The Genesis Prime - Dragon Edition

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
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www.genesisloudspeakers.com
The Genesis Prime - Dragon Edition: Launch Party

As a matter of course, we always run-in all of our products before shipping them out. This is because like a fine wine, the initial aging can be quite a roller-coaster ride. They may sound fabulous right off the production line, but then go down and dumb for a while, before coming back up. There can be periods of goosebump-inducing thrill, but then those are mixed with dumb and dumber. So, we do try to get the speakers far enough down the run-in cycle so that the new customer doesn't get buyer's remorse during one of the dumbest period.

The Genesis Prime is the latest iteration of our largest system - the G1. With twenty-four 12-inch servo-controlled woofers, 56 ring radiator ribbon tweeters, two 75-inch (not a typo) ribbon midrange and an included twelve channels of Servo-Controlled Bass amplification, it is very large and complex, and does take a long time to run-in. The cycle is not only long, it has big ups and downs.

Because of the huge size of the system, it takes at least a couple of days to set-up for running-in. Since it takes so much effort anyway, we organize a party around the running-in when we have the time and resources.

With this new pair, we do have the time, so, we have the launch of the new Genesis Prime at the Genesis premises Friday, July 8th 5:00pm till late. I would like to extend an invitation to my WBF friends, their friends and family to the party. I promise great music and good food. If you can't make it on Friday, the Pacific Northwest Audio Society will be having their Summer Social the next day with the Dragons. Saturday, July 9th 4:00pm till late. You are welcome on one or both days!

RSVPs on this thread please.

Dragons Wallpaper 1366x768.jpg
 
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treitz3

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Stunning, Gary! You make me wish I lived out there, truth be told. The last time I heard a pair like these was well over 25 years ago.....I'd love to hear what you have done to them since then. They were gracious yet powerful, precise and delicate yet forceful enough to take extreme notice. One of the better systems I have ever heard. This, coming from a guy who "typically" does not like ribbons. Go figure. Very nice of you to open the doors for those who are out that way. For that, I tip my hat to you sir.

Tom
 

audioguy

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Apr 21, 2010
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Just lock me in that room for a decade or so. Simply stunning. I remember many, many moons ago when a customer of mine had an early relative of those speakers set up in an unfinished basement - hard concrete floors, studded [but not dry-walled] walls ... so the speakers saw a HUGE space. We placed some absorptive rugs in front of the speakers and used digital room correction (SigTech) to try and deal with some of the many anomalies in the space. Without a doubt, that was the most realistic presentation of audio I had ever heard. Uncanny. If I recall correctly, the uncovered ceiling rafters acted as diffusors and, other than the floor, the closest side-wall reflective surface was probably 15 to 20 feet away. Those speakers (and I imagine this new model) really loved huge spaces.

Gary: Great looking and I am sure, superb sounding, speaker.
 

bonzo75

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Just wow
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
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www.genesisloudspeakers.com
Kudos Gary

It looks like the Dragon but can you tell us what the differences are

Actually, that's a picture of the Dragons in Hong Kong. The Prime has quite a few improvements based on my development over the past 2 years. A better constrained-layer damping composite material for both the wings and the woofer tower cabinets eliminate what's residual of the vibration in the structure. The midrange ribbon is much better than the one manufactured by the old B&G, eliminating a bit of distortion at 7.5kHz; has much better power handling, and the coefficient of restitution of the new film is much better than the old Mylar film used by B&G. The servo-control amps use the 3rd generation of my DPDS (dynamic power delivery supply) using a Pythagorean progression on the time constants instead of a Fibonacci progression. So, visually there is little difference.
 

amirm

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Seattle, WA
That's quite neat Gary! Hoping to leave in a couple of hours for my 80 mile trek to your place....
 

audioguy

WBF Founding Member
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Near Atlanta, GA but not too near!
Until you hear Paul Sawtelle start to play, the system sounds incredible. After he starts to play, the system still sounds incredible but not close to live. As I stated previously, I heard a much earlier incarnation of those speakers and they are up near the very top of systems I have heard. There is still something about live that recorded/reproduced can't capture.

That said, I would love to hear that system (or own it if I had the space and the $$)!
 

Mike Lavigne

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I was there last night for 90 minutes.

no doubt the live Sax did apparently point out the difference between reproduced and live music. however; after Mr. Sawtelle played his last cut one of the local audio club members asked him to step back and play between the speakers instead of 10 feet in front of them. this made things much more cohesive and his playing was considerably more 'of a piece' with the sound coming from the Genesis Prime system. I'm also guessing that Mr. Sawtelle's playing was naturally adjusted more to blend standing between the speakers. in any case that was much more real to my ears.

my opinion after hearing that was the proximity of Mr. Sawtelle for the video compared to the plane of the speakers accounted for much of the difference in suspension of disbelief.

I was impressed by how good a 'far from sorted out and mature' system sounded in a warehouse.

very nice Gary!!

and thank you for the good eats.....the BBQ was very yummy.
 
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NorthStar

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Feb 8, 2011
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Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
Local musician, Paul Sawtelle visited Genesis last night and played together with the Genesis Primes.

Here's he covers Alan Parsons - from his alum Virtual Insanity.


This was a cool video...ear opening. :cool:

* And I agree with Mike's above comment; the fact that the live saxophonist was ten feet closer to the audience than the speakers had him @ a great sound advantage. No wonder that he had so much more "live" presence (his saxophone sound).
I would have loved to be there when he was @ the same plane as the speakers, for a much fairer evaluation between reproduced and live sound.
 
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LL21

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Great video!!! That was a lot of fun to watch, and its a 'test' of sorts that many of us think about doing. Gary's speakers (only heard an older generation) are uniquely expansive and effortless in my own experience.
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
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Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
We did this not to show how "live" the loudspeakers were, but to give a rare opportunity for the audience of music lovers to experience how incredibly rich and textured a live un-mic'ed and un-amplified saxophone can sound. There is no way to capture the richness of many musical instruments on to a recording.

With the saxophone, this is doubly difficult. Most recordings - and also most live performances - amplifier the saxophone with a little mic clipped to the bell of the saxophone. This is only one (albeit the major) emitter of sound with this instrument. However, the entire saxophone vibrates, and emits sound through out the body of the instrument. There are other tone holes on the saxophone that make sound. The mouthpiece and reed also vibrate, and up close, you can hear that. In addition, there is the sound of the lips of the performer around the reed, his throat, his cheeks, even his hands holding the instrument. With recordings and a live performance, you are mostly hearing the sound from the bell. A lot of richness is lost.

Standing closer to the audience than the speakers allowed the audience to experience the saxophone (and the incredible artistry of Mr Sawtelle).

Here's a video with the saxophonist standing in-between the speakers at the request of a couple of audiophiles in the audience.

 

LL21

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Dec 26, 2010
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Gary, I still say the fact that your speakers can play a respectable 'backup' to a live saxaphonist is still a testament to how good your speakers really are. With most any other speaker, this would not have worked at all (certainly not anywhere as well).
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,549
158
540
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
I was there last night for 90 minutes.

no doubt the live Sax did apparently point out the difference between reproduced and live music. however; after Mr. Sawtelle played his last cut one of the local audio club members asked him to step back and play between the speakers instead of 10 feet in front of them. this made things much more cohesive and his playing was considerably more 'of a piece' with the sound coming from the Genesis Prime system. I'm also guessing that Mr. Sawtelle's playing was naturally adjusted more to blend standing between the speakers. in any case that was much more real to my ears.

my opinion after hearing that was the proximity of Mr. Sawtelle for the video compared to the plane of the speakers accounted for much of the difference in suspension of disbelief.

I was impressed by how good a 'far from sorted out and mature' system sounded in a warehouse.

very nice Gary!!

and thank you for the good eats.....the BBQ was very yummy.

Thank you Mike. I was glad that you could make it. The system sounded very much better the next day at the PNWAS meeting. It was unfortunate that various delays culminated in the system literally being screwed together only the day before the party.
 

NorthStar

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Feb 8, 2011
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Here's a video with the saxophonist standing in-between the speakers at the request of a couple of audiophiles in the audience.


Mike was right; don't look @ the video, just listen to the music. But still the sax is much more vibrant and true; the instruments from the speakers are not distinct and clear as the sax. Listen to the drums and electric piano...if they would be live with the sax the experience would be much more complete. And add the acoustic bass.

Thanks Gary for posting it; it's good for our music evolution with educative involvement.

Live music is the real deal. No matter the intensity level of how we can fool ourselves with the illusion of music reproduction, nothing is going to take away "being there" with great live music in a great acoustic space. ...Being in a great jazz club, alive blues alley or classical concert hall with the full orchestra and opera singers.

It's all fun anyway...the pursuit of music happiness. :b
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,549
158
540
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
Here's where the Genesis Prime #001 got installed - a room in Malaysia.

The customer's primary source is analog - the TechDas Air Force One + Gryphon Legato. Digital sources are the Gryphon Mikado (as transport) and Genesis Muse (as streaming source) into the CH Precision C1. Preamplifier is the Gryphon Pandora and Power amplifier the Gryphon Mephisto. Cables are at the moment a mix of Gryphon and Genesis Absolute Fidelity.

Prime.jpg

The customer is an enthusiast of Chinese Tea as well as an enthusiast of music - hence the tea table and tea implements in the foreground. He made me several spectacular pots of tea while I was there!!!
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
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Beautiful Gary! Congrats! How big exactly is that room? it seems like perhaps 18 feet wide and 11 foot ceilings? How deep is the room? This is surely a special version of the Genesis, hence the name and number.

Do you have any thoughts on a 'komodo dragon' (vs this Genesis 'Dragon'...which would be a similar all-out (4-speaker?) system but perhaps smaller in dimensions?
 

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