The Black Hole Spatial Computer

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
6,455
29
405
Hi

I am of the opinion That the single largest determinant to music reproduction in our home is the Room itself. Treating a room is not simple and seem to require in most instances the help of a professional. Audiophiles take deep pride in doing this side of the equation themselves, with too often variables and sub-optimum results . We revere in swapping/shurning equipments and cable and leave the room to the vagaries of our whim and often convenience.

This product puport to help solve many problems in the bass. has anyone heard about it or experienced it? Read about it in AVS Forum

SPATIAL COMPUTER: BLACK HOLE
 

audioguy

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
2,794
73
1,635
Near Atlanta, GA but not too near!
I have not heard of that specific product but I have heard of other similar ones.

They make a comment in the description that you only need one of these on the back wall. What about side wall issues or floor/ceiling issues? I have (had) a 15 db null caused from the floor/ceiling bounce that one of these on the back wall would not have addressed.

One of the back wall, a side wall and ceiling might make sense.

For me, a much better way to solve bass response issues is utilizing well placed multiple subs. For those who use full range speakers with no separate sub(s) for two channel, and if this really works, this might be a nifty idea.
 

Peter Breuninger

[Industry Expert] Member Sponsor
Jul 20, 2010
1,231
4
0
Products like these have great merit. I like the one with the active woofer with the out of phase pulse. Very intriguing. Bass management... the final frontier.
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
6,455
29
405
Hi

I have no idea and would have liked someone with some experience with it to chime in. The idea seems a first sight, good. I suppose the signal must be routed to it
 

AudioExplorations

New Member
Apr 5, 2012
653
5
0
I assume you have read the 6moons review?

“My personal experience with the Black Hole thus only warrants a very conditional recommendation. That’s based on projecting my ‘off-site’ results to more conventional layouts. While I couldn’t make the anti-sub work in the listening seat, it worked well in the kitchen, bathroom and at the work desk. I’m thus convinced that the Black Hole would have worked wonders in my earlier space above. But even then I doubt it should be considered a complete acoustic treatment solution. It’s less a bass linearizer and more a partial depressurizer. That’s admirable and useful but doesn’t skin the whole cat. For the full meow you’d also want passive treatments or surgical DSP-based correction.”
 

catastrofe

Member
Feb 17, 2012
106
0
16
Saint Louis
This unit works in isolation...no signal is routed to it. A microphone is attached to the sub, and an internal generator is used to produce the "equalizing" signal. Of course, that's an oversimplification.

I don't put much stock in the 6Moons review as they didn't place the unit in an ideal location....rear corner where side and rear walls meet. The reviewer's placement was lacking a rear wall...a major issue IMHO.
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
6,455
29
405
Hi

I would agree with Dallasjustice last post... The 6-moon review and the product seemed both half-baked
 

Bill Hart

Well-Known Member
May 11, 2012
2,683
174
1,150
I assume you have read the 6moons review?

“My personal experience with the Black Hole thus only warrants a very conditional recommendation. That’s based on projecting my ‘off-site’ results to more conventional layouts. While I couldn’t make the anti-sub work in the listening seat, it worked well in the kitchen, bathroom and at the work desk. I’m thus convinced that the Black Hole would have worked wonders in my earlier space above. But even then I doubt it should be considered a complete acoustic treatment solution. It’s less a bass linearizer and more a partial depressurizer. That’s admirable and useful but doesn’t skin the whole cat. For the full meow you’d also want passive treatments or surgical DSP-based correction.”
I've been looking for bass management for my bathroom. Perfect!
 

JonFo

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2010
322
1
925
Big Canoe, GA
www.jonathanfoulkes.com
Active cancellation is a valid path to improving room modes in the bass, but not the whole answer, merely one of many options.

I'd want a system that also integrated some of the original signal (non-acoustic input) in the algorithm to ensure one getting as close an approximation of the original as possible.

Another method of actively 'changing' your rooms acoustic signature is to explore the Double Bass Array Concept (described in detail in this thread here at WBF). Note that DBA only works in rectangular closed rooms.
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,605
5,413
1,278
E. England
Hi everyone, just caught this thread. I've been running a Black Hole for 3 yrs now. That was initially when my main spkrs were Zu Definitions 2, and prev to the BH, I could never fully integrate bass into my room, the 8 x 10" rear firing woofers of the 2s always overpowering the acoustic.
On installing the BH, there was a really impressive linearising of the bass response. Clayton Shaw of Spatial predicted I had a node at 27.1Hz in my room, and the BH has seemed to counter this.
The amazing thing is that dealing with the bass issue has had an across the board improvement in my room - mid range is decluttered, and treble extends further. A general opening up in soundstage. This has NOT been subtle, removing the BH causes the old faults to reappear. The great thing is that it doesn't alter the basic nature of my system which I love, just enhances it's true potential. My room is 8000 cubic feet, which would support 2x BHs, and I'll be buying another in due course.
And it's sold on a trial return basis, so if you don't get on with it, you can get your cash back. A real no-brainer in my room. As usual , YMMV.
 

Kal Rubinson

Well-Known Member
May 4, 2010
2,360
697
1,700
NYC
www.stereophile.com
Products like these have great merit. I like the one with the active woofer with the out of phase pulse. Very intriguing. Bass management... the final frontier.

At least, they are likely to affect the bass.
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,605
5,413
1,278
E. England
Regarding removing the rear wall, my guess is this is an analogy to a space with no nodes. The moment you have walls ie a room in the real world, nodes get introduced.
Best c$1k I've spent in my system, equivalent to a whole cable loom at 5x the price. Aiming for a second over time.
And no need to festoon my room with unwieldy traps and panels etc.
 

VPN

VIP/Donor
Dec 28, 2013
353
163
318
Doesn't the Bagend E-trap do the same thing? This looks interesting but not a total solution.

I looks like a more advanced E-trap (I have an E-trap):
(i) The E-trap can only take care of two frequencies, selected from 20hz to 65hz. The black hole seems to operate in many frequencies simultaneously.
(ii) The Black Hole probably has a more potent amplifier, but it is unclear.

The good thing about this approach vs. DSP is that it helps when you are using a turntable. The DSP (Acourate, Dirac, etc) only works with digital (unless you are willing to AD your phono preamp output).

I may try a Black Hole S.C. one day.

Cheers,

VPN
 
Last edited:

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,605
5,413
1,278
E. England
VPN, the Black Hole still proves it's worth despite a slew of other changes. After 6 years trial and error I'm getting a fully extended bass response in my room, while minimising bloat. I haven't measured anything, this is purely a subjective reaction. I have changed to 8kVA Westwick balanced power, Entreq grounding, Sablon cable loom incl PCs, Elrog 845s in my Audion SETs, and the Black Hole remains an important part of the mix, soon to be joined by a second unit.
 

VPN

VIP/Donor
Dec 28, 2013
353
163
318
VPN, the Black Hole still proves it's worth despite a slew of other changes. After 6 years trial and error I'm getting a fully extended bass response in my room, while minimising bloat. I haven't measured anything, this is purely a subjective reaction. I have changed to 8kVA Westwick balanced power, Entreq grounding, Sablon cable loom incl PCs, Elrog 845s in my Audion SETs, and the Black Hole remains an important part of the mix, soon to be joined by a second unit.

Spirit,

With my bag end etrap, I measured with REW, waterfall graphs, and it does reduce room modes substantially in the two selected frequencies, but it aftects negatively some other frequencies. This is in my system and my musical preference only.

How is it with the Black Hole? Any negative effect, or only positive?

Thanks,

Vpn
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,605
5,413
1,278
E. England
In reality, the positive effects of the Black Hole were more noticeable when I struggled to integrate the bass of my old Zu Def2 spkrs. Since I've acquired the new Zu Def4s, bass is better managed w/onboard sub x'over controls, but I still get that extra 10% from the Spatial unit re smoother bass integration. No negatives.
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing