Tilbehor/Akustikmoduler/smt-varitune-v6.html :

When dealing with such low frequencies you have typically to cover a significant area - I would consider that a minimum of 4 units will be needed to have a noticeable effect at 30 Hz. But it is only a guess. My tuned limp membrane bass traps tuned at 35 Hz cover an area of 2.2 square meters.

Magico introduced the Q series subwoofers

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