Supporting "Genesis" Loudspeakers

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,431
23
38
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#1
As far as we can, we have been trying to keep customers of older Genesis loudspeakers going. Many of our owners have had their loudspeakers for 15 years or more. This sub-forum is intended to support all our customers - old and new. Great loudspeakers do not just die, they fade away, but they can also be injected with new life!

First, a bit of history.....

A previous company, Genesis Physics also made loudspeakers under the "Genesis" brand. They made high-quality, low-cost loudspeakers from 1975 to 1987. However, that company is totally unassociated with the current Genesis Advanced Technologies. However, parts may be available from www.humanspeakers.com.

Genesis Technologies was the previous company. They made loudspeakers in California, and then in Colorado from 1991 to 2000. They closed down during the stock market crash and were foreclosed by a bank. Genesis Advanced Technologies bought the assets, trademarks and intellectual property from the bank in 2002. Unfortunately, in the 1+ years that the company was closed, the bank managed to lose most of the assets and intellectual property. They even managed to let the trademark registration expire! However, we have tried as far as possible to recreate some of the old technology, and we do try to support the customers of the old company - as far as we can.

Genesis Advanced Technologies was founded in 2002 to carry on the brand, but unfortunately we have had to re-create a lot of the original technology. We also took the opportunity to improve upon the legacy started by Arnie Nudell with the Infinity Servo-Statik 1 in 1968. A lot of the new technology can be retro-fitted to the original designs (but we cannot do anything with Infinity loudspeakers - so please don't ask), but unfortunately we cannot roll-back prices to the 90's. We have also re-manufactured some drivers if plans/specifications are available.

So, if you own a pair of old Genesis loudspeakers, and you do not find a support answer here, post a question and I will try to answer as soon as I can.
 

MylesBAstor

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,222
4
38
#2
As far as we can, we have been trying to keep customers of older Genesis loudspeakers going. Many of our owners have had their loudspeakers for 15 years or more. This sub-forum is intended to support all our customers - old and new. Great loudspeakers do not just die, they fade away, but they can also be injected with new life!

First, a bit of history.....

A previous company, Genesis Physics also made loudspeakers under the "Genesis" brand. They made high-quality, low-cost loudspeakers from 1975 to 1987. However, that company is totally unassociated with the current Genesis Advanced Technologies. However, parts may be available from www.humanspeakers.com.

Genesis Technologies was the previous company. They made loudspeakers in California, and then in Colorado from 1991 to 2000. They closed down during the stock market crash and were foreclosed by a bank. Genesis Advanced Technologies bought the assets, trademarks and intellectual property from the bank in 2002. Unfortunately, in the 1+ years that the company was closed, the bank managed to lose most of the assets and intellectual property. They even managed to let the trademark registration expire! However, we have tried as far as possible to recreate some of the old technology, and we do try to support the customers of the old company - as far as we can.

Genesis Advanced Technologies was founded in 2002 to carry on the brand, but unfortunately we have had to re-create a lot of the original technology. We also took the opportunity to improve upon the legacy started by Arnie Nudell with the Infinity Servo-Statik 1 in 1968. A lot of the new technology can be retro-fitted to the original designs (but we cannot do anything with Infinity loudspeakers - so please don't ask), but unfortunately we cannot roll-back prices to the 90's. We have also re-manufactured some drivers if plans/specifications are available.

So, if you own a pair of old Genesis loudspeakers, and you do not find a support answer here, post a question and I will try to answer as soon as I can.
Bully for you Gary! Genesis and Infinity are intimately associated with the history of high-end audio! My friend still has his RS1bs :)
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,431
23
38
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#3
Bully for you Gary! Genesis and Infinity are intimately associated with the history of high-end audio! My friend still has his RS1bs :)
Thanks, Myles. I wish I could support the big Infinity speakers, but I can't. Some of these 30 year old speakers still sound wonderful and would run rings around some of the current offerings.
 

Peter Breuninger

[Industry Expert] Member Sponsor
Jul 20, 2010
1,231
0
0
#4
Miller Sound has limited support for the IRS's and there is a guy in KY (I think he's a DR. and super Infinity fan and hobbyist) who sells and supports them on ebay. I remember my last listening session on IRS Vs at Millers Sound... it was wonderful. I was an RBIIb owner and wished I had Ibs. The Ib guys would tell me they wished they had IIbs. The grass is always greener :)
 
Aug 16, 2013
1
0
0
#5
Thank you Gary...for your commitment to support discontinued models and your appreciation for the passion music lovers like myself have for vintage but wonderful gear. With many of the smaller audio companies out of business or offer little to no support at all...it's encouraging to see that companies like Genesis, PS Audio, and others seem to really care.

The reason that I'm here is because I took a chance and bought a pair of APM-1's that I believed had bad amplifiers. I figured that it was practically a no-brainer since the price was right and I wouldn't need to put them into use immediately. I've been researching extensively for a solution that is practical. I understand that Cullen Circuits would repair the amps at a fair price when they were still in business and (trustworthy) local electronics repair shops won't touch them without a diagram. I spoke to a shop that is out of state specializing in amp repairs for subwoofers and pro-audio but they would want to see the amp before determining if they can do it or offer an actual price quote. I heard about an APM-1 owner that replaced the amps with DIY subwoofer amps and obtained good results but since I've never heard the speakers function properly I'm a bit weary of upsetting the frequency or sonic performance of the speakers. I'm obviously looking for the most economical solution possible since I'm audioholic and still need to support my family first.

Thanks again.
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,431
23
38
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#7
Welcome to WBF, and I appreciate your bravery!!

We did not continue making the APM-1 because the bank had lost all the schematics to that model, and we were unable to repair the amplifier. Unfortunately, many failed. We have a replacement amplifier, but that comes from the Genesis 5.3 (modified to work with the APM-1's single 15-inch woofer) but that is expensive as it's 2013 prices and not 1997 prices. Rhymik Audio makes a range of subwoofer amplifiers that are far cheaper, and we've heard that they work "good enough" but I have not tried them myself. However, as their servo design is quite different from ours, you will also have to replace the woofer.

Good luck! And don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions.
 

Odysseus

New Member
Jun 3, 2012
24
0
0
San Antonio, TX
#8
Genesis 350SE crossovers

Hi Gary,

I have a set of Genesis 350SE built possibly around the year 2000. I've noticed that the high frequencies are not as bright as they used to be. All 15 tweeters work and I've played with the two knobs on the back but still nothing. Do you think it could be some crossover component that's causing the problem? I wouldn't think the capacitors would go out in 13 years (but I don't know) If so, is there one capacitor that handles the tweeters that I could replace? (The mids sound beautifully!)

By the way, I've connected other speakers to the same system, same amp, cables, etc, and it sounds fine, so I'm guessing it's the speakers.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Ulises.
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,431
23
38
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#9
The only crossover component that might deteriorate would be the big 220uF 400V non-polar electrolytic that protects the midrange from lower frequencies. The tweeter circuit is just a high-pass and uses very high quality film-and-foil capacitors that won't deteriorate for the next 200 years or so.

If I were to suspect any component, since the speakers would be 13 years old now, might be the tweeters deteriorating resulting in lower efficiency: magnetic flux loss due to aging - especially if it's very hot in San Antonio; diaphragm de-laminating or corrosion due to ozone, cigarette smoke, etc. Another possibility is that some of the tweeters aren't working.
 

Odysseus

New Member
Jun 3, 2012
24
0
0
San Antonio, TX
#10
Hi Gary,
Thanks for your super fast response!! Well, after you told me that it was unlikely that the crossovers were the culprit, I went back and started playing with it again. Since I was trying to get more treble, I had turned the rear tweeter control all the way clock-wise, based on what I had read in the setup instructions: "The left hand knob is a volume control for the rear tweeters. Turning this control clockwise will increase the level of the rear tweeters. Use this control if you need a bit more treble or to increase the apparent space of the soundstage." So I had turned them all the way clock-wise. Then while sitting in my listening position, I asked my son to turn it all the way counter-clock-wise and WOW! My high frequency came back!! But, that's the opposite of what the manual said. I did notice that the volume of the rear tweeters do increase by turning it clock-wise, but at the same time, it reduces -significantly- the volume of the front tweeters, which I wasn't expecting. Would you know if it's supposed to do that?
I'll play with it a little more to try to find a balance, right now I'm happy with the front tweeters, but I'm missing the spacious soundstage that the rear tweeters provide.

Thanks for your help!

Ulises.
PS. It does get very hot in San Antonio, but inside the house is usually 76-80 degrees. If you're ever in San Antonio (or Austin, Houston) let me know, I'd love to buy you dinner and have a nice conversation.
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,431
23
38
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#11
Ulises, sorry for the late response. I missed this when I was traveling.

When you turn the rear tweeters up and the total high frequency goes down, I would look elsewhere for the problem. Turning the rear tweeters down would raise the high frequency impedance. If you are using a tube amp that can't drive both the rear and front tweeters in parallel, turning the rear tweeters all the way up might have resulted in the loss of high frequency signal you first mentioned.


.s. I would love to come visit next time I am in San Antonio.
 

Odysseus

New Member
Jun 3, 2012
24
0
0
San Antonio, TX
#12
Hi Gary,

Thanks for the advice, let me ask you another question: would this happen even if I'm not pushing the amplifier? I notice this issue even if I'm listening at low levels (not louder than a normal conversation)

I'll connect them to a more powerful tube amp, to see if that's the problem. Right now they're being driven by a cool Raven Audio integrated with 50 wpc.

Raven_SHADOW_AMPLIFIER_01.jpg
 
Jul 11, 2014
2
0
0
Longmeadoow MA
#14
Genesis Genre 1's in need of some love...

Good evening... first post here! I have a much loved pair of Genesis Genre 1's, getting on in years, purchased from Audio Advisor somewhere in 1994. They have been great, although per the advice of one of the Genesis tech's, I sent the midranges and woofers out to be reformed due to dried up glue. Nothing lasts forever, right? That was somewhere around 2005, and they have been pretty darn good. However (there's always a but, right?) they have sounded a bit off recently, a symptom that can best be described as "nasally". It seems to have been getting worse, although all of my friends think I am nuts. Tonight, I arrived home from work, very excited to toss in a new CD from Amazon, and the system sounds REALLY off... the right channel has no highs, and the midrange seems a bit muffled. I suspect the tweeter is cooked, and perhaps being part of the same circuit as the midrange crossover, has affected the output of the midrange. Where would you begin? I suppose I could swap the tweeters, and see if the problem swaps from right to left, or if something in the crossover is cooked. I am sad, kind of like when you favorite old shoes give up the ghost. I honestly think the loudspeakers are worth being repaired, any thoughts?
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,431
23
38
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#15
Mark, it does sound like the tweeter is cooked. That could account for it having no highs and the midrange muffled. Your instincts are correct, swap the tweeters and see if the problem swaps. Easier is to remover the right tweeter and measure with a digital multimeter. It should measure about 4 ohms. If it's an open circuit, then you've got a dead tweeter.
 

carolkoh

[Industry Expert] Member Sponsor
Sep 17, 2010
761
13
18
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#16
Ahh, the Genre 1 - lovely speakers. Very musical. I will check service stock to see if we still have any of those old spec tweeters. I don't remember if they are single or double magnet in the Genre 1 though. Let me know when you pull it out?
 

tbird1950

New Member
Oct 17, 2014
1
0
0
#17
Gary, I have a pair of Genesis 350's, with the outboard amplifier. I am wondering if the midrange panels (the whole panel is removable) are able to be rebuilt?
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,431
23
38
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#18
Hi tbird,
If you have the original G350 - with the 3 tweeters and the Carver ribbon, the midrange as far as I know cannot be rebuilt. I keep hearing rumours of someone doing that as a service, but so far no one has come back to report success. Unfortunately, with the 3-tweeter models, I also don't have a drop-in crossover to update it with the new components from the G2Jr (unlike with the G-II or the G350SE).

I know that there are some who have repaired it using the standard B&G midrange they buy off the Internet. But neither that midrange nor the special Genesis version are ideal. I'm sorry, but for the G350, I don't have a good solution if you blow the midrange.
 

bence

New Member
Dec 29, 2014
2
0
0
Budapest, Hungary
#19
Hi Gary,

I would need some assistance with the servicing of my Servo 12 amplifier from 1991 (back-attached version with transformer in a separate box) and I was hoping to be at the right place for this after searching for Genesis tech for a while now on the internet. Looks like I already found the issue (mute supply line) on the pre-amp PCB but I'd like clarify a few things to finish this nicely. First of all, doing this without a service manual/schematic is not easy and it would be invaluable if you could provide a copy to me for a better understanding of the circuit and for future use. I'm particulary interested in the following things:
- carrying out proper adjustment of trimpots (e.g. P4 trimpot)
- checking the accelerometer of the woofer driver. It's unclear to me if the accelerometer is simply a secondary coil and thus a conduction/resistance can be measured over it or the accelerometer is implemented using a different solution (not a coil). in other words, is it possible the check the integrity of the accelerometer using a meter?
- how the amplifier would work in case of the accelerometer gets broken in the driver? Does it continue to play/work without servo functionalities the same way or is it not going to play sound at all? This could also answer my previous question regards to accelerometer in the woofer.

Any information you might have on these would be very helpful.

Thanks and have a nice holiday season,
Bence
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
5,431
23
38
Seattle, WA
www.genesisloudspeakers.com
#20
Hi Gary,

I would need some assistance with the servicing of my Servo 12 amplifier from 1991 (back-attached version with transformer in a separate box) and I was hoping to be at the right place for this after searching for Genesis tech for a while now on the internet. Looks like I already found the issue (mute supply line) on the pre-amp PCB but I'd like clarify a few things to finish this nicely. First of all, doing this without a service manual/schematic is not easy and it would be invaluable if you could provide a copy to me for a better understanding of the circuit and for future use.
Hi Bence, unfortunately most of the schematics of the oldest models were lost by the bank during the time that the previous company was closed. This included the schematics of the Servo 12 amplifier, and we are unable to help as we do not have a copy of the schematics either.

I'm particulary interested in the following things:
- carrying out proper adjustment of trimpots (e.g. P4 trimpot)
I've never ever seen a Servo 12 amp, so I can't tell what trimpot does what. However, the old Genesis designs include a compression circuit and there are usually two trimpots: one adjusts sensitivity and the second adjusts the amount of compression.

- checking the accelerometer of the woofer driver. It's unclear to me if the accelerometer is simply a secondary coil and thus a conduction/resistance can be measured over it or the accelerometer is implemented using a different solution (not a coil). in other words, is it possible the check the integrity of the accelerometer using a meter?
The Genesis servo does not use a secondary coil, it uses an accelerometer. Except for physical damage (the accelerometer falling off was the most common mode of failure) we have not had an accelerometer fail. However, they do get less sensitive over time. Only way to test is to mount it on a test jig and measure the feedback.

- how the amplifier would work in case of the accelerometer gets broken in the driver? Does it continue to play/work without servo functionalities the same way or is it not going to play sound at all? This could also answer my previous question regards to accelerometer in the woofer.
If it has fallen off, the result is disastrous and is instantly recognizable. In order to determine if the feedback circuit is working, measure the frequency response from 22Hz to 90Hz - it should be flat to within +/- 0.5dB. If the feedback circuit is not working it could be up to +/- 18dB.

Any information you might have on these would be very helpful.

Thanks and have a nice holiday season,
Bence
Hope that helps.
 

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