I said I would never buy another Turntable...Argh !!!

[rockitman]

I have received my proposals from Herzan for the custom rigid stand option(s)...32"x20" top plate/foot print dimension and the NDW-23A active workstation (23"x36").
If I went custom rigid rack and wanted to added the AVI units later, I would need to ship the rack back for retrofit...(not a good option). I am now leaning toward the NDW-23A....albeit there is a slight risk the TT will not sound better with active isolation. I think that possibility is remote. I plan to pull the trigger one way or another on Monday...as delivery may not be until late Nov, early Dec....

 

[rockitman]

Desk, computer workstation removed. This will be the general area the AS will be located....might need to add a third phonostage....

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I have received my proposals from Herzan for the custom rigid stand option(s)...32"x20" top plate/foot print dimension and the NDW-23A active workstation (23"x36").
If I went custom rigid rack and wanted to added the AVI units later, I would need to ship the rack back for retrofit...(not a good option). I am now leaning toward the NDW-23A....albeit there is a slight risk the TT will not sound better with active isolation. I think that possibility is remote. I plan to pull the trigger one way or another on Monday...as delivery may not be until late Nov, early Dec....

I heard back from Tim today too.

I suppose it's good to allow you to dip your toe first.....I'd be moving forward now if my AS was hitting sooner.

 

[rockitman]

I heard back from Tim today too.

I suppose it's good to allow you to dip your toe first.....I'd be moving forward now if my AS was hitting sooner.

I am 99% going NDW-23 and have a shelf added underneath for a phonostage....rack will be powder coated black.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I am 99% going NDW-23 and have a shelf added underneath for a phonostage....rack will be powder coated black.

it should look awesome in Black.

will the AVI cases also be powder coated black? or just the rack?

if you get a rendering of the shelf, i'd love to see it. i'm going back and forth now about the shelf. will your shelf be able to support a TS-150 plus a phono in terms of weight, solidity, and clearance? those are my concerns. I might just not have a shelf and do a rack/platform underneath. in my situation I do need to use that space for at least the AS controller and my dart pre (which has my 2 phono's), along with proper resonance control. and i'd like to have space for another box or two.

 

[rockitman]

it should look awesome in Black.

will the AVI cases also be powder coated black? or just the rack?

if you get a rendering of the shelf, i'd love to see it. i'm going back and forth now about the shelf. will your shelf be able to support a TS-150 plus a phono in terms of weight, solidity, and clearance? those are my concerns. I might just not have a shelf and do a rack/platform underneath. in my situation I do need to use that space for at least the AS controller and my dart pre (which has my 2 phono's), along with proper resonance control. and i'd like to have space for another box or two.

That I am unsure of. If not, I may just go Laboratory white to match the AVI units and the controller. Speaking of the standard controller...down to 1Hz...what about the LFS system that drops it another 1/2 Hz ? I asked if that makes a significant difference for microscopes...I am awaiting a response.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

That I am unsure of. If not, I may just go Laboratory white to match the AVI units and the controller. Speaking of the standard controller...down to 1Hz...what about the LFS system that drops it another 1/2 Hz ? I asked if that makes a significant difference for microscopes...I am awaiting a response.

i'm doing the Lab White and expect it to look elegant with all the machined stainless. it will be harder to blend the right look for a separate rack underneath with white.

Black would be cool too, just a different vibe.

my updated info is that the LFS unit is not a fit for our use, it only works in specific applications where the LFS unit is on the same surface as the AVI units. in this case, the LFS would sit on the floor, and the AVI units are on top of the rack. but not getting it saves you $5k.

 

[rockitman]

i'm doing the Lab White and expect it to look elegant with all the machined stainless. it will be harder to blend the right look for a separate rack underneath with white.

Black would be cool too, just a different vibe.

my updated info is that the LFS unit is not a fit for our use, it only works in specific applications where the LFS unit is on the same surface as the AVI units. in this case, the LFS would sit on the floor, and the AVI units are on top of the rack. but not getting it saves you $5k.

Cool. Lab White it is for me to and No LFS..Yeah !

I agree...will look great with that Foundry's worth of stainless sitting on top.

I do hope with motor controller and TT, that weight is under 600lbs....leaving 60lb buffer for max capacity of the NDW.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Cool. Lab White it is for me to and No LFS..Yeah !

I agree...will look great with that Foundry's worth of stainless sitting on top.

I do hope with motor controller and TT, that weight is under 600lbs....leaving 60lb buffer for max capacity of the NDW.

it's 440 pounds for the platter and plinth including 4 arm boards, and another 60 pounds for the motor and pulley case, so just over 500 pounds total. you have another 60 pound allowance for arms and cartridges.....tools, brushes, and single malt glasses.

your max capacity is 660, so you are still 80+ pounds under.

the variance of weight of the top panel can change your max, so that is a factor. I'm investigating options for that. I watched a youtube video for adjusting the level of the AVI units; very straight forward to do.

and i'm intending to hang the AVI controller box off the rear of the rack to allow for more height clearance for the shelf or rack. i'll want the rack away from the back wall anyway for access; so the back I think is the best spot for it.

 

[rockitman]

it's 440 pounds for the platter and plinth including 4 arm boards, and another 60 pounds for the motor and pulley case, so just over 500 pounds total. you have another 75 pound allowance for arms and cartridges.....tools, brushes, and single malt glasses.

Excellent !!!

Here is what Tim said about LFS. I am fine with 1Hz....

I believe there wouldn’t be an issue integrating the LFS into the frame, but it’s something we’d have to verify with our technical support team whom are out of the at the moment. The LFS further improves not just the isolation to 0.5 Hz but offers significant improvement across all low frequencies achieving 90% noise reduction at 2 Hz versus 5.5 Hz for the AVI without the LFS and 99% reduction at 5 Hz versus 10 Hz without the LFS. The LFS is typically ordered for some of the most sensitive instruments we’ve supported to simply have industry leading active isolation as insurance, or for customers that have unavoidable noise issues such as when their lab is located on a higher floor in a building. When these types of frequencies are a concern for an instrument there’s almost always vibration data taken by utilizing very sensitive sensors that is compared with established allowable noise specifications that is provided by the manufacturer of the instrument to achieve an ideal image.



Taking all of that into consideration it’s extremely difficult to say if you would see a noticeable improvement, as we are typically comparing data when we recommend an LFS or a customer simply wants insurance to ensure their instrument is operating at peak functionality at all times. Without a doubt the system would perform better from 0.5-50 Hz. There would be some additional wiring required, the sensor box itself, and a power supply as well which I would recommend you take into consideration. I’ve attached the data sheet for the LFS which offers a comparison of the AVI with and without the LFS.



With that said the LFS is used in labs at NIST, labs where gravitational wave research is being performed, and many others where we’ve consistently been told it’s the best performing system they have used in terms of eliminating vibration noise. The price of the LFS is $6,495 but I’d imagine there would be some extra cost to implement it into the workstation similar to what was outlined for integrating the AVI in my previous email.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Can we get back to this subjective tuning of the AS2000 belt please.
So, we can have perfect accurate speed with any number of alternative belt tensions?
Different tensions are not there to control speed, but just to alter flavour of the sound produced?
Is this the case on many other high mass belt designs like Da Vinci, Peter Walker tts etc?
Gosh, owners will be entering a whole world of subjective adjustability.

 

[rockitman]

well it's official.... Herzan NDW-23 active isolation worktable ordered today. I added an internal 20"wx18"d shelf to support a phonostage, etc for an upcharge. Should be here in time for the expected Nov, early Dec arrival of the AS-2000. The plan is coming together.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Congrats Christian.
As plans go, that's what I call a PLAN!
I was unsure whether to add an "!"
So I did anyway for good measure

 

[Mike Lavigne]

well it's official.... Herzan NDW-23 active isolation worktable ordered today. I added an internal 20"wx18"d shelf to support a phonostage, etc for an upcharge. Should be here in time for the expected Nov, early Dec arrival of the AS-2000. The plan is coming together.

congrats Christian.

love any details on the shelf if you have them. PM me if you prefer.

 

[rockitman]

congrats Christian.

love any details on the shelf if you have them. PM me if you prefer.

I gave them the requirements...width, depth and height clearance (12" in my case). They have not drawn it up in the schematic as of yet...when I get it for final approval I will post it.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Christian, is the stand you are ordering 2 inch square box legs? (I am still working on my 3 inch square box leg stand design.)

Is there an ability to fill the legs up with sand or steel shot? (I have enquired about that, and Mike mentioned that he did too.)

 

[rockitman]

Christian, is the stand you are ordering 2 inch square box legs? (I am still working on my 3 inch square box leg stand design.)

Is there an ability to fill the legs up with sand or steel shot? (I have enquired about that, and Mike mentioned that he did too.)

here is more information on the Nano-Damp workstations..no sand needed. I will have to ask if the box tube is 2", 3" or a combination of the two...The important thing is that it supports up to 660lbs. The entire workstation w/o TT weighs 240lbs.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

here is more information on the Nano-Damp workstations..no sand needed. I will have to ask if the box tube is 2", 3" or a combination of the two...The important thing is that it supports up to 660lbs. The entire workstation w/o TT weighs 240lbs.

thank you. the Active Nanodamp Workstation Installation Procedure Guide fills in quite a few gaps in understanding.

agree we don't need to change the engineering of the stand. it's designed for what we are doing. I might still do the sand thing, or not. I get to go to school on you in any case.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Thank you, Christian.

I am still trying to go figure out whether I want to go with the NDW-23 Active or have the stand for the AS match the other two custom stands I am planning to order. I still like the idea of the AS stand matching the other two stands, and not getting any isolation platform initially for the AS, but having the AS stand able to accomodate an active isolation platform if I want to add one in the future.

Tim is sending me a color sample book of automotive paint colors which Herzan can have an outside vendor use to powder coat the stands.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Mike - Since the LFS is not suitable for our application on the NDW-23A are you still certain that the TS-300 is the wrong way to go?

I still am considering the TS-300 because the stand for it can match my other stands and I could buy the TS-300 in the future and just drop it in if I wanted to experiment in the future wih active isolation.

Why is active leveling of no use to us with the AS turntable?